New GC1720 Loud Drive

[bfloyd4445]

Did you ever read my post?

I specifically said: "I'm not against using synthetic transmission oil".

That being said, I have also had vehicles go over 200K. I scrapped a 1997 Villager last year with 248K on it, and it ran like new. It also never saw a drop of synthetic oil.

If you actually study the performance data of conventional vs. synthetic, you will see there is no substantial difference in lubricity, under NORMAL TEMPERATURES.

This is because the evolution of synthetic oil, has also led to the evolution of conventional oil. Making both equally as good, under NORMAL TEMPERATURES.

Which is why I said, "or, notice any other substantial performance difference, in a premium brand hydraulic transmission oil, vs. synthetic, under NORMAL TEMPERATURES".

Synthetic oil only has a performance advantage in extreme temps. And, if you want long drain intervals. It cannot solve world hunger, and peace.

Yes I read your post and all the others as well in this thread. You are right in that a big advantage is syn's ability to operate and lubricate at extreme temperatures. Extreme heat is an everyday occurrence for working engines under load. The ability for syn to lubricate at these high temperatures when conventional oils turn to sludge means the engine will last longer in itself.
Fuel economy improvement is one so called advantage i have not been able to confirm.
Resale value being much better i can most definitely confirm. I have not owned a vehicle in over twenty years that didn't have multiple offers to it from people always at my price no dickering. I like that.
synthetic oil in my opinion is cheap insurance if you plan on keeping the vehicle for a long time. Much cheaper than extended warranty

 

[ray66v]

Yes I read your post and all the others as well in this thread. You are right in that a big advantage is syn's ability to operate and lubricate at extreme temperatures. Extreme heat is an everyday occurrence for working engines under load. The ability for syn to lubricate at these high temperatures when conventional oils turn to sludge means the engine will last longer in itself.
Fuel economy improvement is one so called advantage i have not been able to confirm.
Resale value being much better i can most definitely confirm. I have not owned a vehicle in over twenty years that didn't have multiple offers to it from people always at my price no dickering. I like that.
synthetic oil in my opinion is cheap insurance if you plan on keeping the vehicle for a long time. Much cheaper than extended warranty

Most people do not operate in extreme temperatures. Or, operate in them often when they do. And, most engines will not create sludge, just because you don't run synthetic oil in them. Sludge problems are commonly the fault of defective pollution controls.

There are almost 1500 threads debating synthetic vs, conventional oil. And, they never settle anything. People believe what they want.

I know what I have seen in over 40 years of servicing vehicles.

This also has nothing to do with my original point. Which was simply, not to expect your hydro whine to be quieter, switching from premium fluid to synthetic.

 

[atsah]

I don’t hear much out of mine in L but in high I hear it a little more. I can hear the guy up the road on his 2305 like he is working in my driveway..

 

[bfloyd4445]

Most people do not operate in extreme temperatures. Or, operate in them often when they do. And, most engines will not create sludge, just because you don't run synthetic oil in them. Sludge problems are commonly the fault of defective pollution controls.

There are almost 1500 threads debating synthetic vs, conventional oil. And, they never settle anything. People believe what they want.

I know what I have seen in over 40 years of servicing vehicles.

This also has nothing to do with my original point. Which was simply, not to expect your hydro whine to be quieter, switching from premium fluid to synthetic.

you are wrong bearing temperatures tend to be high in all engines and higher < 400-900 F.> at low rpm because there is less oil flow. Transmissions go out most often because the fluid breaks down from heat loosing its ability to lubricate ending in tranny failure. Use a 100% synthetic and you will be fine.

 

[ray66v]

you are wrong bearing temperatures tend to be high in all engines and higher < 400-900 F.> at low rpm because there is less oil flow. Transmissions go out most often because the fluid breaks down from heat loosing its ability to lubricate ending in tranny failure. Use a 100% synthetic and you will be fine.

Okay I am wrong. All operations are in extreme conditions.

And, without 100% synthetic oil, your engine, and transmission, you are in big trouble.

But, with it, you will be "fine".

It also prevents, and cures, cancer, impotence, and scurvy.

 

[bfloyd4445]

Okay I am wrong. All operations are in extreme conditions.

And, without 100% synthetic oil, your engine, and transmission, you are in big trouble.

But, with it, you will be "fine".

It also prevents, and cures, cancer, impotence, and scurvy.

your being sarcastic and missed the point. You were not entirely wrong you were wrong in that there is no advantage to syn and protection from high heat and sludge is a giant advantage. One advantage i didn't mention and one that saved me a rebuild. In an engine that has used syn for a while it bonds to the metal and dosen't completly run off even at high temps. This incident you can verify with my neighbor that was there when this happened ten years ago. I just changed the oil and my neighbor came over and distracted me so i did not tighten the drain plug. After he left i went out and began hogin blackberries and noticed the oil light come on. At first i was going to stop then i did a dumb thing and kept going cause this ancient tractor was always haveing some kind of dump electrical issue. I didnt go much further when i decided to stop anbd look finding there was no drain plug! Now i panicked and drove the tractor back to the tractor barn a 1/3 of a mile away when i should have just shut her down. When i realized what a dumb thing i had done istarted planning of the teardown but then i decided to just put more oil in and see if she was ok. New plug and oil and she ran as good as ever same power no smoke and still does today ten years later. I keep aq brush hog on her and use her every year clearing pasture. I've owned that tractor for about twenty years and i am the 2nd owner. Since i got her she has always run syn. Your even welcome to come by and check the old girl out yourself if you like.

 

[ray66v]

your being sarcastic and missed the point. You were not entirely wrong you were wrong in that there is no advantage to syn and protection from high heat and sludge is a giant advantage. One advantage i didn't mention and one that saved me a rebuild. In an engine that has used syn for a while it bonds to the metal and dosen't completly run off even at high temps. This incident you can verify with my neighbor that was there when this happened ten years ago. I just changed the oil and my neighbor came over and distracted me so i did not tighten the drain plug.

You continue to write posts that indicate you can not comprehend what I post. And, you continue to change what I said, to say, I'm wrong.

Thankfully, I don't need someone who left a drain plug loose, to educate me.

After decades in business, I can tell you about many similar incidents where there was no synthetic oil involved. And, about engines that went hundreds of thousands of miles, without knowing what synthetic oil was.

You expect me to accept your little story, as some sort of evidence, synthetic oil is magical. But, if I cite a dozen incidents, that prove it happens without synthetic oil, you won't care.

 

[DMW]

Does anyone really know what the factory fill UTF is? What about the bulk fill at the dealer. Did they use permatran or a cheaper fluid meant for larger capacity tractors (meets spec just doesn't do it). SCUTs benefit from a quality oil that until recently has pretty well been synthetic. There may be UTF fluids that are as good as synthetics, but I'm going to stick with what has worked for me. I'm running the same UTF from -10 to 100 degrees. The fluids I had no control over were extremely disappointing in their longevity and performance. I have been quite pleased with my use of syn. fluids.

Dennis

 

[ray66v]

Does anyone really know what the factory fill UTF is? What about the bulk fill at the dealer. Did they use permatran or a cheaper fluid meant for larger capacity tractors (meets spec just doesn't do it). SCUTs benefit from a quality oil that until recently has pretty well been synthetic. There may be UTF fluids that are as good as synthetics, but I'm going to stick with what has worked for me. I'm running the same UTF from -10 to 100 degrees. The fluids I had no control over were extremely disappointing in their longevity and performance. I have been quite pleased with my use of syn. fluids.

Dennis

I never said I'm against synthetic fluid. Amsoil ATH is in my tractor.

Permatran, and the other premium products are good too. Half of the owners are using conventional transmission fluid, and aside from a factory pump shaft defect in the early models, (design flaw), there are zero TBN reported GC transmission problems.

Prematran is good well below zero. It has a pour point of -30F vs. -51F for Amsoil. Clearly, operating anywhere near these temperatures it makes sense to use synthetic oil.

Does anyone really know if something was initially substituted for Permatran? It is a fact, that some members have tried to use budget fluids and reported having issues. Which at least suggests, they didn't initially use cheap fluid in those tractors.

 

[bfloyd4445]

You continue to write posts that indicate you can not comprehend what I post. And, you continue to change what I said, to say, I'm wrong.

Thankfully, I don't need someone who left a drain plug loose, to educate me.

After decades in business, I can tell you about many similar incidents where there was no synthetic oil involved. And, about engines that went hundreds of thousands of miles, without knowing what synthetic oil was.

You expect me to accept your little story, as some sort of evidence, synthetic oil is magical. But, if I cite a dozen incidents, that prove it happens without synthetic oil, you won't care.

?????......I never said an engine couldn't last hundreds of thousands of miles on conventional oil. I simple stated that synthetic oil out performs conventional oil in all aspects except price and this fact is amply supported by scientific evidence and long haul trucking companies maintenance records that made the switch. Your argument is like saying smoking does not on average result in a shorter life span than non smokers. Were not talking rocket science just well documented fact.
I respect your considerable experience in business, but i must ask, did you ever have an engine that was run without any oil in the crank case and survive without any repairs like my tractor? That tractor is still running and its been about 13 years and used every year. I've had more than one car engine when i was young that i ran with almost no oil and one with none all of them were trashed. That's when i started rebuilding engines. Attached is a picture of that tractor working on sept 16 2016 taken by an air force Colonel friend. Last week that tractor again worked all week controlling trees and blackberries running as good as ever.