power steering and front loader

[azgoldust]

I am new to the forum and could use a lot of help.
I am adding both power steering and a front loader to my 8N
can I power both with one hydraulic pump.
I have no hydraulic know how.
all suggestions excepted.

 

[mddorange]

:welcome:
To the forum from Alabama.

 

[TimBuck2]

You should buy a power steering kit made for the 8N. The power steering will be powered by a pump mounted on the engine and driven with a fan belt. That pump will have it's own small oil reservoir. It will not be sufficient for a front loader.

The front loader could be run off of the 3pt hydraulic system, but it would be better (faster operation at least) to run it off it's own pump. That pump will be mounted on the FEL frame and driven by the crankshaft pully. It would be best to have an FEL frame that has an oil reservoir incorporated into one of the members. After market parts, made for the purpose, are available for both the power steering and FEL hydraulic system.

 

[RickB]

You can do it with one pump. The system should be of the open center style, and the circuit will require a priority flow divider which will direct whatever your power steering system requires in GPM to that system, then all excess flow will be directed to the loader control valve.

For example, your pump, tank and lines may be designed for 18-20 GPM. The flow divider would be selected to provide priority flow of 3 to 5 GPM to steering and excess flow would be 13 to 17 GPM to the loader valve. Your actual design and numbers may vary.

Alternatively, two dedicated systems can be installed.

 

[TimBuck2]

BTW you should realize going into this project that the front axle and axle support for an 8N is not strong enough for any thing but the lightest of loader work. Moving light materials or loose soil. Not for digging.

 

[azgoldust]

You can do it with one pump. The system should be of the open center style, and the circuit will require a priority flow divider which will direct whatever your power steering system requires in GPM to that system, then all excess flow will be directed to the loader control valve.

For example, your pump, tank and lines may be designed for 18-20 GPM. The flow divider would be selected to provide priority flow of 3 to 5 GPM to steering and excess flow would be 13 to 17 GPM to the loader valve. Your actual design and numbers may vary.

Alternatively, two dedicated systems can be installed.

Thanks you for the info.
the pump is a crankshaft driven concentric model 10566 3 gpm @ 1800 rpm
the cylinders are 1.5 dia. and I am planing to use 1/4" lines. with steel tube where necessary.

If the need arises I can build a straight front axle that will hold the weight.

 

[RickB]

3 GPM is a waste of time. Your loader will be sloooooooow.

 

[azgoldust]

3 GPM is a waste of time. Your loader will be sloooooooow.

I checked one of the cylinder speed calculators and this is what I found.
@ 3 GPM
cylinder bore 1.5 inch
stroke 12 inch
rod dia. 1.o inch
extend time 2 cylinders 3.6 seconds
retract time 2 cylinders 2.0 seconds

I am fabricating a rather compact low lift version front loader.
I will be using 12" stroke 1.5 bore boom cylinders
and 8" stroke 1.5 bore bucket cylinders.

I'm not reaching for the roof, just high enough to dump into a pickup truck.

 

[MossRoad]

If you're using 2 cylinders, your times will double.

If you're wanting to lift high enough to dump into a pickup truck, and using such short cylinders, you're probably going to have a very short lever, which is going to put a lot of stress on the structure, I'd think. So you'll have to beef it up, which will put more weight on it, which will diminish the lifting capacity, as well as add weight to the front of the tractor, so you'll have to beef up the front axle, plus add weight to the rear of the tractor....

Start looking at images of existing 8n front end loaders and you'll see they all have very long cylinders....
https://www.google.com/search?q=for...a=X&ei=DY_WVOSoGcTIsASCyoGQAg&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAg

 

[RickB]

If you're using 2 cylinders, your times will double.

If you're wanting to lift high enough to dump into a pickup truck, and using such short cylinders, you're probably going to have a very short lever, which is going to put a lot of stress on the structure, I'd think. So you'll have to beef it up, which will put more weight on it, which will diminish the lifting capacity, as well as add weight to the front of the tractor, so you'll have to beef up the front axle, plus add weight to the rear of the tractor....

Start looking at images of existing 8n front end loaders and you'll see they all have very long cylinders....
https://www.google.com/search?q=for...a=X&ei=DY_WVOSoGcTIsASCyoGQAg&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAg

+1. I hope all your calculations are correct, and you are designing what you need. Two 1.5" x 12" lift cylinders aren't going to lift very far, very much, or both.