mCRD

[MatHaas]

If it works the way it should ,But no matter what we are all screwed anyways

hahaha exactly. i mean a lot of it has been pressed by emissions to develop it, but i like the idea of a more efficient engine.
as far as exhaust emission, meh... but hey, we gotta protect the environment some since the population has grown to what it has, and the amount of pollution we emit has also.

realistically yes, as said above, you can remove anything past the engine like the DOC, DPF, DEF, as long as no computer sensors rely on it or alter the engine management by reading their output. You can delete the EGR too. But that all requires computer software updates to support that (like all modern diesel trucks and cars with aftermarket support); which i don't think these tractors have. Some have limited or no dependence on those systems even, so you can just straight up remove them, just depends what the factory electronic limitations are.

Don't get me wrong, i've ran straight exhaust with cat deletes on all of my performance vehicles.
But i'll leave my tractor how it is for now.
If my DOC gets clogged, would I just remove it... maybe.
I'm not an expert on engine performance for these models though (nor are many people for general tractor motors haha)
The reason i say that is altering the exhaust system can change the engine performance in a bad way, if the engine was dialed in to work best under those conditions. Things like back pressure and exhaust scavenging are considerations. Less is not always more. And my tractor is not turbocharged either, which makes it much more susceptible to be effected by those considerations.
On turbo engines, engine backpressure is mostly from the turbo and that's how it's design to perform. and removing exhaust after the turbo usually makes it more efficient, since backpressure after the turbo just adds resistance to the turbo working itself. and exhaust scavenging is in the exhaust manifold, before the turbo, so that doesn't get altered.

on performance vehicles, removing all of that stuff usually results in power gains. but like i said, if the factory ECU records some sensor readings from those extra systems, and we don't have software support to change that, then your SOL for actually removing them.

not sure you'll really see a power gain removing the DOC, and the engine my respond negatively actually.

and that's every person's decision of how enviro friendly they want to be, at their discretion.
:laughing:

 

[MatHaas]

Agree,
I think it is more about the actual injection pressure and timing control.
mechanical injection is generally between 2500-5000 psi .
When you get into common rail injection with CPU controlled electric injectors pressures jump up dramatically to well over 20,000 psi and with the Bosch CP4 systems now on some engines are over 36,000 psi These higher pressures allow for a much finer spray from the injector which is easier to ignite add in the ability to add multiple injection events and complete control of the timing it makes sense that fuel use and emissions can be reduced.

bingo, you nailed it.
the bosch cb18 on my mahindra 3550 can run up to 23,000 psi on the high side when needed. The rail probably sees close to that at full fuel in upper RPMs. It's all just about efficiency, and the electronics allow the ECU to manage it in a precise way and make it possible.

 

[MatHaas]

Interesting replies- both Kubota owners..... #2 is false and three is a stretch with a lot of conjecture.

DPF is just what it says- a filter. The 途egen tries to burn off the buildup in the filter but over time it will need serviced and or replaced. It is a known wear item- just google DPF servicing- it痴 an industry! Because of the materials in the filter the replacement cost is high.
Mahindra uses a little catalytic converter to achieve the Tier 4. While not a cheap replacement it is not known as a replacement item. I don稚 know if a car sold in the USA in the last 30 years that doesn稚 have a catalytic converter. They are known to work well for many years.

figure i'll touch on this too since we're trying to cover everything for information sake.

the Common Rail Diesel design is what achieves the Tier 4 emissions. The DOC is a small part of it. The reason the mCRD is Tier 4 is because of the common rail technology, the electronic controlling and management of fuel which has been covered in my earlier posts. The DOC puts the final touches on it, but slapping a DOC on the other mechanically controlled engines wouldn't make them pass Tier 4, hence the more complex exhaust treatment system.

Just to clarify.

 

[sd455dan]

bingo, you nailed it.
the bosch cb18 on my mahindra 3550 can run up to 23,000 psi on the high side when needed. The rail probably sees close to that at full fuel in upper RPMs. It's all just about efficiency, and the electronics allow the ECU to manage it in a precise way and make it possible.

- what I find a bit funny is that common rail is not that (New)
CP3 common rail was standard on diesel engine trucks 15 years ago.

when the tighter emissions with tier 4 for tractors became law it was inevitable that some tractor manufacturers would take advantage of time tested common rail tech.

I also have to think that Fiat is still kicking themselves for selling the common rail tech to Bosch :laughing:

 

[MatHaas]

- what I find a bit funny is that common rail is not that (New)
CP3 common rail was standard on diesel engine trucks 15 years ago.

when the tighter emissions with tier 4 for tractors became law it was inevitable that some tractor manufacturers would take advantage of time tested common rail tech.

I also have to think that Fiat is still kicking themselves for selling the common rail tech to Bosch :laughing:

yea it's been around for quite a while now, and it's worked exceptionally well.
since the OPs post was regarding the Mahindra mCRD, i will say Mahindra is definitely on the right track but they're not perfect. And really the only gripe I have is the attention to detail for the wiring, component selection, etc. (if you do go this route, make sure you have a good dealer. that seems to be the make or break difference in support and/or knowledge when something does go wrong. some people get discouraged, which is well understood if you buy a brand new tractor and 20 hours in it goes in to limp mode because a sensor connection came loose or quit and the dealer doesn't have experience. but it is manageable. and hopefully you just have smooth sailing. but now the 7 year/3000 hour warranty is a ton of security. but like i said, you need a good dealer to make that worth while if it's needed). I think they'll improve it over the next few years though with the feedback they get and it'll get ever better. I haven't seen any real major issues with the engine and it's management system either in general; just small simple fixes. And I prefer the technology. It's something new to learn, but so was using a keyboard 20 years ago :laughing:

Just the normal delay of laws/regulations/emissions being passed down from the normal every day use vehicles to the agriculture and commercial sector.

& Lol, true that. they prob made a good buck off it though :dance1:

 

[sd455dan]

yea it's been around for quite a while now, and it's worked exceptionally well.
since the OPs post was regarding the Mahindra mCRD, i will say Mahindra is definitely on the right track but they're not perfect. And really the only gripe I have is the attention to detail for the wiring, component selection, etc. (if you do go this route, make sure you have a good dealer. that seems to be the make or break difference in support and/or knowledge when something does go wrong. some people get discouraged, which is well understood if you buy a brand new tractor and 20 hours in it goes in to limp mode because a sensor connection came loose or quit and the dealer doesn't have experience. but it is manageable. and hopefully you just have smooth sailing. but now the 7 year/3000 hour warranty is a ton of security. but like i said, you need a good dealer to make that worth while if it's needed). I think they'll improve it over the next few years though with the feedback they get and it'll get ever better. I haven't seen any real major issues with the engine and it's management system either in general; just small simple fixes. And I prefer the technology. It's something new to learn, but so was using a keyboard 20 years ago :laughing:

Just the normal delay of laws/regulations/emissions being passed down from the normal every day use vehicles to the agriculture and commercial sector.

& Lol, true that. they prob made a good buck off it though :dance1:

The 1 thing that is unmentioned about CR is the cost difference when things do have a problem or wear out.
Maybe a reason Branson chose the older standard mechanical injection.
Injectors for some standard DI engines are reasonable my Ford 3000 could be bought new for $40 and my Chinese Rhino $85 new CR kioti mentioned on TBN was well over $400 .

Dreading the day my Cummins equipped Ram rolls over 200K - a full set of 6 injectors is around $2400

 

[MatHaas]

The 1 thing that is unmentioned about CR is the cost difference when things do have a problem or wear out.
Maybe a reason Branson chose the older standard mechanical injection.
Injectors for some standard DI engines are reasonable my Ford 3000 could be bought new for $40 and my Chinese Rhino $85 new CR kioti mentioned on TBN was well over $400 .

Dreading the day my Cummins equipped Ram rolls over 200K - a full set of 6 injectors is around $2400

when that does come, throw some 150hp injectors in it, head studs, and crank er up!!! :cool2: