Worn Tie Rod Ends

[bcs001]

I was doing my seasonal maintenance on a 3 year old 3620H and found both tie rod ends are loose at the ball coupling. Tractor has 250 hours and I have been relatively careful about not overloading the front end, turning to the stops and not turning while the tractor is stationary but they are still very loose. Talked with the dealer and found out this is only a 2 year warranty part and out of warranty for me. There is a beefed up factory replacement but they are $300+ per side which seems very over priced but not surprising in this current economic environment.

Has any one found an acceptable after market replacement that is less expensive? I know there have been a lot of broken parts probably from a combination of abuse and undersized design which is why the newer parts are beefed up. Thanks.

 

[K5lwq]

Are they loose in the joint or where it goes into the steering knuckle?

There was a problem on some older 20 series but not anything recent that I am aware of. They had an updated knuckle and tie rod for those that was done under a warranty service advisory.

 

[bcs001]

They are loose at the ball joint not at the knuckle.

 

[K5lwq]

It would take some research but if you determined the proper size for the knuckles you could cut the bad ones off and weld a replacement so it has the proper threads.

One side is left handed threads FYI. A lot of people fight getting those off thinking they both are right handed threads. Might be worth having a machine shop change the ends depending on your skills.

 

[K5lwq]

It would be easier just to pay the price though. Savings may not be much after all the work.

 

[bcs001]

Very doable. I'm an engineer and my son is a welder.
Thanks.

 

[ptsg]

Mine have some play as well. Not the outer tie rods but inner axial ones.

After some studying of the steering geometry, it looks to me that the steering has maybe 5 to 6 mm too much stroke. This is just me guessing by eye, it could me more.

So when one turns to full lock, due to the geometry built in, the cylinder will actually pull it further than the wheel can turn and this results on pulling the knuckle with it as well. You can see it flexing, if you look closely. This, over time, will result in wear on the inner tie rod.

One of these days, I'll put the a camera and record a small video, so you can see. I did it once with my cellphone but can't get steady enough.

I know this is a relatively minor issue on my axle but my tractor is a Narrow variation of the standard model, which uses a narrow axle, different style knuckles and different tie rod setup (same parts, just shorter). I suspect the US models suffer from the same issue but can't really prove it.

Again, this is just my theory based on my observations on my tractor.

 

[K5lwq]

Mine have some play as well. Not the outer tie rods but inner axial ones.

After some studying of the steering geometry, it looks to me that the steering has maybe 5 to 6 mm too much stroke. This is just me guessing by eye, it could me more.

So when one turns to full lock, due to the geometry built in, the cylinder will actually pull it further than the wheel can turn and this results on pulling the knuckle with it as well. You can see it flexing, if you look closely. This, over time, will result in wear on the inner tie rod.

One of these days, I'll put the a camera and record a small video, so you can see. I did it once with my cellphone but can't get steady enough.

I know this is a relatively minor issue on my axle but my tractor is a Narrow variation of the standard model, which uses a narrow axle, different style knuckles and different tie rod setup (same parts, just shorter). I suspect the US models suffer from the same issue but can't really prove it.

Again, this is just my theory based on my observations on my tractor.

This is my opinion as well. I love the short turning radius but that is the trade off I guess. I just try not to use it all as much as possible. But when needed it sure is nice.

 

[ptsg]

This is my opinion as well. I love the short turning radius but that is the trade off I guess. I just try not to use it all as much as possible. But when needed it sure is nice.

Oh absolutely!! That's one of my favorite things on this tractor. I'm always in tight places and I'm always amazed how easily I can sneak it in this tight spots. Much better and easier than my old Kubota B7000 which was like a third the size of this one.

I notice this steering deal early on, so I quickly developed that muscle memory of not going to full lock unless I really need it. It's just a natural thing now.

 

[Hay Dude]

Careful with those loose tie rod ends. I lost one, unexpectedly as I was doing some loader work last year on a slope. It’s not pretty when one tire just buries itself against the axle and you lose complete control of steering….

I lost some sleep thinking “what if that happened at road speed near cars on the road”?
I’m thinking I wouldn’t be typing this right now if it did.

 

[bcs001]

Careful with those loose tie rod ends. I lost one, unexpectedly as I was doing some loader work last year on a slope. It’s not pretty when one tire just buries itself against the axle and you lose complete control of steering….

I lost some sleep thinking “what if that happened at road speed near cars on the road”?
I’m thinking I wouldn’t be typing this right now if it did.

I asked my dealer about where they are most likely to fail and he told me they have not see one separate at the swivel joint but have had a few come in fractured between the joint and knuckle. This would make sense since the newer ones are much beefier in this area.

Where exactly did yours fail? did the joint separate or did the steel fracture?

 

[5030]

All over Flea Bay a lot cheaper and get them with grease fittings built in. Never hurts to grease them.

 

[5030]

I took my stock tie rod ends and drilled them and installed grease fittings. Been years ago and no slop what so ever.

 

[Hay Dude]

I asked my dealer about where they are most likely to fail and he told me they have not see one separate at the swivel joint but have had a few come in fractured between the joint and knuckle. This would make sense since the newer ones are much beefier in this area.

Where exactly did yours fail? did the joint separate or did the steel fracture?

Mine failed in the socket. It got wallowed out and popped off.
Scary

 

[Zork]

I was doing my seasonal maintenance on a 3 year old 3620H and found both tie rod ends are loose at the ball coupling. Tractor has 250 hours and I have been relatively careful about not overloading the front end, turning to the stops and not turning while the tractor is stationary but they are still very loose. Talked with the dealer and found out this is only a 2 year warranty part and out of warranty for me. There is a beefed up factory replacement but they are $300+ per side which seems very over priced but not surprising in this current economic environment.

Has any one found an acceptable after market replacement that is less expensive? I know there have been a lot of broken parts probably from a combination of abuse and undersized design which is why the newer parts are beefed up. Thanks.

My tie rod ends and upper plates were replaced under warranty. The tie rod holes in the upper turning plate were egged out of round, but I thought the tie rods appeared normal. The newer pins in the tie rod ends are substantially larger as is the plate.

 

[Zork]

...Has any one found an acceptable after market replacement that is less expensive? I know there have been a lot of broken parts probably from a combination of abuse and undersized design which is why the newer parts are beefed up. Thanks.

I overlooked this part of your post, sorry. They probably do not offer an aftermarket plate. Since this plate is in a down and dirty location I personally would not chance an aftermarket part due to the possibility of tolerance variations. If the top seal leaks, you'll have water and debris in the axle, same with the sealing of the lower flange if the upper plate is out of specs. Just my dos centavos that might be priceless.

 

[bcs001]

I overlooked this part of your post, sorry. They probably do not offer an aftermarket plate. Since this plate is in a down and dirty location I personally would not chance an aftermarket part due to the possibility of tolerance variations. If the top seal leaks, you'll have water and debris in the axle, same with the sealing of the lower flange if the upper plate is out of specs. Just my dos centavos that might be priceless.

I appreciate the info Zork. I have seen the replacement factory part and it is "beefier" than the tie rod that is on my 2021 model. I'm guessing the failure rate was/is high and pushed them to redesign. I'm going to replace both rod ends at the end of this season assuming they don't fail before then. I'm trying to minimize the steering loading by only turning while moving and not going to the stops.

 

[Smokeydog]

If you replace them be sure to grease them before installing. Might be able to sneak a blunt grease needle under the rubber boot.

Was disappointed that the newer of my tractors didn’t have grease zerks at these points and little if no grease OEM. Used a sharp grease needle to pierce the relative heavy rubber boot and fill with grease. A little grease goes a long way to prevent wear. Repeated after 500 hours and could tell there was still good grease at the joint. . No damage to the boot from injection points.

Some have added grease zerks. Much easier off the tractor than on.

Injected moly grease thru the boots for various constant velocity axle joints on many vehicles and ATVs. Have never had to replace joints after doing this.