House generator questions...second thoughts on whole house system.

[oosik]

I'm very fortunate. I belong to a rural electrical co-op. Been out here 40+ years. The VERY longest power outage - 28 hours. I think there has been 2 or 3 outages beyond 4 hours. But never beyond 8 hours. This is over the entire 40+ year span.

I have a 3K portable Honda generator. Never even considered using it during an outage. I use it to power my tools when I'm out and about on the property.

The co-op is very aggressive on system maintenance - and it's record reflects this.

PLUS - we have one of the lowest electric rates in the country.

Inland Power & Light.

 

[ponytug]

@oosik Lucky you!

We have a convicted felon for a power company, and they are on track for reconviction for recidivism. Sigh. Why do some people/companies try so hard not do the right thing?

All the best,

Peter

 

[oosik]

It's quite upsetting/unfortunate to read that so many find the need for a backup system. The only time I even think about my electricity - when the utility fellows come out, 2x annually, to check my long service run.

 

[Root Cause]

Also preparing to build a home and have been through the same thought process.
I too, had difficulty spending for a Generac even though it sounds great.

I just bought a 12,500 Watt Westinghouse, dual fuel portable for less than 1k. It has a remote start and that will be handy after it is set up in bad weather.

My current setup is to shut off the main switch at the box and flip 'ON' a breaker to power the entire panel from the genny after I have turned off the non-critical items.


A Westinghouse auto-transfer box can be had for $200, the genny is wired for it, but that requires pre-connecting the critical things beforehand. For someone who needed CPAP or something critical, that might be an option.

I most likely will add a smaller, quieter inverter to power electronics during short or extended outages if I find out we have frequent outages in the new location.

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm still a long ways away from committing to anything, but my thinking is that I'm only going to buy the minimum that I need to survive comfortably, but not worry about powering everything. I also have two 200 amp panels that are on different sides of my house. Natural gas is available, but not connected to my house yet.

Number one for me is going with a super reliable brand. I don't believe Honda make a natural gas generator, so I'll have to find something of that caliber.

For the last 7 years, I've managed with a small Honda 2200 generator. It powers the TV, the internet, a few lights and charges our phones. It's not enough to power the heaters in the water tanks for our livestock, and that's really what I'm needing more then anything else. The house is heated with wood.

My thinking is that I'll run lines through my walls to where I need power from the generator, and install outlets that are only good when the generator is on. When I lose power, I'll just plug into those outlets. Kind of a cleaner approach then the extension cords that I use now. I plan to somehow label or mark, or do something to show that they are for the generator in case I'm not home if we lose power, or somebody doesn't try to use them when the power is on. To me, this should be pretty basic.

The advantage to a portable generator is the cost, and ease of replacing it if I need to.

Before I buy, I'll do a load chart to figure out what I absolutely need to power, and then decide on the generator after that. Until then, we've done pretty good off of the little Honda.

 

[ericm979]

My current setup is to shut off the main switch at the box and flip 'ON' a breaker to power the entire panel from the genny after I have turned off the non-critical items.

You can get a generator interlock for many modern panels that will ensure that whoever operates the generator turns off the main breaker to the PoCo before the generator breaker is switched on.

 

[LouNY]

I have my 25 KW PTO generator, it works well for over 25 years.
I wish it had an hour meter on it, some years it hasn't had only maybe an hours use other years it's been in use for 10+ days continuous.
I can fuel up a tractor while it's still running. When I was using my old Oliver 1550 I actually put a running oil level mark on the dipstick.
During that outage my mother was on O2 and hospice care, it was just a bit over ten days and the Oliver got shut down one time for about 10 minutes during the entire outage. That tractor used just a bit over a gallon of fuel per hour, now much of the time I expect that it was only actually generating 2500 to 3000 watts although at times it was at much higher when the cookstove and washer and dryer were running. It is enough generator that my household runs completely normal on the generator the power is actually a bit smoother then the utility is (National Grid).

 

[shooterdon]

I was doing fine backfeeding a large Honda gas generator for years. I decided to install an automatic whole house LP Generac. Why???

Power companies are reducing maintenance and tree trimming to save money. We will be getting more outages.

I am getting older. Firing up and hooking up a generator normally occurs during bad weather.

My fiancé does not feel comfortable hooking up or setting up.

Gas units need gas. So I needed to store a lot of fuel on site or be able to get gas during a long outage. Gas goes bad so I was having to cycle through it every year.

The chart on fuel usage is deceiving. Your unit will not run at 100% during an outage.

For short outages (half dozen or so in the last 18 months) we let the unit run on auto. None have lasted more than 4 hours. But if we were looking at a long term outage, we would cycle the unit for an hour every 4-5 hours or so during the day, and turn it off at night. So it may run 4 hours a day. At 1.5 gal/hr that is 6 gal/day. We have a minimum of 500 gal LP (2 -500 gal tanks) at all times. We can go over two months if need be...but we heat with wood.

For a short outage of 4 hours it costs us $10 to do nothing. If the unit runs all day the cost is $60. The whole house unit is easy to shut down and start up so cycling is not a PITA when we want to save fuel. NG is a lot cheaper if you have it.

Factor in your age, the abilities of your wife (if you are not there) to see what solution works for you. Also your lifestyle. If you travel and have an outage, do you have someone to take care of things? In our case, if we are away and get a one week outage, it would cost us $400 but that is better than losing a freezer of food

 

[ultrarunner]

It comes as a surprise to some the cost to operate a whole house unit and in suburbia noise ordinances have sparked some battles when the only person with a generator runs 24/7 and everyone hears it.

My little Honda 5000 is quiet enough but when power is out as many as 5 households plugged in for refrigeration mostly...

I'm never home when it happens so Genset in garage of 95 year old neighbor who keeps a log book, fuel, extension cords... etc.

 

[Jchonline]

The first step is to decide what you absolutely need in an outage. Then figure out loads for those devices, and how they are supplied. If you need something wired into the panel my advice is to have a licensed electrician do it. As far as that chart above, my answer is to minimize loads during an outage and size the generator appropriately. Already know what you will be turning off (make a nice list). A manual start and transfer is probably fine, but make sure you test it monthly to be sure it still works.

I like to be very conservative with electricity as it is, so most of my opinions are based on this.