Dig a well or annex into the city?

[2458n]

Water bill will not go down. Laws require 2 drains now 1 for sewage and 2 for run off. Get a well and septic while you are allowed. Water and septic for 34 years under 1000.00. Well and septic was here when I bought the place.

 

[TractorGuy]

I wouldn't give it a second thought. Dig the well and reconnect to the septic system.

 

[gsganzer]

I'm still trying to figure out the 1.5% income tax if you decide to be annexed, if what you stated is correct. What the heck does your income have to do with your property value?

 

[WM75Guy]

I'm still trying to figure out the 1.5% income tax if you decide to be annexed, if what you stated is correct. What the heck does your income have to do with your property value?

Ran into this in Missouri. Not only is there a state income tax but cities such as St Louis had a city income tax of 1%. Land just outside the city was more expensive as you did not have to pay the city income tax.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

BrokeFarmerJohn - I am heavily involved in the administration of a Township in the Dayton area so my questions/comments are from that perspective. My township surrounds a small city (population approx 5500). But, my comments/questions are my own and not any official representation of the Township....

You show that you're in Columbus. Would you be annexed into Columbus or one of the suburb cities?

How much land do you have? If you are on a typical "city size" lot (1/4 - 1 acre), being annexed might not make that much difference for you, other than the additional income tax. But if you have more of a "Township size" property (2+ acres) and are used to doing what you want to do, I'd fight the annexation. Depending on your "activities", you're going to have a lot more red tape (and just more crap in general) dealing with the city zoning office rather than the township zoning person. If you ever discharge firearms on your property, you're most likely no longer going to be able to do that if you end up within the city. Just something simple like building a shed will have double the paperwork and at least double the cost for permits, etc. Depending on the city, they may have an over zealous city inspector that likes to put "Violator" signs in your yard if your grass gets a little too long in their opinion. (The little city I moved from had one of those! Ugh!)

Look on the city's website for their local regulations to see about your animals. As someone mentioned, get any promises regarding keeping them in writing. You may be able to keep the ones you have, but might not be able to replace them.

Check with the county regarding your septic. You might not be able to just hook back up to it. I think the law in Ohio is that any new septic has to be a "mound system" which generally runs somewhere in the $10-15k range, from what I've heard. You might be able to "replace / repair" the existing septic with a traditional tank and leach field. I know my neighbor across the road (different township from me, however - but I think the county laws prevail with regards to septic) just replaced/repaired their septic with what looked like a traditional install.

I'm assuming that you work in a township or other non-taxing district if you're going to have to start paying city income tax if you're annexed. If you are already paying city income tax to where you work, check with the resident city to see if they have a "Resident Tax Credit" available to offset the combined amount of resident and non-resident city income taxes. If any of this applies to you, post it up (or PM me) and I'll try to give you some more information on this.

Back to the firearms issue... The city that we surround annexed several farms many years ago. One small farm (14 acres) was for sale a few years ago and I was surprised to find that it was within the city limits. I looked at the local ordinances and found that discharging firearms within the city limits was prohibited. I called the city and asked if there was any sort of "rural exemption". I was told absolutely not. I said "what if a coyote is in my chicken coop?" Was told to call the cops and wait for them to do something about the coyote. Decided to stay put!!

If your city posts the minutes of their council meetings on the website, do yourself a favor and download AND READ the minutes of the meetings for the last year or so. It will be dry and boring, but it will also tell you the attitudes of city council and how they do things. I know that I want no part of the city that our township surrounds based on what Council does!

As an accountant, I think that the advice that you've already been given to get the costs for drilling a well and addressing your septic issue is good. If there's a reasonable payback, I'd lean towards staying in the Township. Even if you have to rely on the County Sheriff's office for police protection, if you have a real emergency, ask the dispatcher to "request assistance" from the city if the sheriff is going to be a while to respond. Our local departments assist each other all the time. Our Township has its own Police Department, but there is generally only one officer on road patrol at any given time. If the other side of the road from you is the city, then the city has jurisdiction on the road itself and will (or should) assist for calls on the Township side of the road.

Double check your property taxes. Your county auditor should have a site where you can type in your address and see all of the levies that apply to you. For example, in our township, we pay our Township Police Levy, but if the city annexed me, I wouldn't pay that any more. BUT, the city might have their own police levy that might be more. You want to check the levies in place for your property (and note the millage of the levies) and then check the same information for an address for a city property that is close to you. Compare the total millage to see if your overall property taxes will go up or down if you are annexed into the city.

You might want to consider finding out when the next Township Trustee meeting is. Generally Trustees only meet once or twice a month so find out quick. I'd hate to see you have to wait another month to talk to them. But, go to the meeting and find out if they've dealt with this before and can they give you any help or advice in dealing with it. Hopefully they will be helpful. But, call to find out when the meeting is and ask if you can be on the agenda. Otherwise the Trustees might have a "visitor comments policy" that limits you to 3 or 5 minutes and they don't (legally) have to interact with you. If you're on the agenda, it gives them a heads up. Generally, smaller township's meetings are pretty relaxed though.

If it's inevitable that you're going to end up in the city, I might think about spending a few bucks with an attorney to see if you can get out of paying for any of the associated costs. Basically the costs are going to be related to all of the filings that go on with the county auditor to move you from one taxing district (Township) into another taxing district (city). There is also a pretty substantial cost for the County Engineer to reprint the local, official maps showing municipal boundaries, zoning, etc. If the city wants you to be in the city to start paying income taxes, see about having them eat some of those costs.

Good luck with this.

Very nice perspective. We are facing something similar here, only we don't get a choice. Sooner or later, the land we're sitting on will get annexed to the city. It's already on their "long term planning" agenda. When that day comes (if we're still here), we will be moving. I have no interest in being "in the city". We're county now, no township. We're on rural water, have our own well for watering animals, garden, etc, septic sys, pay for our own trash service. Once we "get to" be annexed, we lose the ability to shoot, burn our own yard waste/refuse, and will have to get permits for everything and fall under city zoning laws for animals, etc. It will be time to move on.

Some folks like the city aspect, would look at being in the city as a plus, and that's fine. But not us.

If it was me, I'd fight it every step of the way and stay township.

 

[gsganzer]

Ran into this in Missouri. Not only is there a state income tax but cities such as St Louis had a city income tax of 1%. Land just outside the city was more expensive as you did not have to pay the city income tax.

That sounds absolutely absurd to me, to have income taxes on a local level. Does it only apply to land/property owners or all residents (renters too)? Is there a property tax (based on the value of the property) AND an income tax?

 

[gsganzer]

Very nice perspective. We are facing something similar here, only we don't get a choice. Sooner or later, the land we're sitting on will get annexed to the city. It's already on their "long term planning" agenda. When that day comes (if we're still here), we will be moving. I have no interest in being "in the city". We're county now, no township. We're on rural water, have our own well for watering animals, garden, etc, septic sys, pay for our own trash service. Once we "get to" be annexed, we lose the ability to shoot, burn our own yard waste/refuse, and will have to get permits for everything and fall under city zoning laws for animals, etc. It will be time to move on.

Some folks like the city aspect, would look at being in the city as a plus, and that's fine. But not us.

If it was me, I'd fight it every step of the way and stay township.

My property was annexed about 5 years ago. It was a racket. The city had the first public input meeting (as required by TX law) at 6pm and got an earful. The subsequent meetings were scheduled for middle of the day when fewer could attend. During the meetings, they were vague on details and deflected or deferred when possible. The annexation was also timed so those affected would be ineligible to vote in the next town election. Ultimately we were annexed and I now pay $1500 more a year in taxes. We don't have city water or septic and pay for city trash hauling. Occasionally a police cruiser will drive past and code enforcement will leave my neighbors violations for long grass and cars not parked on improved services. I now have to get permits for everything, including building fences.

 

[Ford850]

That sounds absolutely absurd to me, to have income taxes on a local level. Does it only apply to land/property owners or all residents (renters too)? Is there a property tax (based on the value of the property) AND an income tax?

Many of the cities around me collect income tax now. It's for all residents living within the city (renters and owners) and/or for all people working in that city regardless where they live. It is in addition to property tax. Then there are separate School district income taxes that are collected as well. If you live in that school district you pay another income tax to them and they overlap all the others, and are in addition to the other taxes. And all those individual tax districts require you to file tax returns. City, School, State, and Federal tax returns. It's a joy this time of year.

 

[kenmac]

My advise would be stay away from the city. No matter what they tell you, you will have more rules and regulations than you could ever think of. In addition, they can pass more rules and regulations at will ..
No matter what they tell you about taxes and water rates, etc, they can and at some point will raise them.
It may cost you a little up front now, but if you go into the city, you will end up paying more, and have more headaches later.

Ask yourself this. Why do they want you within the city limits ? In addition to extra $$ for them, they can control you and everything you do on your land

 

[Tompet]

I wouldn't give it a second thought. Dig the well and reconnect to the septic system.

Absolutely! Stick with the sheriffs, be protected from constant rate increases, more rules and restrictions etc.
I'm living this right now in my town...unbelievably expensive, ignorant council members and mayor that can't do simple math or read a contract. It's like a bad dream watching them try to grasp simple concepts and promote an agenda they don't understand. The influence of a large law firm and engineering firm tied to a small town cannot be dismissed. It has been the most frustrating thing I've ever been involved...sorry for rant but sore topic.

And btw, Ohio department of health revised guidelines for septic in Ohio in 2016. Go to their website and read fact or fiction page. With new septic technology some former restrictions have actually been eased from the past. But then you get into state law, county, and local officials, so if they are giving you an out....my advice is take it.