4320 Coolant Leak from Timing Cover advise please

[gbw]

The water pump issue I had is corrected. My tractor is a 4320, 2006 model, 950 hrs. I love it.

HOWEVER: I still have a leak, around the timing cover. Sealant (no gasket used), has failed. The Deere dealer estimates 16 - 22 rs. at $120 per, or nearly $3000 plus parts (if any). To basically install a gasket. Evidently they have one now.

To do this, seems the front axle and oil pan have to be removed before the timing cover can be removed. Does anyone know why the oil pan has to come off? something about a pickup tube but Im not clear why it as to be removed to allow the timing cover to come off. Its obvious why the axle as to come off if the pan does, the pan also serves as the rear front axle pivot support.

Front axle doesn't look too difficult, just careful setup and procedure. It's heavy.

But what about the pan? Once axle is gone, remove all pan bolts including those through the frame rails and 2 behind the bell housing. Pan looks like its must be very heavy, once bolts are gone does it come down easily or must the rails be spread? Any other tips? I'd be very grateful. Book says to remove engine but I cannot see that this is necessary.

I've seen other treads on this but I want to ask in case any new ideas or experience out there. Thanks,

 

[beenthere]

Reads like you are considering/planning doing this work yourself. Hope you take pics and bring us along for the ride.

 

[jd110]

There are several methods that can be used to disassemble. The oil pan does need to come off. The oil pump is in the timing cover and the pickup tube is also bolted to the cover as well as bolted to the bottom of the engine block that can only be accessed by removing the pan. We have found that in our shop it works best by unbolting the frame from sides of oil pump and then you can roll front axle and frame away from the engine. Then oil pan and pickup tube can be removed. Then remove the timing cover. You will want to get a gasket to reinstall the cover. Deere now offers a gasket to replace the sealant that is proving to be a more reliable seal. There is a gasket kit made. Part number RE547148 for around $150.00. includes all gaskets and seals to do this repair.

 

[brad5541]

There are several methods that can be used to disassemble. The oil pan does need to come off. The oil pump is in the timing cover and the pickup tube is also bolted to the cover as well as bolted to the bottom of the engine block that can only be accessed by removing the pan. We have found that in our shop it works best by unbolting the frame from sides of oil pump and then you can roll front axle and frame away from the engine. Then oil pan and pickup tube can be removed. Then remove the timing cover. You will want to get a gasket to reinstall the cover. Deere now offers a gasket to replace the sealant that is proving to be a more reliable seal. There is a gasket kit made. Part number RE547148 for around $150.00. includes all gaskets and seals to do this repair.

I'm in the process of doing this repair. I have the gasket kit from deere but had a couple of questions is there any way to leave the ac compressor and lines hook up? It looks like there might be enough room for the cover to come off. Also with the deere kit it looks like there's 2 oil pan gaskets any idea where the other gaskets goes?

 

[oldtimer 66]

I have posted on this repair a couple of times. I did it on my 4320/ 2006 model at about 1000 hrs. I now have 2500 Hrs on the tractor. Let me see how to repost this. Before I forget do install the thin brass shim if the cylinder head mating surface looks ok, that is not eroded from coolant. Installing that shim just adds another surface to leak.

 

[oldtimer 66]

Another quick post you do not need to disconnect ac lines and or the oil coolant lines and its radiator. There is sufficient room to remove the fan assembly. Let me look for the details. one more thing you may want to replace the engine coolant fan bearing arrangement.

 

[oldtimer 66]

GBW and Brad5541 see if you can search for this post by using this title,

Coolant leaking John Deere 4320 4520 4720 compact tractor.​

If not let me know and I can repost the material. I contains most of the important details for the repair. It a little wordy and I was a little annoyed that my JD tractor would need this amount of work to fix a coolant leak.

 

[oldtimer 66]

The second oil pan gasket is for the 5 cylinder version of this engine.

 

[oldtimer 66]

No need to remove the engine. There are 2 bolts from the bell housing that connect to the oil pan. They need to be removed to be able to remove the oil pan. I did not need to spread the frame rails, the pan dropped right down. It is heavy at 55 lbs. You need to clean the frame rails along side the oil pan. A lot of dirt and debris in there. If you don't get it all out it will drop into the oil pan on dis assembly and be there for the re assembly. I did what what a thought was a good job on the cleaning but I still needed to do more after the oil pan was removed. I washed out the oil pan before re assembly to remove the oil staining. There is a yellow sealant/paint applied to the casting before machining. You notice how much longer the engine oil appears to stay clean after running the tractor.

 

[oldtimer 66]

More thoughts, since you have the front axle out it would be a good time to replace the pivot support bearings and thrust washer. They are a nylatron type of material. A reinforced nylon 66, I think. And also maybe replace the fan belt and tensioner. I did.

 

[oldtimer 66]

GBW and Brad5541 here is another post on the coolant leak problem. See if you can search for this post also. It has more of my pictures. Let me know.

4720 Coolant Leak​

 

[brad5541]

More thoughts, since you have the front axle out it would be a good time to replace the pivot support bearings and thrust washer. They are a nylatron type of material. A reinforced nylon 66, I think. And also maybe replace the fan belt and tensioner. I did.

Thanks for this. I just ordered a new fan belt and tensioner today. I have everything disabled off the timing cover so tomorrow morning I will be pulling the front axle and oil pan. Another question after reading the service manual and it states I need alignment tool part jdg1660 for installing the timing gear cover? Is this needed?

 

[oldtimer 66]

brad5541, I don't remember needing a align tool but I will check. I did buy a puller I think for removing something. Let check on this and I will get back to you.

 

[oldtimer 66]

GBW and Brad5541, I wanted to get some more pictures to you. The problem area on the forward end cover that leaked was around the road course formed gasket near the water inlet. This gasket is the connection between the FEC and the cylinder head and that is where JD has you do some mickey mouse measuring and apply the brass shim. I think when my tractor was still under warranty the dealer replaced the upper radiator hose 2 times thinking that this was the problem. That is not the problem unless you have coolant erosion now on the cylinder head in the sealing area. The factory dimension are still valid. The major problem with this design is that they made the FEC out of aluminum and the engine block and cylinder head out of cast iron. On a temperature cycle the is a difference of about .020" plus that frets this connection between the FEC and the cylinder head causing the leak. I think it also erodes the other sealing surfaces at the water pump internally and around the oil pump area internally. Notice the rough as cast surface and JD expected this surface to seal with there mickey mouse formed nitrile? gasket. The groove is rough cast along with the eyebrow along the inside and outside of the groove. This area should have been machined at the factory. To remedy this finish problem I hand filed this eyebrow area smooth around the groove. I did not use a speed lock disk and or any power tool. I just wanted to keep the area flat with a good finish. This hand filing needs to be done but just to clean up with minimum metal removed. I think one of the pictures shows this surface after filing but I am not sure and I don't remember taking a finish picture of this area only the as cast surface. I am still going to look for that alignment tool but I don't think I ordered it. Also depending upon how you disconnected the throttle you may need to access the ECM to reset the engine idle. Its set according to voltage/ like .5 to .7 volts. But if you need that info I think I can send it.

 

[oldtimer 66]

brad5541, details on the alignment fixture for the FEC. The alignment tool is shown in JD instruction RE547689. It is called JDG1660 alignment tool. It is some how used to align the FEC. I did not purchase it. It is not shown being used only written about. Now it is also shown as a "timing gear cover front seal installed tool". Maybe it is designed to to 2 operations but like I said I did not purchase it. I only purchased the damper puller DO1206AA @ approx. $30. You should have the instruction RE547689 to do this job. It details the process, disassembly, inspection, reassembly, torque turn hardware, measurements, parts list and tooling list. I got it from my John Deere dealer. Let me know if you need it.

 

[brad5541]

brad5541, I don't remember needing a align tool but I will check. I did buy a puller I think for removing something. Let check on this and I will get back to you.

Thanks I got everything apart today. I'm going to clean everything today and start putting it back together. I will look closely at the L shaped gasket area. Here's some pictures

 

[oldtimer 66]

Looks like you have a nice shop there. How many hrs on the tractor? The reason I ask is the front tires look worn out. The only thing I was hesitant about when I reinstalled the FEC was getting the governor linkage aligned correctly. The writeup calls to use two alignment pins/ bolts? to align the FEC. I had extra bolts because the kit contains new. I cut the heads off and and used them as alignment pins, at 2 places opposite each other around the crank bore area.

 

[oldtimer 66]

I will try and send you the RE547148 instructions.

 

[oldtimer 66]

 

[oldtimer 66]