Questions about plowing implements

[Mearntain]

I've done some searching in the forums and online along with talking to a couple people in person, but I still don't feel like I have a good grasp on what implements I need that will be a good balance of getting the job done along with cost of the implement / implements.

I know there are several variables out there that will effect the answer you can give so ill give as much detail as possible. I have about 2-3 acres of flat virgin ground that I plan on planting a wide variety of crops, including corn, soy bean, potatoes, and other vegetables in the spring/summer along with growing grains such as oat and wheat in the fall/winter. I am unsure of what the soil type that I have would be called, but I can tell you that it's dark colored soil thats not rocky and not full of clay or sand and it holds water a little better than I would like. I will be doing my plowing with a Ford 2000 3 cyl gasser.

To my main question that I seem to be having trouble on deciding on, is what would be best for me to buy to help me get my plowing needs done? Will discs do the job alone on my virgin ground and be sufficient for continued maintanence? Or do I 'have' to get a plow to use first and then run the discs over them (yes I do know that this would be the "proper" way but am trying to keep costs down if possible).

Using a bottom plow by itself was the other thing I was wondering about. My thoughts are if I only use this, there will be big chunks of dirt and uneven ground as a final product. Are thoughts correct here?

I guess the last option, but most expensive option, would be a rotary tiller? Will they do the job 100% without the help of another implement? If so, what size would you recommend for my ford 2000?

 

[motownbrowne]

Unless you have a very heavy disc with large pans, you're gonna need to plow first. Or hire someone to plow for you. You'll probably only need to do this once, so hiring out is a good option. After the disc, you'll need a drag harrow or something similar for a final pass.

Yes, a rototiller will do the whole job. Might take two passes, but only one implement. Depending on which transmission you have, somewhere between a 5' and 6' tiller should work.

 

[Mearntain]

Sounds good, thanks for the detailed reply. One more question that comes to mind now that you mention the part of only ever really needing to plow the first time -- I was at tractor supply earlier today and say they have middle busters on sale for 120 right now, and I was wondering if that would be sufficient to loosen the ground up enough to be able to run just the discs over it and be good to go? I'm sure it would take a little bit of time to run over it with the middle buster, but that's just something that came to mind.

 

[smstonypoint]

I have about 2-3 acres of flat virgin ground that I plan on planting a wide variety of crops, including corn, soy bean, potatoes, and other vegetables in the spring/summer along with growing grains such as oat and wheat in the fall/winter.

Just curious about your crop mix. What type of corn -- sweet or field? Why the agronomic crops (soybeans, oats, wheat) on such a small tract?

Steve

 

[Mearntain]

I plan on doing a combination of both sweet and field corn, but probably 85% field corn. If I had more land, I'd grow more but this is all I currently have to work with. I raise animals for meat including hogs and game birds and am growing soy for hog feed supplement along with the field corn and grow the grains in the winter for feed supplement and the added bonus of straw/bedding. This is my first season having a tractor so I'm able to do more now than I was last year as I only had a walk behind tiller up to now.

 

[jeff9366]

Ford 4000: TractorData.com Ford 4000 tractor information

Ford 4000: 3,400 pounds, 55-hp, 2-WD, Cat 1 / Cat 2 3-Pts., 13.6" rear tire.

You should Moldboard Plow as your initial operation. The plow inverts the sod, leaving the roots up so they dry, die and begin to decompose.

A Disc Harrow is a type of soil mixing tiller. A Disc Harrow will not penetrate as deep as a plow on unbroken ground, nor does it invert the sod. Without plowing first, the existing grasses will return year after year in my experience. You just mix "starts" into the soil.

So a plow is necessary, but only necessary once, provided the soil is tilled annually thereafter to keep it friable.

If you decide to go with a Disc Harrow only, find one with 22" diameter or 24" diameter pans which is the weight you will need. Disc Harrows with 22" and 24" diameter pans may be either Category 1 or Category 2 Three Point Hitch compatible, find one that will be a proper fit to your Ford 4000.


Plows come in various widths, which also determines the depth at which sod will be turned. Plowing will probably improve your soils ability to 'perk' moisture. You do not want to plow so deeply that you turn up sub-soil, so dig a few holes with a garden spade around your land to determine the depth of your top soil and do not plow deeper.

The most common moldboard plow is 12", which can plow 5" to 7" deep. These are always Cat 1. You can pull a 1 X 12", 2 X 12" or 3 X 12" plow, however the more 'bottoms' the more difficult to adjust for perfect soil inversion.

You can pull a 1 X 14" or 2 X 14" plow without loaded rear tires. A 14" plow can plow 6" to 8" deep. These are usually Cat 1, but perhaps Cat 2 sometimes.

You can pull a 1 X 16" or 2 x 16" plow but your 2-WD tractor will grunt pulling a 2 X 16" which will plow from 7" to 9" deep. I believe 16" plows are always Cat 2.

So in terms of rough ground, using 12" as an example, you will have a 6" below grade furrow in the ground and next to it a 6" above grade row of inverted sod, so you field will be a series of 12" bumps = rough.

In order to invert sod properly your right rear tire has to go all the way to the floor of the furrow. Tractordata.com reports your rear tire width as 13.6" but measure, you may have replacement tires. You cannot get a 13.6" tire to the bottom of a 12" furrow so you would need to find a 14" plow, not a 12" plow. (This issue with 13" or 14" rear tires in 12" furrows is OFTEN the issue when ops cannot get their plows to perform.)

Here is a very fairly priced Ford Series 101 2 X 16" plow not far from you: Ford 2 Bottom 16" Plow with Coulters Serial 4923 Model 101 | eBay

Determine if it is Cat 1 or Cat 2, likely Cat 2.

I pull a 2 X 12" Ford Series 101 trip protected plow. They are excellent plows. I paid $1,200 for mine, with coulters and a Landing Lever.

 

[smstonypoint]

How are you going to plant the agronomic crops? Do you have access to a planter and a drill?.

How are you going to harvest the agronomic crops? Do you have access to a combine with appropriate headers?

Are you going to bale the small grain straw? If so, do you have access to the required equipment?

I had not heard of the use of raw soybeans in swine rations. Based on a quick search, raw soybeans are nor recommended for swine rations except for possible use in rations for gestating sows -- Can raw soybeans be used in swine diets?.

Steve

 

[smstonypoint]

Ford 4000: TractorData.com Ford 4000 tractor information

Ford 4000: 3,400 pounds, 55-hp, 2-WD, Cat 1 / Cat 2 3-Pts.

The OP says he has a Ford 2000.

Steve

 

[jeff9366]

The OP says he has a Ford 2000.

Steve

Yes, by golly he does. Well, the info will still apply....

 

[flusher]

YOu need to get your soil tested first. Otherwise you are flying blind. Take 1" diameter core samples at least 12" deep at a dozen or more random locations around your field.

Check the cores to determine the depth of topsoil. That will tell you how to plow your land. If the topsoil is less than 6" deep, then you need to use a heavy offset disc (axles in a "V" configuration) for primary tilling followed by secondary tillage with a tandem disc (axles in an "X" configuration). Then use a cultipacker to break up any remaining clods. If the topsoil is thicker, then use a moldboard plow for the primary tillage followed by the tandem disc and cultipacker.

Mix the core samples together in a large plastic tub and bag 3 or 4 samples of the mix. Take these samples to your local ag lab for analysis. That will tell you what fertilizer mix to apply and in what quantities.

Don't skimp on this process. It's not expensive and will save you time and money in the long run.

Good luck

 

[Mearntain]

Ford 4000: TractorData.com Ford 4000 tractor information

Ford 4000: 3,400 pounds, 55-hp, 2-WD, Cat 1 / Cat 2 3-Pts., 13.6" rear tire.

You should Moldboard Plow as your initial operation. The plow inverts the sod, leaving the roots up so they dry and begin to decompose.

A Disc Harrow is a type of soil mixing tiller. A Disc Harrow will not penetrate as deep as a plow on unbroken ground, nor does it invert the sod. Without plowing first, the existing grasses will return year after year in my experience. You just mix "starts" into the soil.

So a plow is necessary, but only necessary once, provide the soil is tilled annually thereafter to keep it friable.

If you decide to go with a Disc Harrow only, find one with 22" diameter or 24" diameter pans which is the weight you will need. Disc Harrows with 22" and 24" diameter pans may be either Category 1 or Category 2 Three Point Hitch compatible, find one that will be a proper fit to your Ford 4000.


Plows come in various widths, which also determines the depth at which sod will be turned. Plowing will probably improve your soils ability to 'perk' moisture. You do not want to plow so deeply that you turn up sub-soil, so dig a few holes with a garden spade around you land to determine the depth of your top soil and do not plow deeper.

The most common moldboard plow is 12", which can plow 5" to 7" deep. These are always Cat 1. You can pull a 1 X 12", 2 X 12" or 3 X 12" plow, however the more 'bottoms' the more difficult to adjust for perfect soil inversion.

You can pull a 1 X 14" or 2 X 14" plow without loaded rear tires. A 14" plow can plow 6" to 8" deep. These are usually Cat 1, but perhaps Cat 2 sometimes.

You can pull a 1 X 16" or 2 x 16" plow but your 2-WD tractor will grunt pulling a 2 X 16" which will plow from 7" to 9" deep. I believe 16" plows are always Cat 2.

So in terms of rough ground, using 12" as an example, you will have a 6" furrow in the ground and next to it a 6" row of inverted sod, so you field will be a series of 12" bumps = rough.

In order to invert sod properly your right rear tire has to go all the way to the floor of the furrow. Tractordata.com reports your rear tire width as 13.6" but measure, you may have replacement tires. You cannot get a 13.6" tire to the bottom of a 12" furrow so you would need to find a 14" plow, not a 12" plow. (This issue with 13" or 14" rear tires in 12" furrows is OFTEN the issue when ops cannot get their plows to perform.)

Here is a very fairly priced Ford Series 101 2 X 16" plow not far from you: Ford 2 Bottom 16" Plow with Coulters Serial 4923 Model 101 | eBay

Determine if it is Cat 1 or Cat 2, likely Cat 2.

I pull a 2 X 12" Ford Series 101 trip protected plow. They are excellent plows. I paid $1,200 for mine, with coulters and a Landing Lever.

Perfect, Thanks alot. That's a perfect explanation!

 

[Mearntain]

How are you going to plant the agronomic crops? Do you have access to a planter and a drill?.

How are you going to harvest the agronomic crops? Do you have access to a combine with appropriate headers?

Are you going to bale the small grain straw? If so, do you have access to the required equipment?

I had not heard of the use of raw soybeans in swine rations. Based on a quick search, raw soybeans are nor recommended for swine rations except for possible use in rations for gestating sows -- Can raw soybeans be used in swine diets?.

Steve

I'm not sure why you're questioning my crop choices so hard but yes I do have everything under control in regards to the planting and harvesting of what I will be growing. In my area, soy bean is one of the main grains used in producing hog feed and gamebird/chicken feeds. For the past several years, I've fed a pig and sow concentrate meal that is mixed with corn, and the primary ingredient in the concentrate meal is soy, and that mixture results in a complete 16% feed.

 

[Mearntain]

YOu need to get your soil tested first. Otherwise you are flying blind. Take 1" diameter core samples at least 12" deep at a dozen or more random locations around your field.

Check the cores to determine the depth of topsoil. That will tell you how to plow your land. If the topsoil is less than 6" deep, then you need to use a heavy offset disc (axles in a "V" configuration) for primary tilling followed by secondary tillage with a tandem disc (axles in an "X" configuration). Then use a cultipacker to break up any remaining clods. If the topsoil is thicker, then use a moldboard plow for the primary tillage followed by the tandem disc and cultipacker.

Mix the core samples together in a large plastic tub and bag 3 or 4 samples of the mix. Take these samples to your local ag lab for analysis. That will tell you what fertilizer mix to apply and in what quantities.

Don't skimp on this process. It's not expensive and will save you time and money in the long run.

Good luck

I actually got a soil analysis done already on a few different parts of my property already, so I should be good on that side of things. Checking top soil depth is a good idea and something that I haven't done yet. Thanks

 

[DJ54]

Doing a quick 50 mile radius search of your local found these items. 2 bottom plow listed as a 20" plow, so I'll assume it's a 2-12", or 2-14" bottom plow, for $275.00. Looks hardly used, and complete with coulters, and adjustable draw cross beam. Looks to be an off brand like IMCO, but looks to be a pretty decent plow. Probably uses a popular brand share, and moldboard, so parts should not be a problem. But if your only doing a couple acres, should last a very long time. Would work very well behind your 2000. As mentioned, some weights would be necessary, or just the tires loaded. My 2000 pulls 2-14's very well with just the tires loaded.

Second ad has a pull type disk listed, but no price. Also a single bottom plow, which I'd imagine is a 16" bottom for $150.00, but believe I'd go for the 2 bottom. If you don't need to travel on the road to get to the ground your planning to plant, in my opinion, the pull type disk does a much better job of finishing. Plus the fact it's probably adjustable. Set it full cut to knock down the rough plowed ground, then adjust it to barely cut for the finish.

If you plan on sowing oats, or wheat for grain/straw, once you have the finish pass made with the disk, you can broadcast seed, either with a hand broadcast seeder, or a yard, pull type to sow. Then go over it with the disk again in the finish setting, or nearly straight to set the seed in. A cultipacker behind the disk would set the seed in better, but not necessary.

A cultipacker, and a drag harrow for finish tools is something you can pick up later if needed. A piece of chain link fence, between two posts, and a chain to hook behind the disk can make a nice finish also. You just need to watch on the turns, so as to not get all tangled up.

If the 2 bottom plow is still for sale, I'd hate to offer him $250.00 cash, and not want to take it home. Sand/wire brush off the moldboards to take a lot of the drag off the face of the plow will make it pull a lot easier, and dirt roll over. If you do a couple of acres, it should polish right up. Clean all the dirt off when your finished, and either grease it, or paint the moldboards with some cheap spray paint, to keep them from rusting again.

I'm guessing you can be in business for about $400.00. I'd nix the idea of the middle buster. From what I've seen pictures, and video's of guy's "plowing" a garden with one, all they have is a big mess. Just my personal opinion.

PLOW - 20" DOUBLE BOTTOM - 3 POINT HITCH
Tractor Implements, 3 Point Implements, Farm Implements

 

[Mearntain]

Doing a quick 50 mile radius search of your local found these items. 2 bottom plow listed as a 20" plow, so I'll assume it's a 2-12", or 2-14" bottom plow, for $275.00. Looks hardly used, and complete with coulters, and adjustable draw cross beam. Looks to be an off brand like IMCO, but looks to be a pretty decent plow. Probably uses a popular brand share, and moldboard, so parts should not be a problem. But if your only doing a couple acres, should last a very long time. Would work very well behind your 2000. As mentioned, some weights would be necessary, or just the tires loaded. My 2000 pulls 2-14's very well with just the tires loaded.

Second ad has a pull type disk listed, but no price. Also a single bottom plow, which I'd imagine is a 16" bottom for $150.00, but believe I'd go for the 2 bottom. If you don't need to travel on the road to get to the ground your planning to plant, in my opinion, the pull type disk does a much better job of finishing. Plus the fact it's probably adjustable. Set it full cut to knock down the rough plowed ground, then adjust it to barely cut for the finish.

If you plan on sowing oats, or wheat for grain/straw, once you have the finish pass made with the disk, you can broadcast seed, either with a hand broadcast seeder, or a yard, pull type to sow. Then go over it with the disk again in the finish setting, or nearly straight to set the seed in. A cultipacker behind the disk would set the seed in better, but not necessary.

A cultipacker, and a drag harrow for finish tools is something you can pick up later if needed. A piece of chain link fence, between two posts, and a chain to hook behind the disk can make a nice finish also. You just need to watch on the turns, so as to not get all tangled up.

If the 2 bottom plow is still for sale, I'd hate to offer him $250.00 cash, and not want to take it home. Sand/wire brush off the moldboards to take a lot of the drag off the face of the plow will make it pull a lot easier, and dirt roll over. If you do a couple of acres, it should polish right up. Clean all the dirt off when your finished, and either grease it, or paint the moldboards with some cheap spray paint, to keep them from rusting again.

I'm guessing you can be in business for about $400.00. I'd nix the idea of the middle buster. From what I've seen pictures, and video's of guy's "plowing" a garden with one, all they have is a big mess. Just my personal opinion.

PLOW - 20" DOUBLE BOTTOM - 3 POINT HITCH
Tractor Implements, 3 Point Implements, Farm Implements

Sounds good, thanks alot. I'll have to give the guy with the double plow a call today and see if it's still available, it does look to be in really good condition for that price. I was on craigslist yesterday looking around to see what was available in my area, and I must've completely looked over this post and never saw that one for sale.

 

[AGRIMAN]

So a plow is necessary, but only necessary once, provide the soil is tilled annually thereafter to keep it friable.

I'm guessing this guys that came up with this never grew peanuts.

 

[oldballs]

Being a newbie at using tractor implements for big (50 x 100) gardens (gardened 40 years with just walk behind tiller), I have wondered about the value or need to use my single 12" moldboard plow as well as the 50 inch LandPride tiller. Maybe the OP can also gain some useful info from a response. The past couple years I have used both the plow and the big tiller.

Now that I have these implements, I'm always itching to mount up and use them. Yet it seems foolish if it is not necessary....or even worse, ill-advised.

 

[jeff9366]

I'm guessing this guys that came up with this never grew peanuts.

I have a 400 acre field next to me, which has been rented for peanuts the last four years.

The renter, who is about 80 years old, zero body fat, pulls a Disc Harrow with about 26" diameter pans and some sort of smoothing implement behind behind his big John Deere tractor with quad rears. This is pretty common setup among "real" farmers in my sandy-loam area. He never moldboard plows but that 26" Disc probably tills 9" deep with the pans adjusted not too aggressively. This judging by the residual disc furrows.

When I am operating my Kubota, he always looks down from way up there in his cab, smiles and waves. He pulls at a high rate of speed. No foolin' around. ( I am 68 years old; I think he likes to wave at kids.)

 

[motownbrowne]

I'm not sure why you're questioning my crop choices so hard but yes I do have everything under control in regards to the planting and harvesting of what I will be growing. In my area, soy bean is one of the main grains used in producing hog feed and gamebird/chicken feeds. For the past several years, I've fed a pig and sow concentrate meal that is mixed with corn, and the primary ingredient in the concentrate meal is soy, and that mixture results in a complete 16% feed.

Don't take it personally. There's still a lot of people around who took Earl Butz seriously when he said "get big or get out". The idea of growing grain crops on small plots is almost unheard of in the US. It makes more sense that you're trying to feed hogs than if you were planning on growing field corn and beans to sell at the elevator on 3 acres.

Growing on this scale will basically entail lots of hand work, because you won't be able to purchase specialized equipment for such a small crop. That's fine, just a bit of foreign concept to most farmers. It's probably not news to you that a farmer with 500 acres can produce a bushel of corn with less fuel, less time, and less money than a small producer like yourself. In many cases, folks with small plots may choose to grow something that have a greater profit potential per acre. I'm not trying to tell you not to grow corn and beans, just explaining why people are curious about your project. I wish you luck in your endeavor, and think it would be cool if you started a thread describing your project and updating it with a few pictures as the season goes on.

Good luck,
Ryan

 

[smstonypoint]

I'm not sure why you're questioning my crop choices so hard but yes I do have everything under control in regards to the planting and harvesting of what I will be growing. In my area, soy bean is one of the main grains used in producing hog feed and gamebird/chicken feeds. For the past several years, I've fed a pig and sow concentrate meal that is mixed with corn, and the primary ingredient in the concentrate meal is soy, and that mixture results in a complete 16% feed.

That feed contains soybean meal, not raw soybeans. See my link to Mississippi State regarding the use of raw soybeans in swine rations. Here's additional info from Mississippi State dealing the use of raw soybeans in poultry and game bird rations:

There are many types of beans including soybeans that are used as ingredients in bird diets. In general, all beans and peas are good protein and energy sources for birds. The primary problem with their use is that they must be processed prior to feeding.

Most are members of the legume family of plants. One characteristic of these plants is that the fruit (beans) contain enzyme inhibitors that interfere with the digestion and utilization of nutrients in the diets. If beans are used, they must be roasted or steamed to destroy the antinutritional factors. All commercial soybean meals are processed in this way before being sold as feed ingredients. Raw soybeans should never be fed to poultry or game birds.

Feeding Soybeans to Poultry

Steve