How much does that log weigh?
- Thread starter Scut 4 Big Bucks
- Start date
- Views: 33622
Xfaxman
Super Star Member
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2013
- Messages
- 12,885
- Location
- Guthrie, OK
- Tractor
- Toolcat 5610 G - Bobcat V417 - TORO+Loader
This seems like the ideal situation to use a CHAINSAW(oh no, what did I do)
I was wondering if that would get brought up.
A chainsaw was used, but not by me.
4570Man
Super Star Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2015
- Messages
- 18,416
- Location
- Crossville, TN
- Tractor
- Kubota M59, Kubota L3800, Grasshopper 428D, Topkick dump truck, 3500 dump truck, 10 ton trailer, more lighter trailers.
Unballasted without the loader it is, but less than half what the forklift weighs.
Creamer
Elite Member
One thing I have learned about cottonwoods - no tree is heavier in the spring. They have a lot of empty volume to hold water.
gladehound
Veteran Member
I found it! Post #100. It is the first post that has the 3500 pound figure. And it was written by you
LD-1's preceding post was explaining how log calculators can give very misleading numbers.In a later post, you then added that it is a 35hp tractor lifting 3500 pounds. So as of that post you were arguing against a weight claim that didn't exist and didn't even know the size of the tractor that was the subject of discussion.
To clarify:
1. Nobody made a claim that my tractor lifted 3500 pounds
2. The tractor in question is not 35hp, it is 45 hp and is on a larger frame and has a stronger loader than a 35hp. In fact, the loader has similar lift specifications to many utility tractors.
3. The loader in question is rated at 3727 pounds at the pins at ground level and that is with the standard bucket attached. So even though nobody other than yourself made the 3500 pound claim, if they did it wouldn't be that far fetched especially when you leave room for the possibility that hydraulic pressure is a little beyond spec, which it probably is.
I don't know exactly what that log weighed or how much my loader can pick off the ground. The loader spec is 3727 at the pin at ground level. The loader arms are ~7 feet long pin to pin. So at 24" beyond the pins it should lift around 3,000 pounds with the standard bucket on if pressure is at spec. Pressure is likely slightly higher than spec. (I'm repeating stuff because you don't seem to get it when it's only stated once)
The geometry of my loader is such that max lift should actually be above ground level (in the 1-4 foot range but I'd have to take measurements to figure out exactly where peak force is generated).
I'm curious what tractors with loaders you actually have. They may not be representative of the breed. Some tractors don't lift much more down low than they do at full height. All depends on the geometry of the loader. The larger tires on UT tractors make it more difficult to make a loaders with proper geometry. This is why TLB's have small front tires. However, some have achieved good loader specs on UTs. For example, the kioti 90 hp offerings have an impressive lift at ground level of around 8,000 pounds.
It is arrogant of you to believe you know more about what tractor loaders can actually lift than others because of the small sampling of tractors in your barn. Most of us have used quite a few loaders. I admittedly have only taken a small sampling of machines with loaders to their lift limits. These include a Bobcat T300, Kioti DS4510HS, Kioti LB1914, JD 110TLB, and JD4300. What is interesting about all of these, is that their limits were right were I expected them to be based on their specifications.
Based on this limited experience, I think the breakout forces specified by manufacturers are just about right on. I don't know why anyone wouldn't believe them. Especially with no evidence to the contrary.
Sawyer Rob
Super Member
OK, I mentioned 3500 first, but why did I pick 3500? Because post #88 said the log was 4800 pounds! Then in #93 it was said the loader was rated for 2600 pounds and in #95 the number for lifting had 3700 thrown around!I found it! Post #100. It is the first post that has the 3500 pound figure. And it was written by you
In a later post, you then added that it is a 35hp tractor lifting 3500 pounds. So as of that post you were arguing against a weight claim that didn't exist and didn't even know the size of the tractor that was the subject of discussion.
SO, I picked the number 3500 (to be under 3700) and stood my ground! NO tractor rated for 2600 is going to pick 3500 and raise it, driving away....I mean, the OP did have the log lifted and indicated he was driving away with it... By #103 LD1 put the number back to 4800 BUT went on to say the log probably weighed ------------>3500...
I really don't care what evolved after that, the talk went to how a 2600 rating CUT loader, can walk away with 3500 pounds and I call BS on it.
NOW, if you think more than 50 years of tractor experience with many different tractors, starting with a BN Farmall with a loader back in the 1950's, and logging/firewooding for MANY years with owning my owning sawmill since 1996 makes me arrogant, to have a good idea of what tractors will pick and what logs weigh then so be it...
Like I said before, I don't drink ANY brand of kool-aide and don't try to impress my internet friends with how much I can over load one of my compacts... I do believe I've been making money with tractors longer than a lot of you are old, I guess I didn't learn anything along the way...
You have the floor... lol
SR
4570Man
Super Star Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2015
- Messages
- 18,416
- Location
- Crossville, TN
- Tractor
- Kubota M59, Kubota L3800, Grasshopper 428D, Topkick dump truck, 3500 dump truck, 10 ton trailer, more lighter trailers.
You do realize it is a full height lift number. A tractor can lift more low to the ground. I'm not saying his tractor can lift 3,500 pounds, but it can lift more than 2600 a foot high ( or more likely the back wheels off the ground ) ( yes I realize I started this whole debate)
Luke'sScreenName
Elite Member
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2015
- Messages
- 3,710
- Location
- Lakes Region, NH
- Tractor
- Kubota MX4800 with BH-90X hoe; Hustler FastTrack 48; B3300SU (sold); 1969 Case 680B CK (sold)
Not sure why I feel it necessary to insert myself into this (personal failing of mine) but I'm just gonna leave this here and slowly back away. 
(I stole this from another thread/member)
(I stole this from another thread/member)
gladehound
Veteran Member
OK, I mentioned 3500 first, but why did I pick 3500? Because post #88 said the log was 4800 pounds! Then in #93 it was said the loader was rated for 2600 pounds and in #95 the number for lifting had 3700 thrown around!
SO, I picked the number 3500 (to be under 3700) and stood my ground! NO tractor rated for 2600 is going to pick 3500 and raise it, driving away....I mean, the OP did have the log lifted and indicated he was driving away with it... By #103 LD1 put the number back to 4800 BUT went on to say the log probably weighed ------------>3500...
I really don't care what evolved after that, the talk went to how a 2600 rating CUT loader, can walk away with 3500 pounds and I call BS on it.
NOW, if you think more than 50 years of tractor experience with many different tractors, starting with a BN Farmall with a loader back in the 1950's, and logging/firewooding for MANY years with owning my owning sawmill since 1996 makes me arrogant, to have a good idea of what tractors will pick and what logs weigh then so be it...
Like I said before, I don't drink ANY brand of kool-aide and don't try to impress my internet friends with how much I can over load one of my compacts... I do believe I've been making money with tractors longer than a lot of you are old, I guess I didn't learn anything along the way...
You have the floor... lol
SR
I picked 3500 because it was the only number that was taken by anyone (namely you) to be a claim. The other numbers were estimates of what the log might have weighed.
The 4800 number was questioned by 4570Man immediately in the same post. It's just the number some calculator spit out. It wasn't a claim.
The various numbers mentioned by LD-1 were mostly to show how log estimates can be all over the place. LD-1 and several other posters did say they thought the tractor might be able to pick up 3500 pounds (and I am in that camp) but it was in reaction to your claim that a CUT could not pick up 3500 pounds. You are the only one on this thread with a strong claim. At best others talked about possibilities.
You haven't cited any experience that is relevant to the question. Did you know that the loader used on the John Deere 4300 was only rated to lift ~1300 pounds to full height yet you could move 2500 pound pallets around with it! Real life experience and I did it routinely. Incidentally, it was rated at over 3000 pounds break out at the pins. Some CUTs are rated at over 5000 pounds break out at the pins (Check the Mahindra web site). I have no reason to doubt the manufacturer's claims as in my experience they have been right on the money.
What is your experience with manufacturer loader break out claims on CUTs? You've made a strong claim and have shared nothing to back it.
LD1
Epic Contributor
As I said before, dont trust the log weight calculators. Too many assumptions that are unknown.
But back to the issue at had..... how big, or how much that log weighed is irrelevant. What is relevant is that Sawyer Rob doesnt believe that a DS4510 with a loader rated to 2600# to max height, should be able to lift 3500# to a few feet height.
And someone who has been around many tractors/loaders for 50 years seems pretty clueless as to how loaders work. And even though we have no idea what tractor he has....he always compares it to his neighbors Case JX95 (IIRC) and he seems absolutely sure his wont lift 3500#.
Maybe it will, maybe it wont. I dont know the specs of it. But the attitude seems to be.....if my tractor cant do it, there is no way your tractor can do it.
Yet we keep bouncing back to the 2600# spec. And as I have said......there are may more specs than just what it can lift to max height. Yet for whatever reason, SawyerRob seems so sure that there is no way to lift more than the max lift height spec.
My smaller tractor has a spec of 1100# @ the pins to max height, and 860# at the bucket cutting edge to max height. Yet have gave several verifiable examples where I can exceed those numbers by quite a bit. Does that mean that my tractor can lift more than spec? Absolutely not. You are looking at the WRONG spec. As the times I have lifted 1500#+ at the bucket cutting edge, was NOT to max height.
But back to the issue at had..... how big, or how much that log weighed is irrelevant. What is relevant is that Sawyer Rob doesnt believe that a DS4510 with a loader rated to 2600# to max height, should be able to lift 3500# to a few feet height.
And someone who has been around many tractors/loaders for 50 years seems pretty clueless as to how loaders work. And even though we have no idea what tractor he has....he always compares it to his neighbors Case JX95 (IIRC) and he seems absolutely sure his wont lift 3500#.
Maybe it will, maybe it wont. I dont know the specs of it. But the attitude seems to be.....if my tractor cant do it, there is no way your tractor can do it.
Yet we keep bouncing back to the 2600# spec. And as I have said......there are may more specs than just what it can lift to max height. Yet for whatever reason, SawyerRob seems so sure that there is no way to lift more than the max lift height spec.
My smaller tractor has a spec of 1100# @ the pins to max height, and 860# at the bucket cutting edge to max height. Yet have gave several verifiable examples where I can exceed those numbers by quite a bit. Does that mean that my tractor can lift more than spec? Absolutely not. You are looking at the WRONG spec. As the times I have lifted 1500#+ at the bucket cutting edge, was NOT to max height.