Amsoil vs. Kubota Super UDT2

[dgeesaman]

I changed the hydraulic fluid in my New Holland TC45DA from what I expect was factory original to TSC Traveller Premium UDT. I'm not entirely happy with it - until the tractor warms up the loader groans and moves weak/slow on the cold fluid. It didn't act this poorly in past winters.

While I consider the TSC fluid a "mistake" it did give me an appreciation for how this tractor doesn't like cold, viscous hydraulic fluid. So I'm going synthetic, at least synth blend.

I believe Super UDT2 is a synthetic blend at $21/gallon. Amsoil Tractor UDT is a full synthetic at $30/gallon. Is the Amsoil worth more?

I'd compare specs but Kubota uses secrecy to scare customers into buying only their fluids.

 

[RNeumann]

I know I am going to get overrun by the Amsoil folks here but I have to say no. First and foremost the other worked for you so why pay more!

Now for my story. I spent weeks researching the specs and data and settled on amsoil. I bought an Amsoil membership and naught everything for my Duramax - trans, gear, motor and grease. The mileage dropped a full MPG. My buddy did the same with his diesel- at the same time and had very similar results. He literally uses the oil for cutting fluid now.

I'm a Chevron delo now with better milage and a thicker wallet. On my tractor I'm going to run Chevron 1000 THF as I've heard nothing bad about it and my local distributer sells it for $52 with tax.

Let the onslaught begin.......

 

[dgeesaman]

I know I am going to get overrun by the Amsoil folks here but I have to say no. First and foremost the other worked for you so why pay more!

I commend your bravery, the Amsoil train moves fast and hits hard...

The original Ambra oil worked ok. The tractor was definitely a bit weak and slow when I started it in winter until it warmed up fully. On the TSC stuff it's a lot worse. I'm extrapolating that an oil with even better cold flow properties will run better than the Ambra. And there is no controversy that synthetic base oils have lower friction in gearboxes than conventionals. By my math the NH Ambra will cost $190, the Super UDT2 will cost $215, and Amsoil will be $296. (The TSC stuff was $70). That's not a big price premium considering it should last several years.

Amsoil engine oil gets expensive fast and it hits you on every oil change. I use Rotella 5w-40 in both the tractor and the pickup. Decent stuff for a very reasonable price. Always started on the first crank even in the dead of winter.

 

[RNeumann]

I've also heard good things about the Shell hydraulic fluids as well. I don't know which one you need. Chevron also makes a synthetic hydraulic fluid-

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF | Chevron Lubricants

Like I said I found a local oil distributor who has the Chevron products and from my internet research it looks like NAPA can get it. I think WalMart can get the Shell product line- order online and pick up at the store.

http://www.shell.co.uk/promos/lubes...d7c6d5a2b8bde0ddbca/shell-tellus-brochure.pdf

 

[motownbrowne]

I don't know what was in my New Holland when I bought it. It was new fluid, but cheap stuff, I'm sure. I bought SUDT last week to replace it. The three point moves much faster in cold weather and my hydraulic pump is quieter. Also, the HST is happier and warms up faster.

As I understand it, SUDT is synthetic. I would have bought the Amsoil, because it lists the NH spec, but i found similar pricing to you. In my case it would have cost an extra $100 to use Amsoil. Everything I've read about the SUDT made me feel comfortable using it, and my NH/Kubota parts guy agreed that it was fine

Good luck with your decision, and let us know what you end up with.

 

[art]

We are a multi line dealer and we sell both Kubota and CNH tractors. Being an old line IH who had the first hydro's for normal farming we have a bit of experience with both. We are up in NY and in our area we have already received over 100 inches in some of our area of coverage so it is not like we are 70 degree's and in Texas! One of the things to consider for us is extended or long drain periods are not normally a plus do to condensation during the winter! I do like a feature in the better grade of the CNH oil for it's ability to absorb more moisture so you don't get ice clumps when cold causing starvation of the hydraulic system and leading to pump replacement.
For us experimenting we have changed some hydro's because of the noise to the super UDT in the CNH tractors and found that it made them quieter and more responsive. Not having all spec's to work with it is a bit thinner which would help in cold start ups as well as initial lubrication. I do not know of it's ability to absorb moisture as well as the CNH oil which is really important in this area but it has helped make tractors more then what they were! For some in this it doesn't make to much of a difference but for us here we are quick to notice any change in color of the oil as it normally means the oil is absorbing moisture and will need to be changed often before it's prescribed time.

 

[motownbrowne]

We are a multi line dealer and we sell both Kubota and CNH tractors. Being an old line IH who had the first hydro's for normal farming we have a bit of experience with both. We are up in NY and in our area we have already received over 100 inches in some of our area of coverage so it is not like we are 70 degree's and in Texas! One of the things to consider for us is extended or long drain periods are not normally a plus do to condensation during the winter! I do like a feature in the better grade of the CNH oil for it's ability to absorb more moisture so you don't get ice clumps when cold causing starvation of the hydraulic system and leading to pump replacement.
For us experimenting we have changed some hydro's because of the noise to the super UDT in the CNH tractors and found that it made them quieter and more responsive. Not having all spec's to work with it is a bit thinner which would help in cold start ups as well as initial lubrication. I do not know of it's ability to absorb moisture as well as the CNH oil which is really important in this area but it has helped make tractors more then what they were! For some in this it doesn't make to much of a difference but for us here we are quick to notice any change in color of the oil as it normally means the oil is absorbing moisture and will need to be changed often before it's prescribed time.

Thanks for sharing that. I'm glad to hear that folks have been using SUDT in other brands with good results.

 

[Fallon]

I'm pretty sure UDT & Super UDT2 are Dino oil, not synthetic. 2 might be a blend but I'm pretty sure it's not pure synthetic. Pretty established it's quieter in Kubota HSTs & likely a bit better on cold startups. I ran 2 in my old L3200hst & will run it in my new L4060hstc when it's due for its first service. Think it comes with 2 from the factory, possibly just UDT though.

 

[ray66v]

The evidence on seems to be, the real "premium" fluids, Super UDT, Permatran, Hy-tran, Amsoil, all work well every time.

Generic fluid, including those with the word "premium" on the label, seem to be hit and miss.

This isn't a good place to try and save a few bucks.

I have had the Amsoil in my tractor, for almost 10 years. I don't notice any difference. But, I had good fluid in there before.

 

[motownbrowne]

I'm pretty sure UDT & Super UDT2 are Dino oil, not synthetic. 2 might be a blend but I'm pretty sure it's not pure synthetic. Pretty established it's quieter in Kubota HSTs & likely a bit better on cold startups. I ran 2 in my old L3200hst & will run it in my new L4060hstc when it's due for its first service. Think it comes with 2 from the factory, possibly just UDT though.

"Superior Synthetic Performance" is what it says on the bottle. Also, here it is listed as a synthetic fluid: Kubota Super UDT2 Synthetic Universal Trans-Hydraulic Fluid (1 Gallon) 70000-40201

Honestly, I don't know if it's a synthetic or a synthetic blend, or a dino oil with "synthetic performance". I'm inclined to believe that it's synthetic, but if someone has a cut and dried explanation of its composition, I'd love to see it.

 

[WilliamBos]

Shell S4 TXM is another premium choice.

 

[Garandman]

I commend your bravery, the Amsoil train moves fast and hits hard..

We have several friends and acquaintances involved with different multi-level marketing products. They all claim superior quality or performance backed up by some "expert" and their proprietary research.

ALTRUM Online Home - Worlds Best Multis and Enzymes

In addition to their oil Amsoil also makes nutritional supplements, "natural" lawn and garden products, undercounter water filters for the home and bidegradble laundry detergent.

 

[stoyan79]

None of the Kubota fluids are 100% synthetic. Also many more manufacturers sell dyno oils for synthetics (Mobil 1). Those are good oils, but not 100% synthetic.
All Amsoil sells is 100% synthetic, and its proven.
I don't put many hours on my tractor, so it will take many years until I change the hydraulic fluid again, so I went with Amsoil.
If I pay $100 extra on a very important service, that I have to do once every 6 years, so be it!

 

[Garandman]

None of the Kubota fluids are 100% synthetic. Also many more manufacturers sell dyno oils for synthetics (Mobil 1). Those are good oils, but not 100% synthetic.
All Amsoil sells is 100% synthetic, and its (sic) proven.//

Proven by whom? Coca Cola does pretty well in the scar ball test, as well. Most of the tests of Amsoil are done by Amsoil.

 

[stoyan79]

I don't know where you get your info from.

Document says "Testing was completed February 2013 by an independent, third-party lab."
http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g3115.pdf

Proven by whom? Coca Cola does pretty well in the scar ball test, as well. Most of the tests of Amsoil are done by Amsoil.

 

[ovrszd]

Good discussion, following.

 

[Fallon]

Just because something is synthetic doesn't mean it will intrinsically be better or worse than something natural. DeBeers is frantically trying to maintain their diamond monopoly (falsely) claiming synthetic lab grown diamonds are inferior.

If Dino oil or blends can perform equal or better than synthetics on all important tests & benchmarks, great, more power to em.

I'm always sceptical of "3rd party testing" paid for by a company that always finds that company's stuff magically way better.

 

[stoyan79]

Amsoil is not the only good oil out there, but its definitely one of the best.

As far as diamonds go, I want to stay married. Having said that, I will stay away from synthetic diamonds.

Just because something is synthetic doesn't mean it will intrinsically be better or worse than something natural. DeBeers is frantically trying to maintain their diamond monopoly (falsely) claiming synthetic lab grown diamonds are inferior.

If Dino oil or blends can perform equal or better than synthetics on all important tests & benchmarks, great, more power to em.

I'm always sceptical of "3rd party testing" paid for by a company that always finds that company's stuff magically way better.

 

[KubotaToy]

Good discussion, following.

Who has the popcorn?

My family been farming since the 40's, my grandfather nor my father has ever has a oil related failure except when the incorrect oil was used or no oil was used. My dad is real cheapass, he buys whatever bulk oil is on sale. He bought 400 cases of Quaker state 10/30 and been using that stuff for over 20 years in all the farm trucks, his Chevy 1500 has over 397k miles on what is considered a low grade oil.

Use whatever oil gives you that warm feeling as long as it is the right specs and you actually use it. I have experience with both and the results were ugly.

BTW, I use SUDT2.

 

[stoyan79]

Quaker State is re-branded Shell, not bad oil.
These days most oils are good enough.

Who has the popcorn?

My family been farming since the 40's, my grandfather nor my father has ever has a oil related failure except when the incorrect oil was used or no oil was used. My dad is real cheapass, he buys whatever bulk oil is on sale. He bought 400 cases of Quaker state 10/30 and been using that stuff for over 20 years in all the farm trucks, his Chevy 1500 has over 397k miles on what is considered a low grade oil.

Use whatever oil gives you that warm feeling as long as it is the right specs and you actually use it. I have experience with both and the results were ugly.

BTW, I use SUDT2.