Prepaying taxes

[ultrarunner]

That liberal Cali government is messed up. But it keeps going in spite of the liberal leadership.

Sorry for the confusion... the post was my experience in Washington State and specifically Thurston County...

I sometimes jump around from California to Washington and Austria when posting...

 

[Oaktree]

I think income and consumption is OK...

Property Tax is insidious when it goes above the basic cost for snow removal and local road maintenance...

None of my Austrian Co-Workers ever worry about property tax... the government wants people to have a home... they pay consumption and income... but you do have some input... with property... someone in the neighborhood buys in and your taxes go up 80% like mine did in Washington... I have no more utility in a more "Expensive" home and in fact rising values can be the catalyst for losing my home...

I get the impression from your location profile that you have 3 homes, all in fairly expensive areas...clearly you must be pretty well off financially. Most of us are not in your situation.

I detest a sales tax. Maybe it comes from having lived most of my life in a state that doesn't have one, but I like being able to pay $1 for an item that's ticketed for $1, not a dollar and change. Nickel-dime, maybe but it adds up fast. A sales tax that's baked into the price (such as a European-style VAT) is even worse IMHO since you can't easily tell how much of the price is product and how much is tax (and enables the gov't to do stealth tax increases).

Here in N.H., we don't have either a sales or income tax so property taxes are on the high side (though not much more so than neighboring states which DO have sales/income taxes). Between 60 & 70% of that is school-related.

Hopefully we won't have either here in my lifetime, though I consider income tax to be the lesser of the two evils. A flat income tax sounds good on paper, but puts a disproportionately high burden on low/middle income workers. The key is to find the right combination of "progressive" rates that won't unduly punish higher incomes yet acknowledges that if you make more you can afford to pay more.

I think we'd all like to see a simpler method of taxation, but just looking at the difference of opinions on this board as to how to accomplish this makes me skeptical that we'll ever really see it.

 

[ultrarunner]

My areas have become expensive...

Trust me... walking past boarded up homes each block walking to school because they were abandoned did not convey expensive... more like Detroit city proper.

I paid 360k for my home in 2000... twelve years later in 2012 the homes around here were selling for under 300k. The last 5 years have been off the charts so who knows if it is sustainable? Homes that sold for 300k in 2012 now sell for 800k... simply crazy. Thankfully because of California Prop 13 someone paying 800k for the home down the road has zero effect on my property taxes.

Washington State came as a shock... the company where I work was sold to the point of the new signage going up... we were told we could apply for our jobs or not... I decided to move to WA... did a lot of research and found an ideal spot... taxes $6800 based on my purchase price... not 18 months later my property tax jumps 80%... thinking a mistake was made I contact the assessor and learn their had been a recent sale in the area triggering reassessment for all... long story but someone paid an over the top price for a parcel planning to subdivide and make a fortune... it didn't work out that way but the damage was real... by the way he lost the property in 2009 crash.

Austria is a different story... taxes are high on most things but not property tax... which is very reasonable and just a fraction of what California or Washington rates... No one worries about losing a property or having to move due to property taxes there... some homes have been in the same family for centuries...

Now if you want to buy a new car the duty is 100% last I checked... in fact I bought a factory delivery BMW and my total out the door cost including 30 days of Euro Insurance, Shipping to California was only a fraction of what my co-workers would pay and they live there... they said they all would drive BMW if they could buy them at the same price as I paid...

At least with Income and Sales you have more options... with property tax the option is losing the home if you cannot pay...

 

[Woody65]

I am one of those unfortunate souls that reside in a high tax state, NY. I have resided in a suburb of NYC for 24 years and I currently pay $9,800 in property tax. This is after I grieved my taxes and got them reduced $1,050.

I bought a piece of property in the country where my wife and her family hail from, Oneonta NY. I currently pay $3500 on 106 acres with nothing on it. I built a pole barn on it this past year and will be awaiting the tax increase that is sure to come. I would love to build the house of our dreams here but the tax liability is preventing this from happening. An estimated tax on a modest 1800sq ft home would increase my taxes to about $11,000.

I also pay around $8,000 in state and local payroll taxes. So, currently, I am paying $21,300 in NY state taxes. If I built the home, my NY state taxes would total $28,800 before I paid a single bill for anything else ( mortgage, electric, gas, food, etc). I would love to only have the one home in Oneonta but the wifey would never leave the grandkids who reside near our current home. So the $10,000 SALT limit might hit me hard. I don't know if the $24,000 standard deduction, up from $12,000 will offset the SALT limit. Going to my accountant in March to file and will see what happens.

The problem in NYS is that people who reside on less than 10% of the land mass dictate the policies for the state ( NYC and suburbs ). If you look at a voting map of the state, 90% of the state ( land mass wise ) votes conservative/republican.

I am slowly learning the policies of the municipality that governs my country property. It is a town that has (2) colleges. It makes the politics lean more liberal and as such higher taxes. I recently learned that less than 50% of the taxable properties are on the tax rolls. This is due to the not for profits purchasing property that are currently paying taxes and converting them and making them tax exempt. This cannot continue. You are asking a smaller pool of landowners to pay an increasingly higher portion of the taxes to fund a private college, state college and assorted other tax exempt businesses. This is a very rural area and people are losing their family farms that they have had for generations.

Rant over......

 

[ultrarunner]

Those in Washington State often say King County dictates to the rest of the State...

Similar here in California land mass wise... why something that may matter in LA or San Francisco dictates what happens in Lassen or Modoc, etc...

California's only saving grace is Prop 13... I was too young to have voted for hit 40 years ago but every so thankful to those that did... it has also been under assault from almost every angle all the way to the US Supreme Court since inception...

If Prop 13 were to go away... prepare for the mass exodus of Californians like never before.

 

[goeduck]

Those in Washington State often say King County dictates to the rest of the State...

If Prop 13 were to go away... prepare for the mass exodus of Californians like never before.

Correct in that the voters in King County (basically liberal Seattle) dictate politics for the state. City of Seattle employees now average nearly $100K a year. Absurd. Their pedofile ex mayor was on a spending spree for years and I sure hope there is a day of reckoning and that city spending comes home to roost. Unfortunately local counties and cities follow their lead to some extent.

Seattle Times reports on spending increases in Seattle city government. Population growth doesn't explain it all. - Opportunity Washington

I sure wish we had a prop 13

 

[ultrarunner]

I sure wish we had a prop 13

When I bought the voters of WA had approved I-747 which limited Property Tax Increases... it was a big factor in my decision.

No sooner than a single King County Judge gut I-747 did my property tax increase 80%

Taxes are by far my biggest expense in life...

 

[PILOON]

Most cities borrow on a monthly basis (at great rates).
Municipal taxes can be paid in installments in my Province (Quebec) and possibly elsewhere.

I once suggested that If offered a discount (even bank prime) those that could would probably prepay thus saving cities interest payements.
The director general replied that that would be illegal as per municipal codes.
Funny, they can charge interest but can't discount.

My city's interest debt is flabbergasting. (sure hope rates remain low)

 

[MossRoad]

I am one of those unfortunate souls that reside in a high tax state, NY. I have resided in a suburb of NYC for 24 years and I currently pay $9,800 in property tax. This is after I grieved my taxes and got them reduced $1,050.

I bought a piece of property in the country where my wife and her family hail from, Oneonta NY. I currently pay $3500 on 106 acres with nothing on it. I built a pole barn on it this past year and will be awaiting the tax increase that is sure to come. I would love to build the house of our dreams here but the tax liability is preventing this from happening. An estimated tax on a modest 1800sq ft home would increase my taxes to about $11,000.

I also pay around $8,000 in state and local payroll taxes. So, currently, I am paying $21,300 in NY state taxes. If I built the home, my NY state taxes would total $28,800 before I paid a single bill for anything else ( mortgage, electric, gas, food, etc). I would love to only have the one home in Oneonta but the wifey would never leave the grandkids who reside near our current home. So the $10,000 SALT limit might hit me hard. I don't know if the $24,000 standard deduction, up from $12,000 will offset the SALT limit. Going to my accountant in March to file and will see what happens.

The problem in NYS is that people who reside on less than 10% of the land mass dictate the policies for the state ( NYC and suburbs ). If you look at a voting map of the state, 90% of the state ( land mass wise ) votes conservative/republican.

I am slowly learning the policies of the municipality that governs my country property. It is a town that has (2) colleges. It makes the politics lean more liberal and as such higher taxes. I recently learned that less than 50% of the taxable properties are on the tax rolls. This is due to the not for profits purchasing property that are currently paying taxes and converting them and making them tax exempt. This cannot continue. You are asking a smaller pool of landowners to pay an increasingly higher portion of the taxes to fund a private college, state college and assorted other tax exempt businesses. This is a very rural area and people are losing their family farms that they have had for generations.

Rant over......

That conservative NY government is messed up. But it keeps going in spite of the conservative leadership.



(sorry, couldn't resist).

 

[Oaktree]

I decided to move to WA... did a lot of research and found an ideal spot... taxes $6800 based on my purchase price... not 18 months later my property tax jumps 80%... thinking a mistake was made I contact the assessor and learn their had been a recent sale in the area triggering reassessment for all...

This brings up the question, how often are properties re-assessed in different states? I have a friend who lives in Fla. and from what I understand, the price you paid for your property is what you're assessed on for as long as you own it. Good deal for someone like him who bought his house in 1975 for less than you'd pay for a decent car today...for someone buying a house today, not so much. I wonder if some here who pay fairly low property taxes do so because property is rarely, if ever re-assessed.
Here in N.H. it's the law that re-assessment must be done every 10 years or less. Like it or not, it makes things fairer where everyone's cost basis is similar.