Frozen fill dirt on water line?

[Snobdds]

In Wyoming, frozen ground from November through March is just a way of life. If everything had to wait until it wasn't frozen, nothing would get done. Here, ground heaters are everywhere and rental places keep a large inventory going. See if you can rent a ground heater and warm up the top soil and bury the pipe.

Here's the idea...

I would thaw the trench and the fill.

 

[jenkinsph]

I bought some bags of topsoil and they are thawing in the house. Going to put those on Thursday.

In a separate note I noticed I have several sections where the original trench dirt has settled quite a bit (I'd say 14-18" in some places. The original line is buried 36-40" deep - do I need to get more backfill or just use plastic,etc? Overall I would guess 200ft of the 600ft are like this

Can you drag a rake over it and smooth it out?

 

[Streetcar]

I bought some bags of topsoil and they are thawing in the house. Going to put those on Thursday.

In a separate note I noticed I have several sections where the original trench dirt has settled quite a bit (I'd say 14-18" in some places. The original line is buried 36-40" deep - do I need to get more backfill or just use plastic,etc? Overall I would guess 200ft of the 600ft are like this

In areas that have settled, just fill the depression.
Frozen soil will lead to settlement.
If surround soil is not frozen, it will melt the frozen soil
In Cincinnati, we have no frozen soil, how deep is soil currently frozen in sunbury

 

[Nic3456]

In areas that have settled, just fill the depression.
Frozen soil will lead to settlement.
If surround soil is not frozen, it will melt the frozen soil
In Cincinnati, we have no frozen soil, how deep is soil currently frozen in sunbury

Last I checked maybe a couple of inches are frozen

 

[RNeumann]

I bought some bags of topsoil and they are thawing in the house. Going to put those on Thursday.

In a separate note I noticed I have several sections where the original trench dirt has settled quite a bit (I'd say 14-18" in some places. The original line is buried 36-40" deep - do I need to get more backfill or just use plastic,etc? Overall I would guess 200ft of the 600ft are like this

The idea behind the depth below grade to avoid freezing the pipes is predicated on soil acting as an insulator. I don't know that plastic will help this much. The final fix will be to bring the depressed areas back up to grade. You mentioned a rake for the task. That sounds like a lot of raking at 200' 14-18". Hopefully a machine could come in and do the task or find a few truck loads of thawed or dry material to throw on top.

Sounds like you are on the right track with this project. Tough to fight Mother Nature when it comes to winter water line work but I see a bright future for this project!

 

[Billrog]

Actually it doesn't make a lot of difference what you cover the ground with it will help to some degree. Every winter I end up burying a few horses for people & have found if I look around the farm and find anything on the ground to move or under a large tree the ground is either soft or barely froze. So anything you cover the ditch with will benefit. Snow is a good example if it snows before it freezes the ground stays thawed.

 

[sixdogs]

I trenched a waterline a couple of months ago but left a pit open where I made a connection going from a 2 inch to 1 inch pipe. The water is getting turned on next week but the ground is fairly frozen. I will backfill that same day as soon as we test the line but is that going to provide any insulation/protection if using frozen backfill? In central Ohio and current daytime temps for the 15th are expected to be a high of 19/low of 9

A trick we used in the far north was to put down a foot wide strip of 2" thick foam board insulation. First, it cushioned the fall of the dirt and second was the insulation. Pick the big rocks out but we never had a problem doing it this way.

 

[ovrszd]

Cover it with some stone first. How deep is the line? May want to leave the water running abit just for insurance until the ground has a chance to warm the backfill up a bit.

Never put stone around a water line.

 

[RNeumann]

A trick we used in the far north was to put down a foot wide strip of 2" thick foam board insulation. First, it cushioned the fall of the dirt and second was the insulation. Pick the big rocks out but we never had a problem doing it this way.

Good trick!

Or local building inspectors will approve 1' less depth for every 1" (R5) of rigid. We can use a max of 2". Normal depth here is 44-48" so we could go to 2' plus 2" of rigid in an area with a large bolder or similar that prevented digging to the standard depth- very rarely used but a vital trick!

Doing underground in my previous location we would use "sand" or "base". Then in my current location they use "crushed stone" or "stone dust".

I'd assume the concern is larger stone that could damage the pipe? Like 1/2" and above?

 

[PILOON]

Good trick!

Or local building inspectors will approve 1' less depth for every 1" (R5) of rigid. We can use a max of 2". Normal depth here is 44-48" so we could go to 2' plus 2" of rigid in an area with a large bolder or similar that prevented digging to the standard depth- very rarely used but a vital trick!

Doing underground in my previous location we would use "sand" or "base". Then in my current location they use "crushed stone" or "stone dust".

I'd assume the concern is larger stone that could damage the pipe? Like 1/2" and above?

I also have more than just a few done that way and it works.
Also not disturbing the snow covering is a factor, example being lines under a driveway need more protection as snow actually insulates.
Locally some city mains actually froze even down to 12 ft where unprotected like under a street.
Our city now even uses foam to protect culverts as it saves lots of steaming out come spring.