The BEST HVAC system for your home, hands down

[Sigarms]

Every so often, people will always ask what is the best HVAC equipment to put into your own home on this forum.

Trane, Run Tru, Carrier, Bryant, Payne, Lennox, Armstrong, Merit, Air Ease, York, Coleman, Luxaire, Goodman, Tempstar, Heil, Day and Night, Comfortmaker, Air quest, Rheem, Ruud (just to name a few) are all quality products IMO (please note, I did not mention "X" amount of brands from Nordyne as I hate that line, but that's just me for various reasons LOL).

The most important aspect for ANY HVAC install is the quality and knowledge of the people actually installing the system and what they will do to make something wrong right.

End of the day, name any brand of equipment out there, and you will find people bad mouthing the line because of the problems they've had. I'd guess out of all the complaints, at a minimum, 70% of the issues were due to the installation practices by the people installing the equipment.

Ended up having to change a no name system out at my house yesterday, because the existing unit we installed about 16 years ago finally had the outdoor TXV go on it, and I decided to change the entire system out.

Below is a text from me to a good friend of mine who I have known since I moved to NC 21 years ago, and we probably are pushing more years closer to retirement age in this industry combined (HVAC).

And below, the original unit that I took out yesterday that was installed around 2006.

So, anytime asks what is the best HVAC system in the world to put in your own home, revert back to this thread.

Don't always go with the lowest price, don't always go with the highest price, go with the person who seems to have given you more information on what and why they are quoting you what they're prosing and trust those people who have the confidence in the equipment they are installing in your home.

Please note, that's like a 40X40 concrete pad. They don't make them anymore or no one is stupid enough to want to use them anymore, so although I would of probably liked to have a larger pad for the newer and physically larger outdoor unit, I ain't moving it or breaking it apart!!

 

[lman]

I've got a Waterfurnace. It's been doing good for about 15 years.

 

[ultrarunner]

One thing I’ve found is some are better on parts availability…

I have more than a dozen Carriers from the early 90’s still on the job.

Put. Tempstar in my brothers home and it was attic install and also no issues.

The newest unit I have is a Daikin and lets say waiting 7 weeks for a part to arrive from overseas soured me and this was 2018!

 

[CalG]

I'm sure it's just me, but I got absolutely nothing out of this posting.

There are only a few installers in my area, and I can't tell a thing about how they rate.

What's hands down best?

 

[Sigarms]

I'm sure it's just me, but I got absolutely nothing out of this posting.

There are only a few installers in my area, and I can't tell a thing about how they rate.

What's hands down best?

HVAC equipment is not "plug and play".

What is more important than what is the "best equipment" when it comes to HVAC is not the brand name recognition along with perceived quality (such as Chevy vs Ford or green vs orange with tractors), but the quality and workmanship along with knowledge of the people actually installing the equipment (sizing a laying out a duct system is more important than the equipment itself IMO).

 

[PsRumors]

When we replaced the 2 systems in our house it took us interviewing over a dozen companies before we found someone willing to do the manual calculations. We knew we had duct issues just from a couple hours of reading, also knew we had too much capacity. The Trane we had installed never worked right, not enough return.

We went from 6 tons of cooling down to a 4 ton variable capacity Carrier. Power bill went down by $180 a month and we were so much more comfortable.

 

[Sigarms]

The newest unit I have is a Daikin and lets say waiting 7 weeks for a part to arrive from overseas soured me and this was 2018!

Daikin owns Goodman.

Daiken residential equipment is made in Texas.

Majority of Daiken VRF systems are made in Texas.

Daiken ductless mini splits are made overseas, but I believe Daiken will be making them in the US down the road.

The reality is most "American" HVAC manufacturers all use parts now that come from overseas.

Back around 2010 Goodman had a notorious issue with solenoid valves in their package equipment. Wait times in the summer were not the greatest, I do remember that and along with the ticked off homeowners.

Can remember around 95 had to wait 6 months for a compressor for a Sanyo ductless mini split.

Point being, with most parts made overseas, OEM parts availability can always vary.

We just noticed that Carrier is now going with only parts numbers on their service parts with no descriptions. Our only guess is they don't want guys to cross reference aftermarket parts that could be available and cheaper.

Take a OEM constant torque variable airflow blower motor (AKA variable speed) and you can be looking at anywhere between $600 to $1,200. Take a aftermarket motor that will work, and you can cut the price in half. Issue is, factory doesn't sell aftermarket parts. If the unit is under a parts warranty, no one really cares. Out of warranty, you could be amazed at parts cost.

 

[Sigarms]

When we replaced the 2 systems in our house it took us interviewing over a dozen companies before we found someone willing to do the manual calculations.

Prime example of the difference of a good company vs a bad HVAC company.

End of the day, by being able to do load and duct calculations where needed, it only saves everyone the potential for a larger headache. Added reality is doing a block load just to check doesn't take that long at all.

On the flip side, and putting yourself in the contractors shoes, sometimes it gets old spending hours on loads and duct sizing to know something is currently wrong with the system, only to have the homeowner shop out that information for the lowest price that they can find.

 

[mikester]

The best one depends on where you live, your climate, your building design, and your tolerance of energy efficiency.

 

[Bill Guenthner]

I’ve had every kind of system. Ductless mini-split is the most energy efficient, cheapest to install, quietest, and most comfortable, and you don’t have ducts and grates all over the house.

 

[Bill Guenthner]

HVAC equipment is not "plug and play".

What is more important than what is the "best equipment" when it comes to HVAC is not the brand name recognition along with perceived quality (such as Chevy vs Ford or green vs orange with tractors), but the quality and workmanship along with knowledge of the people actually installing the equipment (sizing a laying out a duct system is more important than the equipment itself IMO).

I can attest to that from personal experience. A bad installer will heck-up the job no matter what the system is.

 

[Sigarms]

I’ve had every kind of system. Ductless mini-split is the most energy efficient, cheapest to install, quietest, and most comfortable, and you don’t have ducts and grates all over the house.

Depending on the indoor model, annual cleaning of all those indoor blower wheels is no fun

Some one mentioned about parts. There aren't any residential ductless units made in the US to boot. Depending on the models, parts are high on the list per potential issues as well, as there really isn't any aftermarket service parts available.

 

[Bill Guenthner]

Depending on the indoor model, annual cleaning of all those indoor blower wheels is no fun

Some one mentioned about parts. There aren't any residential ductless units made in the US to boot. Depending on the models, parts are high on the list per potential issues as well, as there really isn't any aftermarket service parts available.

I don’t know, I haven’t had to buy any parts. I suspect that as SEER values get better I’ll replace the units every 10 years anyway. I’m stunned by how little energy they consume to heat and cool. The old conventional ducted system needed a 60 amp circuit PLUS a 40 amp circuit. The new system uses one 20 amp circuit. Frees a lot of space in the panel for new stuff.

 

[Sigarms]

I can attest to that from personal experience. A bad installer will heck-up the job no matter what the system is.

Sometimes it's the smaller things that don't appear very quick per system failure.

Not pulling a proper vacuum.

Not using decent solder.

Checking pressures, but never checking airflow and static pressure.

Having a long line set run but not following the manufacturers guidelines on what needs to be added.

The only reason for this post is that when you ask about a brand of equipment wondering "how good is it?", the reality is pretty much all of them will work fine when installed properly.

I went 2 stage 16 SEER variable speed because I was able to utilize a personal use program directly from the manufacture. My rep wanted me to try a "higher line" but it required a proprietary communicating thermostat. For myself, I won't touch a propriety communicating thermostat made by the manufacturer (and the only tstat you can use) due to way to many potential issues down the road.

My dad's buddy has a home about 40 minutes from us. He lives in Pa though. He called me, dealer installed a Lennox high end XP system with proprietary thermostat. He called me because the installing dealer wanted $1,600 to replace a thermostat that was out of warranty by a year. I was able to get the job done for him for $900, and that was only because the thermostat was well over half that price.

2 Stage, variable speed air handler / gas furnace with any Honeywell thermostat is my high end limit LOL

 

[Torvy]

I have a couple of questions about AC in our new house build.

One builder insisted that they only install brand C. I have had very good luck with Brand A, and I tend to be very loyal if I find something that works well. You have seen the high end unit we currently have in another thread. Is it reasonable to insist on what we want or just roll with it?

Next question... We designed our new house with a first floor mechanical room to house all other the things typically pit in an attic. The room will be accessible from the outside, so maintenance people don't need to worry about the rest of the house as much. We can also then change filters and such without climbing as we are getting older and kids are gone. The same builder was insisting they still put the equipment in the attic. Help me understand if this makes sense.

 

[Bill Guenthner]

I have a couple of questions about AC in our new house build.

One builder insisted that they only install brand C. I have had very good luck with Brand A, and I tend to be very loyal if I find something that works well. You have seen the high end unit we currently have in another thread. Is it reasonable to insist on what we want or just roll with it?

Next question... We designed our new house with a first floor mechanical room to house all other the things typically pit in an attic. The room will be accessible from the outside, so maintenance people don't need to worry about the rest of the house as much. We can also then change filters and such without climbing as we are getting older and kids are gone. The same builder was insisting they still put the equipment in the attic. Help me understand if this makes sense.

He's trying to stick with his regular subs and attic installed 'brand C' is what his regular sub knows how to do. Is AC separate from heat system?

 

[Sigarms]

I have a couple of questions about AC in our new house build.

One builder insisted that they only install brand C. I have had very good luck with Brand A, and I tend to be very loyal if I find something that works well. You have seen the high end unit we currently have in another thread. Is it reasonable to insist on what we want or just roll with it?

I don't remember the unit you speak of, but are you dealing with the builder or the HVAC contractor?

I would also think that although you had good luck with Brand A, you probably had better luck with the installing contractor installing brand A.

Personally, I could never understand why people build homes but never have the choice of what HVAC system they want, let alone being stuck with a crappy $50 thermostat in a 500k home.

 

[Pixguy]

We'll have to replace our 15yo heat pump system in Florida and our usual contracted guy only recommends up to 15 seer B system. The neighbor was purchasing a 21 seer and says we're wasting money not going with a higher seer. I ask my guy and he says the 21 has lots of electronics that he can't service it and because we're there for only 4 months the 21 seer isn't worth the extra 50% upcharge. Your thoughts?

 

[Sigarms]

We'll have to replace our 15yo heat pump system in Florida and our usual contracted guy only recommends up to 15 seer B system. The neighbor was purchasing a 21 seer and says we're wasting money not going with a higher seer. I ask my guy and he says the 21 has lots of electronics that he can't service it and because we're there for only 4 months the 21 seer isn't worth the extra 50% upcharge. Your thoughts?

I could buy anything I wanted at a very good price. I went with 16 SEER two stage with a variable speed heat pump system (surprised you have a heat pump being Florida is pretty much a straight AC market).

In complete honesty, I happen to agree with your guy in his line of thinking...

That added reality is your neighbor is full of crap. Return on investment diminishes greatly from 15 to 16 SEER, and I only wanted to go with a 16 SEER two stage system so I could run some experiments with my whole house dehumidifier tied into the system (old system was 13 SEER single stage variable speed).

Please note, best system to save money IMO is geothermal, and they are rated by EER, not SEER, but they can have a substantially higher install cost.

The sales mantra on high end selling for HVAC is over 16 SEER you aren't selling return on investment, you're selling comfort.

Thus the reason why I want to do some humidity readings with a 2 stage variable speed system now with and without the dehumidifier.

 

[Pixguy]

I could buy anything I wanted at a very good price. I went with 16 SEER two stage with a variable speed heat pump system (surprised you have a heat pump being Florida is pretty much a straight AC market).

In complete honesty, I happen to agree with your guy in his line of thinking...

That added reality is your neighbor is full of crap. Return on investment diminishes greatly from 15 to 16 SEER, and I only wanted to go with a 16 SEER two stage system so I could run some experiments with my whole house dehumidifier tied into the system (old system was 13 SEER single stage variable speed).

Please note, best system to save money IMO is geothermal, and they are rated by EER, not SEER, but they can have a substantially higher install cost.

The sales mantra on high end selling for HVAC is over 16 SEER you aren't selling return on investment, you're selling comfort.

Thus the reason why I want to do some humidity readings with a 2 stage variable speed system now with and without the dehumidifier.

You're right Sig, it's not a split system but an AC with a heat pump as well, it can reach into the 30's in January.

That's what our guy said, the ROI (return on investment) in the higher seer doesn't see a return for 12-15 years and that's a full timer. Thx