220V electricity and 110V

[SPYDERLK]

Actually, I think, anybody doing that understands electricity more then most! I did this on our underground pump house to feed a light that indicates the pump is running. Very handy if you leave water running somewhere.

I guess the worst thing is the possibility of removing the ground at the panel and getting a shock off it if you are grounded. But the same thing can happen if disconnecting a neutral.

And like I said, it's not one transformer, it's adding more and more. They all make unnecessary heat which equates to watts. I don't mind paying for something I get use of, but this is just wasted energy 24/7, no matter how little.

I've thought about doing this for same application. BTW, I googled 220V pilot light and the first one I found was $4.29 AC 220V Red LED Power Indicator Pilot Single Light Lamp 22mm - Led Household Light Bulbs - Amazon.com

Other than getting a shock off a lifted ground (as you noted: same danger as a lifted neutral) the difference is that all the metal enclosures, boxes, frames, cases, etc. (i.e. the things people normally touch) connected to that ground system could also be lifted to 120V (which is a lot different than a lifted neutral (i.e. most people don't go touching the conductor inside the white wire).

Another purpose of a (green) equipment ground conductor is to drain static electricity. If you're running amps down the ground conductor to the earth grounded end, Ohm's Law says that anything connected to other end will have a voltage rise (including all earlier mentioned metal enclosures, boxes, frames etc..) that sensitive people, electronics, and large animals touch. This is not usually a large voltage rise (depending on conductor length, gauge (resistance) , and amperage), but could lead to some unintended consequences. (Wonder if pacemaker's would be susceptible to this? I know cows are more susceptible to mastitis in these cases grounds. - But I doubt you have them in your well house.

Im seeing that Industrial Toys is doing this on a pump line. One can reasonably assume thats a special case where the ground conductor is only exposed in the pumpswitch and the service panel where it could easily be labeled white. A ground rod at the pump would establish the ground at that location.

 

[buickanddeere]

I am all for the guys that get their hands dirty making a good $$$ or three. But since when does the CEO of Hydro One need a $150,000.oo/year car allowance + fuel allowance when he flies most of the places he goes for free? That is on top of the big buck$ he already makes to sit on his duff* and do absolutely nothing productive. *duff was not my first choice of words, but it will do

Hydro One policy is set by the who ever controls the Premier of the Province.

 

[buickanddeere]

Actually, I think, anybody doing that understands electricity more then most! I did this on our underground pump house to feed a light that indicates the pump is running. Very handy if you leave water running somewhere.

I guess the worst thing is the possibility of removing the ground at the panel and getting a shock off it if you are grounded. But the same thing can happen if disconnecting a neutral.

And like I said, it's not one transformer, it's adding more and more. They all make unnecessary heat which equates to watts. I don't mind paying for something I get use of, but this is just wasted energy 24/7, no matter how little.

Being cheap is not a free pass to wire something up wrong. If you can't afford a dollar a year to operate the transformer. We can take up a collection here at tbn.

 

[buickanddeere]

I thought when Maurice Strong appeared on the scene, that Hydro was saved, but his position as head of Hydro was short lived and I never really found out what happened.

It's always those that have it made for life, that make decisions so damaging for the rest of us.

How could Maurice Strong, half brother of former prime minister Paul Martian improve hydro ? When MS wasn't taking bribes and being kicked out of the United nations . He was promoting a pagan nature worship called Gaia. https://whatiscommoncore.wordpress....nable-development-and-his-religion-of-gaia-2/

 

[buickanddeere]

I sometimes cheat, if I need 110 on a 220 circuit, by using the ground wire as a return. Not to code and only for very small loads. I don't like the X-Former idea as it uses a little power all the time. No big deal, except there are dozens of such small energy stealers thoughout my place.

Ontario hydro hired forestry crews from upstate NY about ten years ago to maintain the lines around here. I guess, no one in Ontario can run a bucket truck and chain saw! Probably too expensive for WSIB coverage..

Now the lines are again overgrown and any amount of snow, ice or wind will ensure an outage. That's OK! I just ordered another 3000 litres of (cheap!) diesel for the genset. I don't even bother to call anymore, but it's funny because the crews usually pull in anyway, attracted by all the outside lighting.

Those men on the trucks have my utmost respect and deserve every penny they make. I can't say the same for all the bureacrats.

It's actually the loss of signal from the dead smart meter that sends a crew.

 

[buickanddeere]

I am all for the guys that get their hands dirty making a good $$$ or three. But since when does the CEO of Hydro One need a $150,000.oo/year car allowance + fuel allowance when he flies most of the places he goes for free? That is on top of the big buck$ he already makes to sit on his duff* and do absolutely nothing productive. *duff was not my first choice of words, but it will do

You are worried about $150,000 when the Ontario Liberals have wasted over 40 Billion to date with green energy scams ? And billions more per year until the 20 year contracts run out don't bother you ?
Divide 150,000 into 40,000,000,000 , which is the greater concern ?

 

[Industrial Toys]

I don't have any faith at all in that auto-reporting system at hydro based on experience but that is an interesting thing to remember. .

Maybe I am confusing Maurice strong with another head of hydro that Ithought might be the right man for the job. Or maybe I just believed some BS that I read. Heard on the news that charges have been laid in the gas plant scandal. Amoung them mischief charges. 1.2 billion dollars and a mischief charge!

I was trying to think when I have used a neutral inappropriately. I have a few times used the ground as a neutral for ceiling fans, when they only have switched power going to them, and you want the lights still controlled by the wall switch but want the fan to have constant power.

 

[Looking4new]

You are worried about $150,000 when the Ontario Liberals have wasted over 40 Billion to date with green energy scams ? And billions more per year until the 20 year contracts run out don't bother you ?
Divide 150,000 into 40,000,000,000 , which is the greater concern ?

I didn't know how many billion$ of dollars they wasted.

 

[aczlan]

I see your point. IF the ground were to break, the pump and other metal equipment could become live (through the light) when the pump is running. Probably not a fatality waiting to happen, but given the very dangerous wet environment, probably not a good idea. I will see if I can source a long life 220v bulb. The present 110v has been working for decades.

I can tell you from experience that you CAN get shocked from a properly connected neutral on a 120v system. Not as bad as getting bit by the hot side, but it's enough to wake you up.

Aaron Z

 

[CobyRupert]

I can tell you from experience that you CAN get shocked from a properly connected neutral on a 120v system. Not as bad as getting bit by the hot side, but it's enough to wake you up.

Aaron Z

Hmmm. If it's properly connected and bonded to ground in the panel the voltage rise on the neutral should only be half of the voltage drop in your wiring (i.e. for a single phase circuit, 1/2 of the voltage drop is in the hot leg).
So let's say the voltage drop is large (5%), the voltage rise (from zero) in the neutral should be half of this, or 2.5% of 120V = 3 volts. The human body can be 1000 - 100,000 ohms depending on your skin, insulation of your shoes, what your standing on/in, the resistance of earth, etc...that forms the circuit back to the transformer's neutral there should be less than 3mA of current.