Driving habits of rural folk

[Jstpssng]

I just had small bikes; CB175, CB450, and a Yamaha 400 Maxim. I don't know if they are even more invisible or not. What made me give up was when I was driving down a side road in town and some woman pulled out of a parking lot in front of me. I kicked the rear out and slid out around in front of her, stalling the bike. Fortunately she stopped. I was sitting there trying to get it down into first gear with my head just inches from the plow rigging on her truck; as she was screaming at me to get the ^&*( out of her way.
I went home, parked it, and sold it the following spring.

 

[strantor]

I don't disagree with anything you said and agree with you wholeheartedly. "You are invisible" was said to me more than once when I started riding and I took it as an exaggeration. I learned otherwise" I couldn't of said it better and that is exactly why I stopped riding bikes, and that was at a young age.

That said, for better or worse, that is only our opinion. I personally knew people killed riding, also knew people who did things much more dangerous who were killed doing what they loved doing. Thing is, for better our worse, that choice is left to the person to make themselves.

There are people in this world who sincerely believe guns are dangerous and you run a much higher risk of death if you own them. I'm not trying to make this political, only point out that although I may agree with you about riding bikes on the road, I would disagree with those who have those opinions that guns increase the chances of your own demise, and that they are all only opinions.

Heck, I can't believe how many kids ride ATV's without helmets or I see adults with kids on ATV's without helmets. Should I stop and tell them they're crazy for riding without riding helmets? (of course I don't say anything to anyone riding a ATV without a helmet). Thing is, it's their choice (although illegal if riding an ATV on public land without a helmet in NC).

Funny you should mention guns because I had the same thought pop up while I was writing my post. It's why I worded this so specifically:

The risk vs reward balance for riding motorcycles on the same roads as cars is so far out of whack

In my opinion, owning guns and firing them at designated ranges and in the course of hunting, is like riding a motorcycle at a leisurely pace around a closed course by yourself or with a few friends; not racing. The act of riding a motorcycle in itself is not all that dangerous. Probably no more (less, even) than driving a car. It's when you decide to do it on highways full of distracted drivers in steel-wrapped invincibility pods who have not a care or consciousness for safety, that it becomes a death sentence. Going back to the gun analogy, that is more like donning your side arm and strolling across an active battlefield full of tanks and machine guns. Your side arm isn't going to jump out of its holster and shoot you in the face, but your chances to taking a stray round are unacceptable.

 

[strantor]

Your entire tirade against motorcycling.

ok, well then [unspecified disagreement] back atcha.

 

[Sigarms]

In my opinion, owning guns and firing them at designated ranges and in the course of hunting, is like riding a motorcycle at a leisurely pace around a closed course by yourself or with a few friends; not racing. The act of riding a motorcycle in itself is not all that dangerous. Probably no more (less, even) than driving a car. It's when you decide to do it on highways full of distracted drivers in steel-wrapped invincibility pods who have not a care or consciousness for safety, that it becomes a death sentence.

Very well said and I couldn't agree more.

However, that is only our opinion. People who choose otherwise should have that right to do so.

My one 16 year old had talked about getting a bike. Both my wife and I can try to convince him otherwise, but when he becomes an adult and is out on his own, the reality is it comes down to his decision. Keep in mind, this is the same kid who thinks 4 wheel drive will get you out of anything if you get the Kubota stuck.

 

[strantor]

Very well said and I couldn't agree more.

However, that is only our opinion. People who choose otherwise should have that right to do so.

My one 16 year old had talked about getting a bike. Both my wife and I can try to convince him otherwise, but when he becomes an adult and is out on his own, the reality is it comes down to his decision. Keep in mind, this is the same kid who thinks 4 wheel drive will get you out of anything if you get the Kubota stuck.

Right on. I'm all for personal freedom and the personal responsibility/accountability that comes along with it. When I said this:

it should be a hobby reserved for the young and the old. People who don't have anyone else depending on them.

I wasn't implying there should be any law about it, just (in my opinion) that should be how the world works.

Another analogous situation that occurred to me was drug use. We have laws against all drugs except alcohol, which is one of the more dangerous ones in my estimation, and prescription engineered narcotics. We have laws against some drugs that are totally harmless, and against some that are absolutely deadly, all in the name of... what, exactly? It seems totally arbitrary to me. If we adult humans can be free to choose our fate by climbing onto a motorcycle, should we not also be free to choose the same in picking up a needle or a pipe? Is riding not an addiction? Is it not a "high?" I've tried drugs and motorcycles and I think they are too close for comfort. The thought and behavior patterns between riders and addicts seem quite similar. In what other scenario do you repeatedly risk life and limb for a brief intangible reward?

This is not a roundabout way of suggesting that motorcycling should be illegal. I mean it just as I said it. Motorcycling should be legal and so should drugs. We should have the freedom of choice. Also, if a person says to a motorcycle accident victim "you just need to hurry up and get well so we can go riding again" you might as well say to an addict recovering from an overdose "you just need to hurry up and recover so we can go shoot up some more."

 

[defranks]

Some of these opinions are interesting to me. I tell my wife that if I die on my bike, at least she'll know I was grinning and having fun just before the event. I LOVE riding, and can't imagine giving it up. One poster (just a couple comments up) says that riding on the highway is a death sentence, but it's not. I ride on the highway all the time, and here I am, still alive. Another said he wouldn't get back on a bike after he suffered a fairly severe injury, and I understand why he made that decision, but his idea that others should come to the same conclusion makes no sense at all to me. We all take risks every day, and we all decide which risks are worth it. 40,000 people die in traffic accidents each year in the U.S., but most of us find that risk so acceptable that we don't give a bit of consideration.

I've made some concessions to aging and slowed down a bit. I ride on the street and in the dirt, and I ride a lot more slowly on my dirt bike than I once did (relatively speaking). I've found that crashing in the dirt hurts more than it used to, and it seems to take longer to heal, too. I quit road racing 20 years ago when the attraction of a plastic trophy began to be outweighed by the relatively high risk of racing, but I still go and do track days, where I can ride as fast as I can in a controlled race track environment without the pressure of competition. And I hope I never tire of the high performance and control one gets from a bike. On a bike one feels small temperature variations, smells things that are masked in a car, and I just generally feel far more connected to the machine than I ever do on four wheels.

And I SURELY don't think that riding bears any similarity to drug addiction. I pay a lot of attention to my bikes (seven of them). My tires are all in good shape and properly inflated. The bikes run right. The bikes are well-maintained and the brakes work as they should. I wear protective clothing, pay attention to my surroundings, and choose my spots. For example, I wouldn't think of approaching 9/10ths in a residential area with lots of cross streets or pedestrians. On the other hand, there are some darned nice country roads around here with good visibility and challenging turns. I take my risks, but weigh them ahead of time and try hard not to put others at risk.

 

[strantor]

Some of these opinions are interesting to me. [...]. And I SURELY don't think that riding bears any similarity to drug addiction. [...] I take my risks, but weigh them ahead of time and try hard not to put others at risk.

Well thank you for disagreeing cordially and specifically. I respect your opinion and your freedom to take your own risks. But I would not take them for myself.

 

[Oaktree]

A relative is a paramedic for the air ambulance service. He says his most common customers are on Harleys. His second biggest are Jeep Wrangler occupants.

I sort of get it with Jeeps...high center of gravity, deep lugged tires, often younger drivers. Unbeatable for off-roading, but handling on curvy roads, not so much.

Curious with Harley riders though...is it because they, as someone else noted tend to travel in large groups, where someone in the lead goes down (for whatever reason) there isn't time or room for others to react? Maybe their tendency to ride 2 abreast so one rider is almost on the center line? That's all I can think of.
At least around here Harley (and Goldwing) riders seem to mostly be over 50, I rarely see them weaving in and out of traffic at high speeds, unlike the hot doggers on their rice rockets.

I still have my MC endorsement on my license, but I haven't ridden in 30-odd years. Even then way too many close calls with drivers that either weren't paying attention or just didn't see me. And this was before cellphones were common...

 

[Sigarms]

Another analogous situation that occurred to me was drug use. We have laws against all drugs except alcohol, which is one of the more dangerous ones in my estimation, and prescription engineered narcotics. We have laws against some drugs that are totally harmless, and against some that are absolutely deadly, all in the name of... what, exactly?

The answer is pretty simple IMO. Comes down to money.

Exactly what did prohibition on alcohol do for 13 years in the United States?

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your assesment on alcohol (actually think weed is probably less dangerous but that's a whole other topic LOL). The bigger issue is that whatever laws we have on the books, we can't save ourselves agasint our own devices.

 

[3930dave]

Reading along, I'm thinking of another thread concerning Driverless Car technology.

Modern road 4wheeled vehicles have evolved into mobile entertainment platforms, and ultimately won't need drivers at all. Don't Think, and Don't Engage are two major vectors at play in these products. Starting with ABS and AWD, then on into the more modern systems, people get lulled into a sub-conscious sense of invincibility driving cages.

Learning to drive and ride when vehicles (2 and 4 wheel) were much more primitive, there was NEVER any doubt in my mind about the risks on the road. When I was young, a 60mph crash likely was fatal in a car; today people routinely walk away from many of those same crashes.

Being young in any era tends to have an inherent sense of invincibility...... My hope for any young MC riders today is that there isn't any order of magnitude level of invincibility added by having grown up with non-Darwinian 4 wheeled road vehicles.

Hike, climb mountains, eat junk food, ride ATVs, ignore personal health issues, stare at cell-phone screens while walking across the street, endure high-stress jobs or relationships....... no end of risk in the world......

Ignoring Risk in any activity is often sub-optimal in the outcomes it produces. Nobody should ride (IMO) on-road or off on 2 wheels w/o clearing understanding the risks, and getting the appropriate amount of training and safety-gear in place. I do ride street; got back into it over 10 years ago, after a long time away. In today's highly-Disengaged World, I value it as an activity I MUST be highly-engaged in.

Reading this today, went off to find some data. Some interesting points leap out.... some I'd noted anecdotally (rise in over-50 fatalities), but it's sad to see other factors....... No License, Alcohol Impairment as significant factors.

Motorcycles and ATVs

Rgds, D.