CK35 HST Blowing Smoke after loud hard start

[raypope]

Hello,

I've generally been very happy with my 2008 CK35 and was going to make the final payment this month, but guess what?

Today after changing the oil at 620 hrs the engine would not turn over, it initially turned over a little maybe 15 degrees but stopped and the started just dropped out. Checked the battery and it was a little low, put on charge for a few hours. I did not notice anything out of the ordinary with the oil. I did not start it before changing the oil so that if there was water in it I could see it. The color was the normal black that you are used to seeing after 50 hours. I use Rotella with Lucas oil additive since day 1. Oil was at normal level with no additions needed between changes.

Restart attempt took several 'bumps' to get it to turn over and when it did, WOW loud metallic pinging and copious amount of white smoke. I thought the starter was going bad but restarts are fine but I can tell that something isn't 'right' now.

Tractor now is very hard mechanically to start but when started will run up to max with no issues. However there is a little tinge of whitesh blue smoke in the exhaust when at idle and if I drive it up hill without anything attached it will smoke (very prominent stream of smoke in exhaust) under load now.

If I remove the air filter and drive it, the smoke doesn't go away. The fuel filter is new as well, fuel is fresh summer blend.

Power seems to still be there idle seems to be normal in sound but there is a little 'ping' that I can't remember hearing.

When the unit was parked a couple of weeks ago all was well.

Someone please tell me that I haven't just trashed out my tractor with one payment left?

 

[murphy1244]

Check your coolant. Might be burning it.

 

[raypope]

Thanks for the reply.

The coolant is fine, that was my first thought. Looks like the day it was put in.

I think I may let it run for an hour tomorrow and see if the level changes. If so will replace the head gasket and bolts.

There are remotes in the rear they are in N.

The fuel is fresh and I use Lucas fuel additive in each tank.

One thing though, I went back out after it had cooled a little while and the thing smells like burned motor oil. Something is odd.

This unit has been solid in the mechanical area since I owned it.

 

[ritcheyvs]

Did you add oil through the valve cover or the fill port on the side of the engine? I have read that rapid oil filling through the valve cover opening can cause problems.
Something sounds wrong but do more tests before you pull the head or begin major disassembly.
Can you do a compression test? This should reveal gross compression problems but don't get too fixated on the exact numbers.
Can you check the glow plugs are getting power? One or more bad (or unpowered) glow plugs will give white smoke until the engine heats up.
The initial symptom (engine won't crank more than a few degrees) sounds like a bad battery (cheapest fix) or hydro-lock (could be costly). I don't know if the starter is strong enough to do major damage if hydrolocked (hopefully not).

 

[raypope]

I'm afraid it put the oil in from the top of the valve cover. I had the FEL down and didn't want to crank it to stir up any water in the crankcase.

The battery in the past has been the issue with the cranking a few degrees and stopping. I charged it to 75% to get it to turn over completely. Guess this is why I couldn't really tell if it was hydro-locked.

The wife could hear it crank over 1/8 mile away and said that something was definitely wrong.

I'm going to check it in the morning, if the coolant looks ok and there is no water in the oil and it will turn over without stopping. Let it run for a while and really heat up.

Just for grins and giggles I'm also going to remove the FEL in case I have to do any serious work to it.

I might add some Marvel Mystery Oil to a fresh tank and run that for a while to see if it clears up.

Right now I can fog all of the mosquitoes on my 7 acres with it in short order.

 

[DK35vince]

Did you add oil through the valve cover or the fill port on the side of the engine? I have read that rapid oil filling through the valve cover opening can cause problems.

Sounds like exactly what happened.
Filled from the valve cover to quickly and oil went through the vent tube and into the intake.
They should put warnings in the owners manual or the fill cap on the valve cover should be removed IMO to prevent this from happening.

 

[VictorW]

My 2004 CK30hst only has the valve cover hole for adding oil. I've just always filled slow and no problems. Hopefully it didn't have much in the cylinders to cause a problem and now all the oil is in the muffler and just burning off.

 

[DK35vince]

My 2004 CK30hst only has the valve cover hole for adding oil. I've just always filled slow and no problems. Hopefully it didn't have much in the cylinders to cause a problem and now all the oil is in the muffler and just burning off.

I'm not sure what year they started routing the valve cover vent tube to the intakes ( an emissions control thing)
Filling them with oil to fast at the valve cover can cause problems.
On my 2001 DK 35 the vent tube simply runs to nowhere on the side of the engine, so filling it to fast with oil is a non issue.

 

[raypope]

This is what I have done.

Went out on Sunday morning and the thing started up as normal, no smoke no hesitation.

There is a 'funny' high pitched sound when cranking now and I think there is a tooth on the ring gear that is bad.

Ran it for over an hour with no smoke or use of water afterwards. Just like it never happened.

Other than the funny sound at starting everything seems normal. Any thoughts on long term damage?

What happened.

Filling the crankcase with oil SHOULD NOT be done from the valve cover. This is standard procedure for all of the internal combustion engines that I have ever seen but this one is different.

Fill from the smaller fill port on the side of the engine below the injector pump near the dipstick.

Change the oil with the unit warm, not cold. This will help any additives to disperse faster and not create any slugs of very viscous liquid.

Thanks to all for the information and suggestions.

The manual should have a warning about this, but it doesn't.

 

[ritcheyvs]

Interesting.

We can only speculate but my guess is (1) some oil got into the intake manifold (through crankcase breather) when you refilled, (2) that hydro-locked the engine until most of it leaked past the rings or valves of the effected cylinders, (3) you may have damaged the starter pinion gear during the initial start attempts, (4) after starting, small amounts of residual oil migrated into one or more cylinders causing smoke (un-burned oil) and noise, (5) with the intake manifold finally cleared, the smoke and noise are gone but the damaged starter pinion gear makes the flywheel "ring" during cranking.

The suspected problem can occur if oil is added faster than it can drain from the top of the head. With too much oil building up under the valve cover, some could run out the crankcase vent and into the intake manifold. A cold block would only make this tendency worse (slower draining).

With continued luck there won't be any future consequences. It's way easier to replace the starter than the flywheel but I doubt you'll need to replace either one.