20lb Propane tanks - Can you fill from your home tank?

[3930dave]

Here's a good example of what "professionals" did:

Toronto propane explosion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Rgds, D.

 

[rider0]

Here's a good example of what "professionals" did:

Toronto propane explosion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Rgds, D.

How about a more recent example (today):

Cause of Fla. Gas Plant Blast Being Investigated - ABC News

 

[wmonroe]

Any of you guys ever own a propane powered tractor. You have to fill them from a bulk tank, you don't take them to town to refill each time they run out of fuel. The same way you would fill the tank on a propane tractor is how you would fill a small tank. A few have mentioned the bleed vent on the side of the valve as a way to vent the pressure. I have filled the 190 XT AC many times by venting from the vapor (a little screw on attachment to the vapor valve relieves the pressure to the air rather than the little flat screw on the tank. It took about 10 minutes to fuel the 50 gallon tank from the bulk tank. Of course you need to have the bulk tank with hose and fittings to fit the tank being filled and those are available for purchase (even the ones to fit the little Coleman gas tanks are available) You have to be real careful of sparks and such as butane/propane is heavier than air and the vapors will settle to the ground so you need to make sure that there is nothing close by that could set off the vapors.
I will repeat what Dave said, for most folks, it is better to invest in more small tanks than a bulk tank and refill capability. I don't use propane at home so my only option is spare tanks, I have 3 of them for my BBQ pit and always keep a full spare, when I put the 3rd bottle on the bit, the other 2 go for a refill.

I have a propane tractor and have thought about seeing what it would take to fill it up from my larger home tank.

 

[3930dave]

There are at least a few people on TBN who strike me as smart and careful enough to do propane transfers.

That said, just about any fuel can create a significant incident. Where people get into trouble with propane is they don't know about/ignore/downplay the heavier than air/pooling aspect of the fuel.

One guy a few years back in Toronto knew he had a problem with propane on his catering truck. Thought he was OK when he parked it outside of his house. Unfortunately for him,it was an older house, with a garage under the house - driveway sloped down to the basement level garage door. Propane ran down the driveway, under the garage door, and pooled in the garage. Made the news that year.

I like propane as a fuel, but it is not for nothing that propane vehicles are banned from parking underground, or using tunnels in many jurisdictions.

Rgds, D.

 

[teejk]

Propane is heavier than air. A propane semi-driver in NY fell asleep at the wheel a few years ago and hit a bridge support that essentially created a large carpet bomb wiping out more than a few houses (the driver was a crispy critter). I'm stuck with LP in my new house (boiler, hot water, fireplace and cook-top) but I added a line to the grill (with multiple shut-offs) thinking I could direct connect. That would be pressure regulated gas from the tank to service everything in the house and then out to the grill that would come into its own regulator. My LP supplier initally wanted no part of it. Their big fear is that somebody would get too many beers and somehow forget to shut things off or the connection would fail since grills are not that permanent, draining the entire 500 gal tank. He finally said they could figure something out with break away connections and such. I contacted Weber and they said "no-way" but I'm sure their customer rep didn't know what they were talking about.

Now all that said, I used to go to a spot that filled my tanks on site while I waited. It was not a high-tech operation by any stretch of the imagination (a scale and a bulk tank). I run a lot of LP through my gas grill and smoker and I think I could get another tank from the co-op dedicated to re-filling the smaller tanks without a rental charge if I put a certain amount through it every year. I just got summer fill today for the house/shop and see it's about $1.40 gal. That would equate to about $5 if I could re-fill my own tanks??? Certainly beats the $19 I pay to exchange the tanks 20 miles away (it's not so much the money...it's the inconvience).

So I'm going to follow this thread. I have room to place a tank away from anyplace it will hurt anything and I have a few friends that all have gas grills and if I can figure out how to do this effectively, we will all save a lot of miles.

 

[wmonroe]

So I'm going to follow this thread. I have room to place a tank away from anyplace it will hurt anything and I have a few friends that all have gas grills and if I can figure out how to do this effectively, we will all save a lot of miles.

That's why I'm watching too, I only have to fill my tractor 2-3 times a year and it would be a lot more convenient not to have to load it on the trailer and take it. Of course if I could fill it at home I might use it more too.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

Consider placing your bulk tank at a higher elevation than the ones you are filling. LP is heavy, let gravity assist in the filling. Also that assures you can get all the liquid out of the bulk tank. Tanks at the same level will equalize in the liquid height and that is the end of the flow. That is unless you have a pump like the commercial ops do. On the farm or ranch; you do not want to mess with a pump system, unless you are a big operation and do a lot of transfers. I have done this type transfer often and have experienced the equalization so made a rack to hold the bulk tank upside down 3' Higher than the top of the largest tank to be filled. Works great then.

Ron

 

[Gary Fowler]

That's why I'm watching too, I only have to fill my tractor 2-3 times a year and it would be a lot more convenient not to have to load it on the trailer and take it. Of course if I could fill it at home I might use it more too.

When we had the brand new at the time 190XT Allis Chalmers, we had a 1000 gallon Butane /propane ( they fill them with 90% butane and 10% propane) tank for tractor use. At that time, the Butane dealer furnished the tank and all the fittings and hoses to fill the tractor. The 190XT would burn about 100 gallons of fuel per day when pulling a heavy disc so the thousand gallons was just about one weeks worth of fuel. Nothing dangerous about fueling a butane tank as long as you follow the procedure and use some good leather gloves to protect your hands from the cold liquid when you disconnect the hose. Pressure bleed off is needed to keep the tractor tank pressure ( or any tank being filled ) lower than the supply tank since you don't have a pump on it. We would bleed it as it filled till it was about 85% on the gauge then stop the bleed off of pressure and let the tanks equalize, then close all the valves (one at end of the hose where your connection point is and another right at the tank as a double block set up.
Your propane dealer should be willing to install the hose, valves etc needed to fill your tractor for a price and then give you instructions on how to fill it. I would expect you to have to pay a fee for this since you are a small time user. It wouldn't surprise me a bit if now days you have to get some kind of certification in order to fill propane tanks due to all the frivolous lawsuits and big brother government BS now.

 

[oldtractors]

There is a lot of mis-information in this thread. I had my propane supplier add a wet line to my 500 gallon house tank. Put on a pair of gloves, attach the hose to your grill tank, open the valve. What is interesting about LP is that no matter how full the tank is, the pressure is nearly the same. You crack the bleeder on the small tank and the liquid fills it from the pressure differential. There doesn't have to be much difference in pressure to get the gas to flow. Gravity has nothing to do with it. The new tanks do have a float the shuts off the flow when they get full, but I don't really trust them. You fill until liquid comes out the bleeder. Don't smoke when you fill your tanks. Yes, propane is heavier than air. Gasoline liquid and vapor is also heavier than air. Gasoline is probably just as dangerous as LP, but everyone is used to gas. If you don't already have a liquid valve on your tank, you may have drain your tank to add one. The hose setup cost me about $120 installed. I have easily saved that by refilling my tanks. Because of the difference in safety valves on the tanks, some are quicker to fill than others. I have some that will fill in less than 5 minutes, others that take 15 minutes or more to fill.

 

[flyerdan]

We filled forklift tanks from a large tank at work. No pump, just pressure differential. When it was cold and the big tank was low it took quite a bit longer to fill than on a hot day with a full tank, as Boyle's law states.