I suck at using a grapple

[plowhog]

I have a Massey 1758 cab tractor, with HLA grapple.

My old demolished deck has been on a side hill for months, and I finally got a 30 yard dumpster so I could dispose of it. I foolishly thought I could approach the rotted lumber pile from the downslope side, coming up, and "Grab" a pile of demolished lumber to cart over to the dumpster. Epic fail.

Each grab, I would close the clamshell and things would push out. As I raised the grapple more would fall out. As I backed up more would fall out. If I tried to go forward for another bite, I risked running over a 2x6 with exposed nails and puncturing a tire. Once in a while it worked great, most times not.

I did find I could get near the pile, get out of the cab, manually throw all kinds of stuff onto the grapple, then get in, close the clamshell, and go dump. That worked really well.

Maybe I'm a novice (for sure) or maybe my root grapple is the wrong one. But I have a real hard time "grabbing" things on the ground such as in a disorganized lumber pile. And my HLA grapple seems really heavy on the end of my loader arms. Anything but gentle maneuvers rocks the tractor, which is probably not good.

I will say that some of the old deck pieces were intact with many nailed together boards and very heavy. I could grab those big pieces with no problem, and compared to handling them manually that was wonderful.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

Pallet forks might work better. Are your rear tires filled?

I have found so far that jobs that I pictured in my mind as easy and simple, in fact, took quite a bit of practice.

 

[4570Man]

Grabbing a mangled pile lumber is nearly impossible. It either needs to be a pretty solid chunk or mostly facing the same direction.

 

[Wagtail]

Although I can't give advice regarding 'grappling skills', I can say that...

Sucking at something is the first step towards getting kinda good at something.

And so on. It's all tractor fun! :thumbsup:

 

[oosik]

Well - I HAVE more experience - Wahoo!!! I have found that grappling sections of a downed pine tree are very easy - same with large rocks. Angle the grapple almost straight down and come straight down onto the chunk of log or rock. Close and lift - nothing could be easier.

Then comes all the limbs that I chainsawed off the pine tree. Two rows - alongside each other - from each of the two sides of the tree.

I am most skilled at making a real true mess out of this situation - hey, like I said - I've got more experience. Limbs DO NOT gather well - I back drag with the top jaw to try to gather and I get a world of dirt. I use the lower jaw to go forward - push into a pile and grab - I get a world of dirt.

End up with two choices - #1) come down on the limbs and close the jaws - this means many, many trips because I have not done any gathering or #2) open jaws - go out - grab the limbs and throw them into the jaws - - this is what I normally will do.

Then again - I guess a rock & root grapple, such as I have, is not the best choice for gathering limbs, brush, scattered lumber and the like.

Fortunately - its fantastic for rocks, large sections of tree trunks and root wads. I have little to no brush and only have to deal with trimmed limbs off a fallen pine - once or twice every five years or so.

Plowhog - you have NO IDEA what - "a lot of nails in boards" means until you have cleaned up old homestead buildings. Dear old Mr Martin who homestead this property back in 1890 - never knew a spike that he did not LOVE. I finally quit with the tractor and grapple - most of the interior framework on the homestead buildings - being heavy rough sawed lumber - looked like a porcupine on each end. I don't think they ever used a spike less than 4" to 8" long.
The outside boards were all 1"x 12" or 1" x 14" - I sold all the cladding lumber to a local contractor - he used it in the rec room of one of his ultra expensive custom homes.

So - bottom line - after all my wanderings and BS - your root grapple, like mine is not the best choice for gathering. The "technique" would say - open jaws - lower until lower jaw is on the ground - move forward - do not allow lower jaw to dig into the dirt but allow it to gather limbs, lumber, brush etc. Once gathered - close jaws - lift to desired height and move to final destination.

This is all well and good but with 6" tine spacing - dirt does not fall thru the tines so very well.

 

[Citydude]

Well - I HAVE more experience - Wahoo!!! I have found that grappling sections of a downed pine tree are very easy - same with large rocks. Angle the grapple almost straight down and come straight down onto the chunk of log or rock. Close and lift - nothing could be easier.

Then comes all the limbs that I chainsawed off the pine tree. Two rows - alongside each other - from each of the two sides of the tree.

I am most skilled at making a real true mess out of this situation - hey, like I said - I've got more experience. Limbs DO NOT gather well - I back drag with the top jaw to try to gather and I get a world of dirt. I use the lower jaw to go forward - push into a pile and grab - I get a world of dirt.

End up with two choices - #1) come down on the limbs and close the jaws - this means many, many trips because I have not done any gathering or #2) open jaws - go out - grab the limbs and throw them into the jaws - - this is what I normally will do.

Then again - I guess a rock & root grapple, such as I have, is not the best choice for gathering limbs, brush, scattered lumber and the like.

Fortunately - its fantastic for rocks, large sections of tree trunks and root wads. I have little to no brush and only have to deal with trimmed limbs off a fallen pine - once or twice every five years or so.

Plowhog - you have NO IDEA what - "a lot of nails in boards" means until you have cleaned up old homestead buildings. Dear old Mr Martin who homestead this property back in 1890 - never knew a spike that he did not LOVE. I finally quit with the tractor and grapple - most of the interior framework on the homestead buildings - being heavy rough sawed lumber - looked like a porcupine on each end. I don't think they ever used a spike less than 4" to 8" long.
The outside boards were all 1"x 12" or 1" x 14" - I sold all the cladding lumber to a local contractor - he used it in the rec room of one of his ultra expensive custom homes.

So - bottom line - after all my wanderings and BS - your root grapple, like mine is not the best choice for gathering. The "technique" would say - open jaws - lower until lower jaw is on the ground - move forward - do not allow lower jaw to dig into the dirt but allow it to gather limbs, lumber, brush etc. Once gathered - close jaws - lift to desired height and move to final destination.

This is all well and good but with 6" tine spacing - dirt does not fall thru the tines so very well.

I struggled with all the branches as well after limbing a tree until I figured out to start at one end of the tree, right beside it, then start pushing to the other end. It makes for nice tight piles for the burn pile.

Now, try picking up rounds out of a pile. That's an exercise in futility.

 

[newbury]

Pallet forks might work better. Are your rear tires filled?

I have found so far that jobs that I pictured in my mind as easy and simple, in fact, took quite a bit of practice.

Pallet forks, bucket hooks, chain, magnets.

A pair (or two) of clamp on bucket forks and a chain hooked to the bucket excel at your job. Or a set of SSQA pallet forks.

Figure out the potential cost in $$ and time to repair a tire.

I'd put a pair or two of clamp-on pallet forks on my bucket, load all the torn down lumber manually, loop the chain over and haul it out.

Then use some kind of magnet bar to sweep an area before I drove on it.

 

[ericm979]

I have found that it is difficult to grab firewood rounds from a random pile with my grapple. It's an EA wicked 60". It works well for grabbing brush or tree limbs that have been piled parallel, or large tree trunks.

A counterweight on the back would reduce rocking as you move the grapple. You can also run the engine at lower rpms so the loader's motion is not as fast.

 

[plowhog]

The rear tires are loaded and I have a box blade on the back for rear weight.

Sounds like my experience is not so unusual. And yes, I thought about the amount of effort involved to repair a punctured (filled) tire. That's why I got out of the cab and started loading the material into the grapple manually. Fortunately once the grapple was loaded I didn't have to make any further effort to dump it. Unlike the small pieces-- I loaded those onto a small trailer, then drove to the dumpster, and had to handle them again to unload.

I still believe there is a learning curve and I have more experience and skill to build. For some things, the grapple excels. I moved two trunk sections of cedar trees last week-- about 36" diameter and maybe 6-8 ft long. Drove up, grabbed the trunk piece, and drove away with it to reposition it somewhere else. Compared to the lumber pile, that was easy.

 

[TractorGuy]

I've gone back and forth on what type grapple would work best for my task. I have piles of stumps and tree debris with way too much dirt mixed in. I figure a rock grapple may work better than a root grapple. In the end I might try adding dual thumbs to my bucket and use some expanded metal to sift out dirt. I am thinking I could grab a load and invert the bucket and shake the dirt out. Probably won't work though.

 

[oosik]

I did not have a grapple when we burned firewood - unfortunately. But I use my grapple extensively to pick a big rock out of a row of rocks - works great.

Short story - homesteader on adjoining property had four sons. One of their MAJOR jobs was to clear the rocks out of selected fields. I can imagine a rock sled pulled by mules. Anyhow there are miles and miles of "rock walls/fences" on the adjoining property to the north. I have permission to pick rocks off these walls - as long as I don't make a mess. For some strange reason - my meadows are basically rock free. Maybe the neighbors sons wandered - ???

Anyhow - if I ever need a rock(s) - talking about a rock half the size of your average office desk - I can get one there. Its a long trip - so I will go with my farm wagon - it can carry many at the same time(rated at 20,000#). I know this may sound strange to a lot of you - kind of like bringing ice to the Eskimos - but the only large rock I have, and its just one, is the size of my tractor and in one of my far fields.

This trailer is fantastic for large rock and big chunks of pine trunk. I built it up from brand new Horst running gear in 2012.


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The trip to some of these walls is anywhere from one to three miles - one way. Fortunately, it is across open fields and involves no travel on any type of road system.

 

[plowhog]

I traveled to Scotland many years ago. I was astouned at the number of rock walls. All hand built, setting one rock at a time, after you found that rock a distance away and brought it to the well. Miles of such walls-- fencing property, cross-fencing, and so on. The hours/months/years/decades and more to build all that was impressive.

 

[oosik]

PLOWHOG - a word of encouragement. I've had my grapple since 4/2014 - - four and a half years. I've gotten better with use - you will also.

Like me, you will find ways to be more efficient with your grapple. I will NEVER be as good as that person who uses a grapple every day in his work - I just need to be good enough to do what I want to do and be safe doing it. I'm retired - time is a luxury that I have.

 

[jjp8182]

Since it seems I have a slightly different type of grapple (66" single lid EA Wicked Grapple), I'm having to think through how to translate how what I do would translate into other types of grapples -- so if it doesn't make sense let me know what isn't clear and I'll make another attempt.

Anyway, what I do when cleaning up limbs/trees/debris is to drive into the brush with the front bottom lip on (or just above) the ground, and the grapple tilted forward such that the bottom inside of the grapple (which will be making contact with the material) makes an angle between 15 and 35-ish degrees with the ground. This is to allows the grapple to catch and roll the material into a pile, at which point I either put the FEL arms into a float position or lift the arms (to keep from lifting the front of the tractor) as I tilt the grapple even further forward to a point where the lid hinge will be directly above (or very close to directly above) the point where the lid/lips will be close. Then it's just a simple matter of closing the grapple and hauling the material off like normal.

So essentially once I've gotten a pile, I'm just using the ground to provide back pressure on the load to keep it from squirting out as it's squeezed by the closing grapple jaws.

While I'm not an expert with a grapple, I can routinely get large/overflowing loads of most kinds of material (tree trunks, branches, limbs, windrows of weeds/vegetation, etc) through use of this method (at least with my grapple/tractor combination) ..... and on really good days I can also use this technique to gather up single branches as small as 1/2" to 3/4" in diameter that may have strayed from a larger loose pile which makes final clean up a lot easier/faster.

 

[EddieWalker]

what does your grapple look like? I went with one that has two arms that close down on what I'm picking up because it's never even. Each arm closes as far as it can and puts maximum pressure on what it's holding. Rarely does anything all out. When it does, it's almost always because I have branches hanging down to the ground and I catch them on something. Usually one of my front tires.

 

[Coyote machine]

I have a Igland brand Log Grapple, the GR-20. I't amazing, and I pick up whole trees with it, limbed or not. It's sometimes a precarious balance with a 40' long tree, but when my subframe 1000+# hoe is on the back end with loaded tires, I can maneuver carefully to get trees to my landing.
Think I've had it for about 8 years or thereabout, and it never lets me down. Its got two feet on the bottom jaw and an upper jaw that is two sides connected in the middle to enable pulling things toward the grapple.
Its light, 350#s and allows me in close. It will pickup big rocks and most anything I can grab with it.
It takes caution to work in tight spaces in the woods if a cut tree hangs in another, I can't allow the tree I'm pulling on to get unhung and then twist the FEL/grapple and flip the tractor on it's side.

Otherwise its one of my favorite tools! It rocks!:thumbsup:

To the OP, take it slow and think ahead. If piling branches to collect later face all butt ends the same way and pile up so you can approach them parallel to your jaws.
With use it becomes easier.

 

[ericm979]

I have a dual lid grapple too. I thought it would work better than a single lid for firewood rounds. Maybe it does but it's still not a lot more effective than using the loader bucket.

I've already punctured a front tire- I got a little too close to a fallen down cabin and ran over a board with a nail in it that was hidden in the leaves. When I remove the old cabin this winter I'll be pulling it apart by hand and stacking the boards into the grapple or atv trailer.

 

[goeduck]

Plowhog, your post says clamshell. What type of grapple do you have? Rake?

 

[atsah]

I traveled to Scotland many years ago. I was astouned at the number of rock walls. All hand built, setting one rock at a time, after you found that rock a distance away and brought it to the well. Miles of such walls-- fencing property, cross-fencing, and so on. The hours/months/years/decades and more to build all that was impressive.

You don't have to go to Scotland to see miles of rock walls placed one at a time, Massachusetts is loaded with them..

 

[oosik]

Coyote Machine-post #16 - makes an excellent point. If you have a grapple and you are collecting limbs - into a pile - pile them all one way - they will be a whole lot easier to grab with your grapple.

I don't have limbs - I have small pine trees - 1" to 6" on the butt. I will thin as many as a dozen or more stands during my annual spring thinning project. Some years I want to chip all the little thinned trees - normally 850 to 950 - in one single spot. So I will drag out 60 to 80 small trees from one thinned stand and pile them in three or four piles - ALL BUTTS POINTED IN THE SAME DIRECTIONS.

It makes a significant difference in being able to pluck them when stacked this way. Limbs, small trees, brush, trash lumber are tough to grab with a rock & root grapple, like mine. So every little bit helps.

The slope on the bottom tines of my rock & root grapple tends to push loose material away. I've learned how to overcome this - I will use either the top or bottom jaw to collect the material into a pile and then raise up over this pile - open the jaws wide - come straight down on the pile and close the jaws. It tends to gather dirt also - so after you have the material firmly gripped - shake the jaws to make the dirt fall out.

This grappling process uses the ground to help hold the loose material while you grapple it up. If I try to slide under a pile with the bottom jaw - I will likely end up pushing the pile all over the place.