Texas Fall/Winter thread!

[txdon]

Same photo of a helicopter spraying hot water on turbine on the first page of this 2016 PDF from Europe.

https://energiforskmedia.blob.core....wind-turbines-energiforskrapport-2016-300.pdf

Bruce

Correct, Sweden to be exact. De-icing is not done in Texas.
There is a you-tube that shows it in action. I'll link when I find it again.

edit: added link
Viral Image of Helicopter De-Icing Texas Wind Turbine From 216

 

[rswyan]

I got a friend in Houston that is in his THIRD rolling blackout now. I got a friend in Magnolia, Texas that has been without power for 36 hours. The problem is we don't know if it is a rolling blackout or lines down. The whole time we were without power, we could look across the back of my property and see the power on. This all just stinks.

Agreed - and it should have never happened.

Up to you guys and gals to figure why it did (hint: it wasn't wind or solar) ... and what, if anything, you want to do about it.

We need to build more natural gas power plants.

Texas has tons and tons of natural gas.

Accounts for around 25% of US production, so yeah ... it does.

As far as more NG power plants go - that's all fine, well, and good (I don't have a dog in that fight) ... but ...

The problem is, if you don't build the storage/distribution network to operate in extreme cold, just building more NG power plants aren't going to do any good in extreme cold events like this one.

I'm sitting right now around 1000' south of a Dominion NG injection well that is sited on my property, it's one of many that injects into a tar sands formation here that is used for storage. The original NG from the field was extracted in the early 1900's.

The reason why it is there, and is still being used, is to handle peak winter demand.

Fill it in the summer months when demand is low, draw from it during the cold months when NG demand peaks.

So facilities can be built that can cope with the situation ... just requires the willingness by producers and consumers to make the investment and foot the bill.

Hope you folks get through this very soon ... with as little tragedy as possible.

 

[ruffdog]

Agreed - and it should have never happened.

Up to you guys and gals to figure why it did (hint: it wasn't wind or solar) ... and what, if anything, you want to do about it.

Agree^ it wasn't solar/wind causing the problem.

Verify: Wind, solar not main causes of Texas power outages | wfaa.com

 

[Hay Dude]

No matter who/what you blame, the fact is the windmills didnt work. Systems werent put in place to assure public safety.
No more windmill construction should take place without strict controls over funding for backup energy or emergency maintenance in cold.
However, it makes no sense to build an electrical grid based on a system prone to failure and in need of subsidies if a cheaper, abundant, relatively clean system is available and works in cold.

 

[rswyan]

No matter who/what you blame, the fact is the windmills didnt work. Systems werent put in place to assure public safety.
No more windmill construction should take place without strict controls over funding for backup energy or emergency maintenance in cold.
However, it makes no sense to build an electrical grid based on a system prone to failure and in need of subsidies if a cheaper, abundant, relatively clean system is available and works in cold.

But that's the point: the cheaper, abundant, relatively clean systems you appear to be referencing didn't work in the cold/conditions the region experienced.

From the article ruffdog linked above:

However, in an interview with WFAA prior to his appearance on Fox News, Gov. Abbott explained a significant reason why the state isn't generating enough power is due to natural gas.

"It's frozen in the pipeline. It's frozen at the rig. It's frozen at the transmission line," Gov. Abbott said. "The natural gas providers are incapable of providing the natural gas that feeds into the generators that send power to people's residences there in the Dallas area."

It seems to me, if one truly wants to avoid another one of these catastrophes, the place one would start would be addressing the existing plants and distribution network problems that allowed these normally reliable facilities to suffer problems and outages.

 

[Hay Dude]

But that's the point: the cheaper, abundant, relatively clean systems you appear to be referencing didn't work in the cold/conditions the region experienced.

From the article ruffdog linked above:



It seems to me, if one truly wants to avoid another one of these catastrophes, the place one would start would be addressing the existing plants and distribution network problems that allowed these normally reliable facilities to suffer problems and outages.

We have had much lower temperatures here and no problems whatsoever with Natural Gas.
Must be the way it was installed, not the natural gas itself. I mean NG is used in much colder places, right?

It would seem foolhardy to favor tax payer subsidized windmills, which cost double to produce a kilowatt of power over NG that properly installed can provide dependable power in much harsher climates. No expensive air polluting carbon releasing helicopter deicing, or tax payer subsidies needed.

We have enough NG under the state of Pennsylvania alone to power our country until man finally destroys himself.

 

[ruffdog]

I would lean towards a healthy diversification of different sources for power. Why only depend on one type when no sources are a sure bet forever?

 

[rswyan]

We have had much lower temperatures here and no problems whatsoever with Natural Gas.
Must be the way it was installed, not the natural gas itself.

Yeah, pretty much ... and that very point has been brought up in this thread already.

I mean NG is used in much colder places, right?

So is wind ... assuming you provision them with cold weather packages that allow it.

Fail to do so, and the accusation might be leveled that someone with a vested interest in the failure of renewable energy is setting that system up to fail.

It would seem foolhardy to favor tax payer subsidized windmills, which cost double to produce a kilowatt of power over NG that properly installed can provide dependable power in much harsher climates. No expensive air polluting carbon releasing helicopter deicing, or tax payer subsidies needed.

Wind power prices now lower than the cost of natural gas

We have enough NG under the state of Pennsylvania alone to power our country until man finally destroys himself.

Others may have a different timeline for that than the one you envision.

 

[rswyan]

I would lean towards a healthy diversification of different sources for power. Why only depend on one type when no sources are a sure bet forever?

Seems like an entirely reasonable proposition ... :thumbsup:

 

[Kyle_in_Tex]

The ng is being sold out of state. This is why local ng electric plants are starving for fuel.