Front wheel spacers?

[finn1]

Do a search for broken wheel studs and front axles before you add spacers. I recall reading about both here, and have seen both in person. The cure may be worse than the disease.

 

[Rock Crawler]

Thanks for the replies. My only question regarding front spacers is the following:

What is more stable...a tricycle tractor or a conventional front end tractor, both with identical rear tires and track widths, on the same side slope?

It seems to me there has to be some point where more front track width, even on a pivot, is worth something.

I flail mow on quite steep side slopes; have done it for years now on the same slopes without a rollover. I am definitely operating under the slow, deliberate, and low mentality.

Thoughts?

I don't feel that there is a real difference in the tractors above. Your trying to credit the wide set wheels for some added stability when the pivot does not allow for any credit to be given until you reach that point of axle motion cessation. Up until that moment.... the front can not be accredited with stability. Stand in your hallway of your home and stand on 1 foot. Now lean towards the wall and as you go, using just that one leg/foot try to stop half way towards your shoulders hitting the wall. The wall is the hard stop of the pivot in this case, your 1 leg/foot is the pivot point. Can you provide resistance to that motion with 1 pivot point? No, you can not.

Now stand with 2 feet spread apart shoulder width. This is your rear axle. Your single pivot point front axle does not have diddly to with anything aside from supporting weight and balancing load across the pair of wheels.

 

[CADplans]

I have fluid filled the fronts on several tractors,, and liked the results,,

consider adding weight (fluid, or iron, or both) before adding spacers.

 

[rScotty]

Thanks for the replies. My only question regarding front spacers is the following:

What is more stable...a tricycle tractor or a conventional front end tractor, both with identical rear tires and track widths, on the same side slope?

Tricycle and conventional wide front end are going to have the same stability until you get to the end of the travel for the center pivot motion of the wide front end. Until that happens, rollover is going to be controlled by the rear wheel width. So whether or not widening the fronts will help with stability is going to depend on how many degrees the front axle pivot allows the tractor to lean before that center front axle pivot comes up against the stop. That spec. might be very different on different models.
rScotty

 

[TerryR]

Thanks for the replies. My only question regarding front spacers is the following:

What is more stable...a tricycle tractor or a conventional front end tractor, both with identical rear tires and track widths, on the same side slope?

It seems to me there has to be some point where more front track width, even on a pivot, is worth something.

The wide front end is somewhat more stable, but almost entirely because the pivot point is higher. It's at the top of the axle rather than on the ground.

With a wide front end, the width of the front end makes no difference at all until the tractor tips to the point where the front end pivot hits the stops. Maybe that could help if you were on uneven terrain, like crossing a ditch at an angle, such that the front axle has pivoted to the stop.

But if you are on a flat sloped surface the stop isn't hit until one rear wheel is far enough off the ground to have that much angle with the front end. If that is somehow happening in slow motion, the wide front end helps. I think mainly it doesn't happen in slow motion, so you have so much momentum as it rolls that the front end doesn't help much.

In such a case where the wide front end does help some, the couple of inches added by an extender will make only the tiniest of differences.

 

[CADplans]

A wide front end is MUCH more stable,,
exaggerate it,, consider the tires to be 10 feet tall,, then you can picture the situation better,,

on a narrow front end, as soon as the tractor tries to lean at all, the pivot point shifts towards the wrong direction,,

Why do you think they outlawed trike ATV's !!?? not because they were as stable as a 4-wheeler,,
I went riding one day with my new Honda 4-wheeler in 1984,, a friend had the identical "Big Red" Honda in a trike,,

He was CONSTANTLY almost turning over art the same speeds as I was operating at,,
He was 20 years older than me,, he was trying to force the trike to stay level,, and he could not make the third tire stay down,,

 

[troverman]

Some good points made all around - however, I still find it hard to believe adding width to the front doesn't help. *Some* force must be applied over the longer track of the front axle vs the tricycle tractor, so long as the front wheels are not dipping into a hole or something like that.

 

[troverman]

Well, in any case, I ordered 2" Bro-Tek spacers for my L4060...for the rear only. The spacers are over $300 a set and I really didn't want to experiment with stressing the front axle doing loader work.

I've always bought rear-only spacers and always been happy with the results. Thanks for your input on the subject.

 

[Henro]

Some good points made all around - however, I still find it hard to believe adding width to the front doesn't help. *Some* force must be applied over the longer track of the front axle vs the tricycle tractor, so long as the front wheels are not dipping into a hole or something like that.

Troveman,

You have to be right. Common sense as well as theory dictates it. Now how much front wheel spacers improves things is a separate question.

I would ask those who claim that front wheel spacer do not improve things with respect to worst case rollover situations explain why. Do they make things worse. doubt it. Do they keep things the same? Doubt it.

Strongest argument against them is probably that they make little practical difference.

I will not put them on my tractors personally, due to worrying about stress on the front axle. But that is just me.

 

[RaydaKub]

Okay call it a feel good thing... I can accept that.

:thumbsup:

Yeah I have had one wheel off the ground multiple times unfortunately because I 'push' it. Again, strongly emphasizing low and slow and being very deliberate. I've had both rear wheels off the ground although that was simply trying to lift too much with my FEL facing straight downhill.

I've done one several times also. Didn't like it at all. Have done both wheels only once I recall. Had a chain off the bucket trying to pull a small tree straight up and tried to back up to jerk it sideways a little. It didn't give, but it gave me a new experience. Glad I wasn't in 4x4 at the moment.

You are right though... no way to measure the effect of wider spacing but I see it as worthwhile insurance. Plus it makes your tractor stance badder! Kidding (sort of).

Badass-ness is IMPORTANT! Cheers!