Chinese clone engines, the good bad and the ugly

[BHD]

I refuse to buy the China clones

the problem I see is how does one get around it?

nearly ever manufacture in America is either having there stuff made in China or rebranding Chinese products, even Honda (which is not a US company) Honda Engines | Manufacturing Locations

Engines for the U.S. market are primarily sourced from the U.S., Japan, and Thailand

but does not mean they never use made in china engines,

power tools of the name brand tools few if any are made in the USA any more, (hand and power tools)

a number of years ago, I was working on a truck and needed a special puller, so I order a OTC, brand tool could have ordered it under a known china importers, but I wanted MADE IN USA, so I spent the extra money to support the AMERICAN WORKER AND COMPANY, what Did I get MADE IN CHINA, and since then I do not make and effor to buy USA, if the companies do not want to support US then I do not need to support them, (try to buy auto parts that are not Chinese made), yes I prefer US made items but I can not hardly find them.

WHY should I pay double for a US companies rebranding of a Chinese made item? or a Japanese company selling China and Thailand made engines to me for a premium price, because of there name is on them.

another story I wanted a good vice, (back when sears was still a store and had mail order), so I searched the craftsman catalog, and ordered a very good and expensive vice, expecting a US made tool, came and said made in Japan, (It has been a quality tool for the last 30 years, but it was NOT US made, was disappointed, when the normal was US made products for that company. but soon after that sears fell apart.

 

[muddstopper]

I agree, it very hard to find Made in the USA anything. And for what its worth, since this thread started 2 years ago, I did buy a predator engine from Harbor freight. It starts, it runs and is about all I can say on that subject. My "OLD" vise is a Wilton, made in the USA, found it in a trash pile. Cleaned it up and been using it for years. Hand tools in my tool box are a assortment of made everywhere. I stay away from the el-cheapo made in China, flea market tools, some things the quality is very evident on. Snapon is head quartered in my home town, and I have bought some things from them when they have a open house tool sale, but I seldom get to make it on sales day. Craftsman used to have a tool plant in KingsMnt NC. they made wrenches and sockets there. Plant closed shortly after NAFTA was signed. As the words of Ross Perot, the Great Sucking Sound as jobs and manufacturing started leaving the USA.

 

[SPIKER]

I...

Craftsman used to have a tool plant in KingsMnt NC. they made wrenches and sockets there. Plant closed shortly after NAFTA was signed. As the words of Ross Perot, the Great Sucking Sound as jobs and manufacturing started leaving the USA.

Yes that NAFTA was sure nice for the American Worker Clinton and Powers that bee touted how much it would HELP USA Jobs. They were right for scrap metal recyclers and Moving Companies who shipped the tooling and factories in whole sale moves into Mexico and elsewhere. I did some of the factory tear outs & packed Hundreds of tons of equipment onto semi trucks heading south.

Only 1 has ever came back that happens to be because they went to area where raw materials were sparse & transportation costs shot way up in the late 2000s Headstrome (walmart play ball manufacture) moved out of Ashland City in mid late 1990's and came back in late 2000's & is only one I know of in this area to "COME BACK!"


2 years ago Oblamo was pushing REALLY hard to pass the latest one a Pacific free trade agreement (China, Korea, Japan and basically every 3rd world country) with access to the Pacific Ocean is signing it as fast as they can pushing USA to do same. I have not heard much on it lately so hopefully it is DEAD.


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[muddstopper]

Nafta passed with bipartisan support, so I guess we cant blame it all on Clinton. Altho My wife was working at Levis when they shut the door and moved to Mexico, and than at another textile company that also made the move south. When you stop to think aout it, Nafta practicaly stopped the illegal immigration of South American. Why come here, jobs where becoming readily available in their countries. The big boner I blame Clinton for was giving China favorite trading status. As soon as that happened, jobs in south american quickly dried up as companies moved to China and the illegals started coming to America in droves looking for work.

 

[bigdeano]

I can tell you,"Viet Nam",where we lost 17,000 American soldier's to create a democracy,

A slight correction, we lost over 58,000 there. I knew some of them, I spent 1969 there. Ancient history now.

 

[300UGUY]

Nafta passed with bipartisan support, so I guess we cant blame it all on Clinton. Altho My wife was working at Levis when they shut the door and moved to Mexico, and than at another textile company that also made the move south. When you stop to think aout it, Nafta practicaly stopped the illegal immigration of South American. Why come here, jobs where becoming readily available in their countries. The big boner I blame Clinton for was giving China favorite trading status. As soon as that happened, jobs in south american quickly dried up as companies moved to China and the illegals started coming to America in droves looking for work.

NAFTA passed thru a Republican congress, it was actually negotiated in the term of Bush 1. It didn't pass until the republicans took control of congress in 1994. And Clinton signed it, so yeah, he is on the hook for that also.

 

[300UGUY]

One thing I find weird is the blame on American worker's wages and or work ethics for the loss of jobs. In every case I have seen, the wage differential between the US worker and the Asian, or Mexican worker hasn't been something you can bridge. A few local suppliers here went to Mexico because the wages there were only about $3, "all in". In one case in Michigan, a manufacturer of refrigerator compressors was paying $12 to $15 per hour. The state offered to build a new factory here, at no cost to the company, lease it to them for $1 per year, plus training money and other tax breaks. The company ( Electrolux ) declined. $3 per hour labor would pay for a new factory in a year or 2. Who can work for $3 per hour? How can you possibly compete with that? And bear in mind, the foreign governments are offering incentives and tax breaks also. So it isn't just wages. And the foreigner's have the same or better technology than we do. No home team advantage there.

 

[Rio_Grande]

All I know is when I went to replace my log splitter motor, a Briggs that served me for many years, I found that a direct replacement was going to cost so much I started looking at new splitters,,, well they are double the price as well. Bottom line for 140.00 I bought a chi Honda and now my family has wood for the winter. I don't care who made it. When the day comes that a Koehler or Briggs doesn't cost 4 days wages I will be happy to buy one again. For now,, well I have 3 of the chi Hondas floating around and they all run every time. I would love to buy everything made in the USA,, but I can't.

 

[stingray1]

The fact that Factory Honda parts are direct replacement for the chinese engines says one of 2 things. One either Honda has licensed their patents to the chinese manufacturers or China stole and is making illegal copies of the honda engines. All to often the copies are not legal copies and you have chinese companies making illegal copies, all with the chinese government backing and support, of other companies products. Ask BMW about the chinese knockoff that actual BMW parts will fit, fenders, doors, hoods, ect. Even after sueing the chinese car company, the Chinese courts rules that the autos where not anywhere alike and therefore there was no patent infringement. Why are the chinese parts so cheap, well for one the chinese companies dont have to spend any money on research, just buy and original and make a copy. Second, Clinton gave China favored trading status which allows China to import their product to the USA without haveing to pay any taxes or tariffs on those pruducts. All the while, try selling a American product to China, it will be hit with all kinds of special import fees that make it to expensive to compete with the illegal chinese made clones of the similar product. Chinese made products, a lot without proper product licenseing, are being sold in the Walmarts, Targets, Kmarts stores. So much so that Walmart sold chinese products contribute a full 10% of our entire trade deficit with China. Thats 10% thru just one company.

To me its not a matter of price or quality, its a matter of ethics. I cant control your ethical choices or buying decisions anymore than you can control mine. I can control mine and I choose to not support an economy that is destroying our own. And why would I want to buy 3 of something just to do what one quality product would do. Even the math doesnt support your decision, considering the price of three chinese goods is the same as the one quality goods, and then factor in the down time and expenses of haveing to change out the engines when each one goes bad. Not for me, I figure my time is worth something to.

Bingo,I'm with you brother.

 

[muddstopper]

Since 2000 we have lost over 60,000 factories in the US. Not just because of Nafta, but also Cafta, PNTR with China and now the current government is pushing for another free trade agreement called the Trans Pacific Partnership, TPP. The current agreements have already costed millions of American jobs. Why should we support any agreements that send jobs off shore, reduce out manufactering capacity and our ability to defend ourselfs. We show our support for such agreements when we choose to buy the products made offshore.