Ok to bushhog a utility line ROW?

[Torvy]

It all depends on how it is written; but I've never seen one that had an expiration. Sure, there are ways to subordinate an easement (basically buy it out); but that's not really an option for a typical homeowner. Also many utilities require a easement be granted inorder to provide service to a property.

Yes. What actually happens and what is right are two entirely different things.

I'm saying it is not right for the utility to be able to perpetually use land which they do not own without payment to the owner of said land. A one time payment in history makes sense if they bought the land. I still had to pay for the land, but they get free use of it.

I understand they need perpetual use, I just think they should have to make perpetual payments for that usage. Either that or buy the land outright. I have to pay the taxes on it, not them. This, unfortunately, is an injustice that goes back many years and is unlikely to change.

 

[Jstpssng]

Yes. What actually happens and what is right are two entirely different things.

I'm saying it is not right for the utility to be able to perpetually use land which they do not own without payment to the owner of said land. A one time payment in history makes sense if they bought the land. I still had to pay for the land, but they get free use of it.

I understand they need perpetual use, I just think they should have to make perpetual payments for that usage. Either that or buy the land outright. I have to pay the taxes on it, not them. This, unfortunately, is an injustice that goes back many years and is unlikely to change.

Generally they do pay for it. The easement payment is to the original owner. When you buy the land, the easement or R/W goes with it, and should be referenced in your deed.

It's just like if a house lot is sold. You won't get paid for it again. Read your deed. Most likely it says something like "excepting said easement to... book +++page *.*

 

[Hay Dude]

I'd not hesitate to cut it. They'll probably thank you!

I get paid to do it!

 

[Torvy]

Generally they do pay for it. The easement payment is to the original owner. When you buy the land, the easement or R/W goes with it, and should be referenced in your deed.

It's just like if a house lot is sold. You won't get paid for it again. Read your deed. Most likely it says something like "excepting said easement to... book +++page *.*

Again, just because they do it that way doesn't mean it is right.

Since they don't own the land, paying a past owner to use it should not confer perpetual rights to the utility. There aren't other situations where you can do that. I can't put a restriction on my car title that says uncle Bubba can use it on Saturdays to go fishing. If Hay Dude sells his tractor, the utilities don't get to keep using it to mow the easement. We have accepted this moronic system as somehow normal.

 

[WM75Guy]

It all depends on how it is written; but I've never seen one that had an expiration. Sure, there are ways to subordinate an easement (basically buy it out); but that's not really an option for a typical homeowner. Also many utilities require a easement be granted inorder to provide service to a property.

We have easements for water lines going to injection wells across our West Texas property that have a 10-year expiration. If the company wants to extend it they can for another 10 years, by paying the same price. If not, they have to remove the pipes.

 

[Hay Dude]

The big utility companies are a real curious bunch.
I took over farming under several acres of powerlines from a retired farmer 15 years ago.

Not a peep from the power company. No contracts, no rent, nothing.

On the next parcel east of the one I’m faming, there’s an overgrown, vacant parcel. They pay Asplundh thousands to come in and clear it every 3 years or so.

I called the same power company and asked them if I cleared it, FREE of CHARGE, would they allow me to farm it?

They told me yes they would me to farm it for $200/acre said young lady on the other end of the phone. I was speechless….what a bargain .

You allow free farming on one parcel, but on the next, you want $200/acre? And I’m saving you from all your cutting costs?

No wonder our country is such a hopeless mess.

 

[DarkBlack]

So, the wording is the difference. A Right of Way is Not your property (the way it works in FLa)

That makes no sense.
A right of way across your property is a right of way across your property.
If it wasn’t your property, then you would have to have 2 separate legally deeded properties, with a 3rd property being the utility’s land

I’d be curious to see where you read that it operates this way in Florida

 

[TerryR]

I'm saying it is not right for the utility to be able to perpetually use land which they do not own without payment to the owner of said land. A one time payment in history makes sense if they bought the land. I still had to pay for the land, but they get free use of it.

They paid the price for perpetual use up front, to the then-owner. They could have obtained a limited use right, but didn't, and the then-owner agreed. In exchange he was accepting any future discount in sales price that might caused by the existence of the perpetual right-of-way when he sold the property.

When you bought the land it was subject to that use, which you knew about, or should have. You presumably adjusted your offer to account for whatever degradation in value that made on the property. So you accepted the price that had been paid for the perpetual use.

Property is bought and sold all the time subject to various encumbrances -- street and utility rights of way, life estates of someone, and home owner association rules, to name a few. To the extent those encumbrances reduce, or enhance, the value of the property the sales price is adjusted by the market.

 

[EddieWalker]

Where I'm at in East Texas, the Easement is just that. They Utility Company has the right to access your land within the Easement. For gas lines, it's usually 50 feet wide. Power lines seem to vary depending on what's there. They cannot exceed that width. You can do whatever you want on the surface of the land, but if you build anything on the easement, you risk it being destroyed if they ever have to work on the Easement. Fences are very common across Easements, but also roads and even buildings can be built on them, as long as you realize that they can tear them down if they need to do something there.

What's interesting to me is if they want to add to what is already there, they have to pay you for that surface land. You wont have any choice in selling it, but you can fight them for what they pay you for your it. With Gas Lines, they can add pumping stations when they want and you can't stop them. I'm not sure about Power Lines, but my guess is that they can do the same if they want to.

Mowing it is up to you. If it gets really bad, you can complain to them and they will be forced to come clean it up. If you are really good at selling yourself, you can even get them to pay you to clean it up. I know a guy who did that. He didn't make money, but he got it done on his terms and the guys he hired also did some other things for him, so it was a win-win.

When dealing with whoever is in charge of the Easement, remember that they can act like they own it, or you have to do what they tell you to do. That is just bluffing. They have to follow the rules in the Easement, and they are controlled by a Government Agency. Here in Texas, The Railroad Commission is in charge of the Utility Companies. If something is happening, or not happening, that you are not happy with, a phone call to the Government Agency in charge of that Utility will get you almost instant results. Their power is very impressive at getting things done!!!!!

I don't know the rules on spraying chemicals, but I would guess that if you do not want them sprayed on your land, it shouldn't be too hard to make that known. As far as what I've seen, everything is mowed by a Contractor that is hired by the Utility to maintain their Easements. They also fly over the Gas Lines a few times a year, and at least once a year, I see a couple of guys walking the Easements.

In this case, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. The more noise you make, the better they are at taking care of it. Or if you don't want them on your land, the more you do to keep the Easement mowed, the less you will see of them.

 

[paulsharvey]

We have easements for water lines going to injection wells across our West Texas property that have a 10-year expiration. If the company wants to extend it they can for another 10 years, by paying the same price. If not, they have to remove the pipes.

I'm familiar with that type agreement, but not as an easement, as a land lease; similar to cell tower leases

 

[paulsharvey]

Where I'm at in East Texas, the Easement is just that. They Utility Company has the right to access your land within the Easement. For gas lines, it's usually 50 feet wide. Power lines seem to vary depending on what's there. They cannot exceed that width. You can do whatever you want on the surface of the land, but if you build anything on the easement, you risk it being destroyed if they ever have to work on the Easement. Fences are very common across Easements, but also roads and even buildings can be built on them, as long as you realize that they can tear them down if they need to do something there.

What's interesting to me is if they want to add to what is already there, they have to pay you for that surface land. You wont have any choice in selling it, but you can fight them for what they pay you for your it. With Gas Lines, they can add pumping stations when they want and you can't stop them. I'm not sure about Power Lines, but my guess is that they can do the same if they want to.

Mowing it is up to you. If it gets really bad, you can complain to them and they will be forced to come clean it up. If you are really good at selling yourself, you can even get them to pay you to clean it up. I know a guy who did that. He didn't make money, but he got it done on his terms and the guys he hired also did some other things for him, so it was a win-win.

When dealing with whoever is in charge of the Easement, remember that they can act like they own it, or you have to do what they tell you to do. That is just bluffing. They have to follow the rules in the Easement, and they are controlled by a Government Agency. Here in Texas, The Railroad Commission is in charge of the Utility Companies. If something is happening, or not happening, that you are not happy with, a phone call to the Government Agency in charge of that Utility will get you almost instant results. Their power is very impressive at getting things done!!!!!

I don't know the rules on spraying chemicals, but I would guess that if you do not want them sprayed on your land, it shouldn't be too hard to make that known. As far as what I've seen, everything is mowed by a Contractor that is hired by the Utility to maintain their Easements. They also fly over the Gas Lines a few times a year, and at least once a year, I see a couple of guys walking the Easements.

In this case, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. The more noise you make, the better they are at taking care of it. Or if you don't want them on your land, the more you do to keep the Easement mowed, the less you will see of them.

Excellent discretion. In Florida the Public Service Commission regulates utilities, but 99.9% of people have never heard of them. Because they are monopolies, they have to meet certain levels of service and safety.

 

[Torvy]

They paid the price for perpetual use up front, to the then-owner. They could have obtained a limited use right, but didn't, and the then-owner agreed. In exchange he was accepting any future discount in sales price that might caused by the existence of the perpetual right-of-way when he sold the property.

When you bought the land it was subject to that use, which you knew about, or should have. You presumably adjusted your offer to account for whatever degradation in value that made on the property. So you accepted the price that had been paid for the perpetual use.

Property is bought and sold all the time subject to various encumbrances -- street and utility rights of way, life estates of someone, and home owner association rules, to name a few. To the extent those encumbrances reduce, or enhance, the value of the property the sales price is adjusted by the market.

And I say horsehockey. The buyer has zero leverage because you cannot evict them from the easement. All benefit goes to the original owner. It is a political boondoggle that will never be fixed because utilities have the time and money to keep state and federal officials on their side. At the very least, they should have to pay the property taxes on that acreage.

 

[paulsharvey]

And I say horsehockey. The buyer has zero leverage because you cannot evict them from the easement. All benefit goes to the original owner. It is a political boondoggle that will never be fixed because utilities have the time and money to keep state and federal officials on their side. At the very least, they should have to pay the property taxes on that acreage.

It's not just utility easements. You can buy 40 acres, put 35 into a conversation easement, and keep the cash, resell the entire 40; list it as 40; disclose the easwmenr, and that buyer is really basically getting 5 acres with 35 acres that range from a small asset or buffer, to a dang liability.

 

[Torvy]

It's not just utility easements. You can buy 40 acres, put 35 into a conversation easement, and keep the cash, resell the entire 40; list it as 40; disclose the easwmenr, and that buyer is really basically getting 5 acres with 35 acres that range from a small asset or buffer, to a dang liability.

Still political, just different politicians.

 

[Hay Dude]

In PA, we are supposed to have a special license to cut under/above utilities. I looked into the course. 1-day $400 and a long trip hours from home.
Oh well, 1 more thing the oppressors can cuff me for.

 

[paulsharvey]

In PA, we are supposed to have a special license to cut under/above utilities. I looked into the course. 1-day $400 and a long trip hours from home.
Oh well, 1 more thing the oppressors can cuff me for.

Hmm, I can see that for tree trimming; but mowing? Generally, you should avoid anything with 10-15 ft of a hot wire; but that is voltage dependent. Something like 120KV might be more like 20 ft; but those kinda lines are normally gonna have atleast 32-40 ft of aerial clearance above ground. There shouldnt be anything, even 7.2kv less than 18 ft above grade. Maybe the concern is a 10 ft tall tractor, mowing under a 18 ft sagging hot wire, and the potential of arcing? Seems like mostly regulatory BS.

Keep in mind 90% plus of people arent gonna be able to look at an aerial coax or fiber and tell the difference from a 3 phase primary power....

 

[Hay Dude]

Hmm, I can see that for tree trimming; but mowing? Generally, you should avoid anything with 10-15 ft of a hot wire; but that is voltage dependent. Something like 120KV might be more like 20 ft; but those kinda lines are normally gonna have atleast 32-40 ft of aerial clearance above ground. There should be anything, even 7.2kv less than 18 ft above grade. Maybe the concern is a 10 ft tall tractor, mowing under a 18 ft sagging hot wire, and the potential of arcing? Seems like mostly regulatory BS.

Keep in mind 90% plus of people are gonna be able to look at an aerial coax or fiber and tell the difference from a 3 phase primary power....

They are more concerned with gas lines buried in the ROWs we mow over with heavy equipment.

Having a stroke and crashing a large tractor with a square baler in tow might be a catastrophic situation

 

[TerryR]

And I say horsehockey. The buyer has zero leverage ...

That's simply not true. What's offered is what's offered. If you don't like what's offered, you can always buy a different property.

 

[ultrarunner]

Sister In Laws brother bought 6 acres and is building their home.

As part of due diligence the utility came out and marked a path for underground power.

Sister in laws brother had a sit down and the owner of the adjoining lower parcel agreed to a 5' easement at the line in exchange for a 10k payment.

While in escrow the neighbor died and the widow said no... that was with my husband.

Cutting to the chase they decided to go off grid but shows until it's a done deal it isn't... even when in writing and document ready to sign and record...

What comes around goes around as the proposed easement path owner had horses and they would ride through the 6 acres to parkland... now there is a fence around the 6 acres so the horses have to go around on a mile and a half semi busy road to get to the parkland...

 

[newbury]

And I say horsehockey. The buyer has zero leverage because you cannot evict them from the easement. All benefit goes to the original owner.

C'mon -
If I legally put a lake on my property, then sell it to you you get the lake.
It reads like YOU, Torvy, got stuck with an easement and don't like the way the world operates.
I can see problems with having to give up property because of a new easement being forced on you, but for an existing easement the potential buyer always has the option of NOT buying.
I've one lot of land that HAD an operating rail line running through it (for about 1,200 feet) when I bought it. A decade or so later the rail line was abandoned and now is a PUBLIC trail, stuff happens.