GFCI lifespan only 10 years?

[ultrarunner]

When I put in GFCI for residential rentals I never piggy back them... been there done that and get a call that electricity is out... meaning several outlets.

Do like the ones with the power on indicator.

As mentioned... never had a bad Hospital Spec GFCI or non Hospital Spec standard outlet...

Section 8 requires upgrading...

Maybe 25 years ago I installed two flood lights for a neighbor over his garage with a motion sensor.... they work well... those are the two original Ace Hardware 75W floods... amazing.

 

[buickanddeere]

Maybe I'm a bit jaded over the years, but I view the GFCI changeout issue the same as kids car seats. I got "educated" this weekend by my daughter-in-law that my grandchild's car seat was going to expire in 2 months and I had better buy a new one! Is this stuff for real? How does a car seat expire? Or why does a refrigerator now only have a live expectancy of less than 12 years?

The fabrics and plastic do weaken with age and exposure to the environment . No different than a fiber rope goes rotten with age.

 

[buickanddeere]

You from central Wisconsin so perhaps WSAx...that be me and I'm humbled by your appreciation (I am only an expert in my own opinions). Anyway, we built a house in Jackson Co in 2010. My son and I did most of the electric (with a licensed guy guiding us). GFCI's are now required in any kitchen outlet (I think we have 4 separate circuits in the kitchen because the electrician ran into a jack-*** inspector in a different county that said no more than 2 outlets per circuit...whereas my inspector said 2 dedicated circuits in the kitchen). But anyway we have 4, each occupying that precious space in the panel. GFCI's can be "daisy-chained" so you get downstream protection on a standard outlet. Bad part is that if the GFCI goes bad you lose anything downstream from there. As I recall the refrigerator is on a separate "non-GFCI" circuit (another space in that precious panel) as is the freezer. I think that is current code. GFCI's required anywhere somebody might be standing in water is the best I can figure. I grew up in a house with 60a service and a large kitchen with only the 2 prong outlets...nobody died...

Each kitchen GFI needs to be on it's own breaker. Daisy chain them together and the result is tripped breakers. Even through there could be three circuits supplying counter top receptacles in the kitchen. Somebody will invariably plug the coffee maker, microwave, toaster and electric skillet into only one breaker.

 

[buickanddeere]

FYI, you should not need a dedicated outlet for a fridge or freezer. Neat trick for that is to make the fridge the first drop in a GFCI kitchen circuit. GFCIs purposefully kill power to the load side to prevent further issues with the circuit. Not sure what the other inspector was thinking with 2 outlets per circuit. That's a new one for me. In the meantime, I stand by my previous comments in this thread about inspectors.

Btw, you should be able to install a 100A sub panel next to the main panel. You need the real estate, not the amperage.

I had the same luxury that you enjoyed with wiring a new house. Had an electrician with 30+ years experience pull permits, help me on the first day of wiring to lay out circuits, then another day for the initial panel work and splicing. It was awesome, he answered every question through text making my job really easy. I handled all aspects of low voltage since that coincides with the exact nature of my employment. Saved a boat load - which allowed the wife to spend more in other areas of the house

Only device and outlet by law that can be shared with the fridge receptacle is a recessed receptacle for an electric clock.

 

[buickanddeere]

If you look at the code writing committees, you would see that most of them have nothing to do with labor, and many are professors, inspectors or manufacturers. Your assertion is just plain silly

Making claims based on a poorly written blog from Family Handyman magazine?

More than one paranoid conspiracy theorist and fanatic here. Who is certain that the government , the wealthy , the educated and business owners . Are all out there to intrude into their lives and wallets.

 

[davesl708]

Each kitchen GFI needs to be on it's own breaker. Daisy chain them together and the result is tripped breakers. Even through there could be three circuits supplying counter top receptacles in the kitchen. Somebody will invariably plug the coffee maker, microwave, toaster and electric skillet into only one breaker.

I guess things have changed. I grew up in a family of ten. We never had breakers trip when Mother prepared meals with crockpots, electric skillets, coffee makers and other appliances. We were taught to keep our fingers out of outlets and not stick things in them. Taught my children the same and no one gets shocked.

Seems we are moving toward protecting through policy rather than parenting and education of safe use. It is getting to where there is an expectation of safety no matter what you are doing or how you do it. No need to think.

 

[ultrarunner]

^^^ Same here

Grew up in a small home with 60 amp service... the only time we ever replaced a fuse was when a limb dropped in a Christmas Storm and took the Christmas Lights out.

We had a light circuit for the entire house... a Kitchen plug circuit, a house plug circuit and a garage plug circuit... so 4 circuits in total.

I own 1200 square foot homes today with a single 30 amp Edison Fuse for the Main... never a problem serving a 15 amp light circuit and a 20 amp plug circuit.

Suffice it to say I have never been an energy hog...

Want to add... I have rental where the laundry is off the kitchen... the Tenant had her own washing machine and apparently it was tripping the GFCI so she wedge a wooden match to keep the GFCI button from tripping...

 

[Paddy]

I guess things have changed. I grew up in a family of ten. We never had breakers trip when Mother prepared meals with crockpots, electric skillets, coffee makers and other appliances. We were taught to keep our fingers out of outlets and not stick things in them. Taught my children the same and no one gets shocked.

Seems we are moving toward protecting through policy rather than parenting and education of safe use. It is getting to where there is an expectation of safety no matter what you are doing or how you do it. No need to think.

daves1708,

Glad you never had an "accident" but stuff happens. People slip and drop hairdryers, people craw in crawlspaces that are a bit to damp for that light. Your friend at your shared dock has a loose ground and is getting it via the water where someone's kid is about to swim. People die from these accidents all the time. I personally don't know anyone who lost a house to fire, (except me), but we have insurance, smoke detectors and such. I bet when they moved away from ungrounded circuits 50 years ago, we would have thought it was crazy to add 50% more wire.

 

[ultrarunner]

The home I grew up in had grounded metal Junction Boxes... a thin bare ground wire was strung between the boxes and wrapped under a nail used to secure the box to the stud... 1958 construction and the entire track was built like this...

I have drilled and tapped a pigtail for my computer and Refrigerator... most just cut off the ground lug.

The other option is using self-grounding outlets...

Having built a home in Austria... I would say even the cabin started in 1982 is far advanced compared to here...

Whole house lightening arrestor, outlets designed so it is impossible to touch any energized part of a plug... the outlets are all recessed so the prongs are protected before they make contact.

Very specific grounding requirements and damp proof sealed light fixtures for garages...

Using higher voltage also means using smaller conductors... lots of 8 and 12 amp circuit breakers.

 

[teejk]

Each kitchen GFI needs to be on it's own breaker. Daisy chain them together and the result is tripped breakers. Even through there could be three circuits supplying counter top receptacles in the kitchen. Somebody will invariably plug the coffee maker, microwave, toaster and electric skillet into only one breaker.

Yup! Never put a GFCI downstream from a GFCI. But from there a 20a GFCI should be able to handle several "downstream" outlets (4 or 6 or something...I forget). Our electrician over-did it because of an experience with an inspector from a different county...my inspector (who I learned to like and trust) said we "over-killed" but no harm in that as long as we had the breaker space and the wires were already connected. Funny though in that he insisted on GFCI on our island far away from any water...