Re-establishing Survey Corners and Way Points?

[oosik]

When my father bought this 80 acres in 1939 - he accepted the 1892 government meets/bounds survey. Since that time the land around me has changed hands a few times. Three of my four property corners have been re-established by modern day surveys.

Surprisingly - the old government surveys were spot on - plus or minus six inches.

The fourth corner - the SW corner - is out in the middle of a big lake. Nobody, including me, gives much of a hoot about having that corner surveyed.

One step even further, Jstpssng. How can a lending institution lend that kind of money without knowing things are "kosher". That's your and my money and one "sloppy" loan could put those funds in jeopardy for a good long time.

 

[TheMan419]

I don't understand why they would expect you to pay for half the survey. I understand you are getting benefit from kowing where the line truly is, but you are not the one that NEEDS to know at this point. For being a good neighbor I would likely offer to pay a few hundred bucks toward the thing but as a result I would also expect to get a copy of it.

 

[ultrarunner]

I can never understand why somebody would spend 6 figures or more for a house on a small lot... and forgo a few thousand more to make sure they know what they own.

Almost all are subdivisions in cities with established fences... Curb markings etc.

Lead time for official survey typically 8-12 weeks dominated by construction permits pending.

In today's fast market with days on market 5 to 12 days with overbids standard it is doubtful in today's market offer would stand a chance.

Strategy used is offer will best highest bonafide offer by 10k...

Of course when it will all crash is anyone's guess.

 

[bdhsfz6]

I know this likely won't help the OP but this is how I handled a boundary problem.

In 1986, the 2 acre parcel next to my 23 acre plot came up for sale. The potential buyer paid for a survey that showed the property line almost 50' off of the one I had done when I bought my land. Under the new survey, I would have lost almost 1/3 of an acre! I contacted my original surveyor who said the boundary had been disputed several times in the past. It involved a meander line associated with a dried up stream bed. He said he did my survey as best he could under the circumstances.

When I told the potential buyer I was going to dispute the new survey, he backed out of the sale. The seller was asking $6K for the land so I bought it myself. I figure I would have spent that much and more in survey & legal costs to settle the dispute. To avoid any future boundary issues, I had my surveyor remove the property line and merge the 2 acre lot with my 23 acre parcel.

 

[EddieWalker]

When my parents sold their home in Hayward and moved to Jackson, they did not get a survey. They paid cash and they never thought they needed it. Then the deer started eating my moms garden and she wanted a fence around their 3 acres. The hired a fence contractor and he found some of the corners, but not all of them. It started to look like the neighbor had removed them and built their house outside of their property, and on my parents property. They paid for a survey and found out that ten feed of the neighbors house was on their land. The neighbor claimed to not know and volunteered to pay for everything to change the property line. In the end, my parents got a free survey, and the same amount of land, just a different property line. This took over a year to deal with, but fortunately, nobody had an attitude and it was relatively painless.

Since you do not have anything to do with the property being sold, all you can do is hope that the buyers insist on a survey. If not, then it's a guessing game on where the line is, which always ends up with one side feeling ripped off.

 

[ultrarunner]

When my father bought this 80 acres in 1939 - he accepted the 1892 government meets/bounds survey. Since that time the land around me has changed hands a few times. Three of my four property corners have been re-established by modern day surveys.

Surprisingly - the old government surveys were spot on - plus or minus six inches.

The fourth corner - the SW corner - is out in the middle of a big lake. Nobody, including me, gives much of a hoot about having that corner surveyed.

One step even further, Jstpssng. How can a lending institution lend that kind of money without knowing things are "kosher". That's your and my money and one "sloppy" loan could put those funds in jeopardy for a good long time.

Title insurance has paid out more than a few times in cases I know...

 

[oosik]

Perhaps in an area where "lot size" is smaller - ultra runner. Here where I live - lot size is measured in hundreds - even thousands - of acres. My 80 acres is a mere pimple on the landscape.

In my 40+ years out here I've never been approached to share in the costs of any surveys. Even though these surveys established three of my four corners by modern survey methods.

The 1892 government survey was/is just fine by me. For that matter - most all the larger plots were the result of long past government surveys. Homesteads ...........

 

[dodge man]

Surveys and how they are done vary by area. There are also state regulations that can affect that also. There are usually two title insurance policies issued when a mortgage is taken on a property. Like I said earlier there is almost always an exclusion they won’t cover a problem a current survey would uncover. This exclusion would show up in the home owners policy. There is also a lenders policy(the bank) and sometimes this exclusion will be waved.

A short story. Before I retired I did a survey where a house was over the line. It was a rural area and the property was about 5 acres. 90% of the house was on the adjoiners property. When I was on the property I saw a person walking a dog. He had lived in the area for years. I’ve learned you can find a lot of info by talking to people and listening. He explained a buddy bought the property to build the house, they probably surveyed it themselves and got it wrong. It had since changed hands a couple of times, both the house and the surrounding property.

The current owner had the house sold but was desperate to fix the problem. I was on the property talking to the adjoining owner and he was agreeable to fixing the problem as long as the acreage was the same. When the current owner of the house showed up I said rather loudly and jokingly to the adjoining owner “I bet you never even knew you owned this house”. The owner of the house didn’t think it was funny. I explained it was all good and they had a corrected deed made that cleared up the mess. I realized my sense of humor wasn’t appreciated that day but me fixing the problem was.

 

[ultrarunner]

I know this likely won't help the OP but this is how I handled a boundary problem.

In 1986, the 2 acre parcel next to my 23 acre plot came up for sale. The potential buyer paid for a survey that showed the property line almost 50' off of the one I had done when I bought my land. Under the new survey, I would have lost almost 1/3 of an acre! I contacted my original surveyor who said the boundary had been disputed several times in the past. It involved a meander line associated with a dried up stream bed. He said he did my survey as best he could under the circumstances.

When I told the potential buyer I was going to dispute the new survey, he backed out of the sale. The seller was asking $6K for the land so I bought it myself. I figure I would have spent that much and more in survey & legal costs to settle the dispute. To avoid any future boundary issues, I had my surveyor remove the property line and merge the 2 acre lot with my 23 acre parcel.

I was thinking buying would be expedeiant and the 91 year old brother could remain in the home where he lived the last 43 years plus he has dogs and has not found a place out of dozens and dozens because two dogs a non starter looking to rent.

Everyone thought the brother would inherit but due to a reverse mortgage wouldn't be able to stay...

My offer included paying off the mortgage with brother carrying 10 year note for the balance with the option if staying and if he stayed I would still pay 1,000 per month and if he moved he would get 4,000 month. The taxes would be 16,500 from the moment it transferred...

Everyone was relieved until the will was read and the Great Great Grandchild came to light as the only descendent and one never met by Great Great Grandma...

 

[ultrarunner]

Perhaps in an area where "lot size" is smaller - ultra runner. Here where I live - lot size is measured in hundreds - even thousands - of acres. My 80 acres is a mere pimple on the landscape.

In my 40+ years out here I've never been approached to share in the costs of any surveys. Even though these surveys established three of my four corners by modern survey methods.

The 1892 government survey was/is just fine by me. For that matter - most all the larger plots were the result of long past government surveys. Homesteads ...........

Most lots in the 4,000 to 4,500 size... this little corner is very unusual with 1 to 2 acres typical...

Maybe I should just put in T-posts knowing I could be off a foot using the manhole covers as reference and scaling my survey map?