Growing Old With Dignity

[Steppenwolfe]

Not to be callous, but are some thinking more about protecting a future inheritance more than being concerned with dignified elder care for their parents?

Why should tax payers be on the hook for people who could have afforded their own nursing home expense or at least contributed toward it, but through extate planning, gave away their accumulated assets before hand? Perhaps long term care insurance should be mandatory just like Social Security.

Yep... that is what I was wondering.

 

[ovrszd]

I think the medicaid look back is 60 months everywhere except here. My understanding is the CA look back is 30 months. I don't think they go after the transferred assets. Instead they impose a penalty, an ineligibility period, which can be years, based on the value of the transferred assets and the cost of care.

There are good reasons to put assets into a trust long before you think it might be needed.

Again, here in Missouri we honor what is called a "Beneficiary Deed" on property. This entitles the property owner to give the property to whomever they choose without probate. Not designed to shelter property. Just to make the final transfer painless and cost effective.

 

[downsizingnow48]

It is all information that people should have. Acting on the basis of publicly available information makes sense; acting in ignorance of the available information is stupid. Of course lots of people do. The stupid, I mean.

In the case of my father in law, he had enough income plus an insurance payout that allowed him to meet all costs as they came in. I looked into Medicaid on his behalf, realized he did not need it, and that was that.

My own situation is similar, I have enough resources that I will never need public assistance for anything. The only time I got any in my whole life was for 3 months after I was discharged from the Army, and I figured I was owed something at the time.

My wife and I did the trust for entirely different reasons, it had nothing to do with health care. It was to avoid the extortionate cost of probate. Spending down my estate on medical care is OK, but having it looted (legally) by lawyers is a whole different deal.

 

[ovrszd]

Do you guys think the charged cost of care is the same to patients that have the means to pay a high amount versus those that don't? Do you think the cost of a hospital stay is the same for all patients regardless of their financial situation? Do you think those that can't afford to pay as much become a taxpayer burden? If you have answered yes then I believe you need to do some research and educate yourself as to how this is done.

For example, have you had a medical procedure done and studied the bill?? Was there a difference in the original charged amount and what your insurance provider paid? Did that difference become a tax payer burden?

Why is it legal for medical services providers to charge a different price for the same procedure to different patients dependent on their wealth?

Who in this discussion is deceiving the honest hard working payer of his bills by varying charges? Who created this skewed playing field?

 

[ovrszd]

It is all information that people should have. Acting on the basis of publicly available information makes sense; acting in ignorance of the available information is stupid. Of course lots of people do. The stupid, I mean.

In the case of my father in law, he had enough income plus an insurance payout that allowed him to meet all costs as they came in. I looked into Medicaid on his behalf, realized he did not need it, and that was that.

My own situation is similar, I have enough resources that I will never need public assistance for anything. The only time I got any in my whole life was for 3 months after I was discharged from the Army, and I figured I was owed something at the time.

My wife and I did the trust for entirely different reasons, it had nothing to do with health care. It was to avoid the extortionate cost of probate. Spending down my estate on medical care is OK, but having it looted (legally) by lawyers is a whole different deal.

Well explained Pat. I tried but was not as eloquent as you.

Not going down a political road at all, just using an example that most here heard. When the presidential debates between Trump and Clint were going on Trump was being attacked because he paid less taxes. He replied something to the effect that the reason he paid less was that he used the laws as they were written and he was smarter.

This situation is the same. If you choose to not utilize the tools at your disposal that's your choice. Just as it's Pat's and mine.

 

[Diggin It]

Do you guys think the charged cost of care is the same to patients that have the means to pay a high amount versus those that don't?

I was in a situation where dental coverage lapsed for some Administrative reasons, not related to anything I did. I had an appointment scheduled prior to when the lapse occurred. They told me if I wanted it done, it would cost me X amount. I asked them what they would get paid by the insurance. I didn't really expect them to tell me, but they did and said the amount would be about a third of what they quoted me. I offered to pay them that same amount and they refused. "If that's all you would get from the insurance company, why can't I just pay that? You'll get the same amount, I'll get the same care." Again, they refused.

I cancelled the appointment and waited for coverage to be restored. I got the work done, they got paid the smaller amount by the insurance.

 

[ovrszd]

I was in a situation where dental coverage lapsed for some Administrative reasons, not related to anything I did. I had an appointment scheduled prior to when the lapse occurred. They told me if I wanted it done, it would cost me X amount. I asked them what they would get paid by the insurance. I didn't really expect them to tell me, but they did and said the amount would be about a third of what they quoted me. I offered to pay them that same amount and they refused. "If that's all you would get from the insurance company, why can't I just pay that? You'll get the same amount, I'll get the same care." Again, they refused.

I cancelled the appointment and waited for coverage to be restored. I got the work done, they got paid the smaller amount by the insurance.

That right there is an example of what's wrong with our health care systems!!!!! So, I'll protect my assets the best I can.

 

[Fuddy1952]

Here's a strange thing I was thinking.
Growing up in farm grandparents lived next door, grandfather was a physician (long story short he was a machinist, then became mechanical engineer, then M.D., then D.O.- Osteopath and surgeon), I was with him when he passed (r.i.p.), in 1986...he was still working! Headed for office at 88 and was still charging $5 (that's five dollars) for an office visit! He was an extremely good doctor (many sources-other Drs&patients).
Point is he was in an old building and had antiquated equipment. He made house calls! Can you imagine that today.
Now doctors are in a fancy building with staff. You're lucky if you spend 5 minutes with him/her. They're usually on a computer nowadays.

 

[goeduck]

That right there is an example of what's wrong with our health care systems!!!!! So, I'll protect my assets the best I can.

Of the first approx $500,000 billed for my wifes cancer treatment, insurance paid about $125,000, we paid about $2000. Balance is $0. Go figure.

 

[ovrszd]

Of the first approx $500,000 billed for my wifes cancer treatment, insurance paid about $125,000, we paid about $2000. Balance is $0. Go figure.

My point exactly.

You reckon taxpayers picked up the balance?