dbdartman
Platinum Member
Believe me Ray, you're NOT the only one who subscribes to this theory!!!!
41 ATV fatalties in WV to date 2007
- Thread starter WVaHillbilly
- Start date
- Views: 5098
SnowRidge
Elite Member
I think ABS brakes make me a safer driver.dbdartman said:
I don't trust them at all, and if I had a choice, I would not have them on my vehicles.
the_sandman_454
Silver Member
I agree, at least to some extent on vehicle features leading to a false sense of security in those people who have not bothered to figure out exactly how it works, and why it works i.e. what it can and can't do.
One morning after an ice storm I came upon a guy in a shiny red brand new pickup truck located solidly in a big farm drainage type ditch. I skated my way over to check if everything was ok. The guy's first words were "4wd doesn't help you turn on ice"... Yeah no crap dude. Some people just blindly assume things will help when they really will not without making an effort to educate themselves on it. The absolute basics. How hard is it to teach "never do more than one of the following at a time: Steering, Braking, Accelerating, otherwise you will run out of traction and lose control of the vehicle." Nobody "gets it".
Personally I absolutely hate ABS, I think it's among the worst things invented, because people assume it's a miracle stopping method. In many cases it takes longer to stop a vehicle with ABS versus regular brakes with a skilled driver. Still I see tons of vehicles just flying up to intersections in the winter time with no thought of slowing down before they get within 100 feet or so of it and slide right through when the roads are bad.
I think the real problem isn't that people who understand how it works think it means they can take more chances. The problem is the people who have no clue what it does beyond what the ads say, think they can drive like a professional stuntman/driver and don't have the skill or luck to make it work. Basically it still boils down to very stupid people who take stupid chances because they are not intelligent enough to understand how various "safety" features work.
As for drivers' training, I think it is not nearly stringent enough nor does it cover all situations. I personally think everyone should still learn to drive a manual transmission, everybody should get to spend some time training on a slick track (at least in those climates that include snow and ice) to practice vehicle skid recovery, etc, and so forth. These days it seems to be about doing whatever we can to easily, and quickly churn out a new batch of horrible drivers as fast as possible. I still see people who can't freakin' merge onto the expressway due to being too timid or whatever. Mash that throttle, match the speed of traffic, and slip into the nearest gap. What's so hard about that? Yet many people can't seem to figure out how to do it.
Back to the ATV subject, I think people just don't have a real understanding of what the safety gear can and cannot do, just like they don't understand ABS brakes are not more effective than regular brakes with a good driver. A helmet is a good idea, but it's not going to necessarily save you if you hit a low hanging solid branch at 45mph or something. Lack of training is another thing. It will never change and people will just claim to be victims instead of taking charge themselves, and learning how to safely do things. Sadly that's the way of the future, I don't see any reversing it. It was all the big bad ATV's fault, not the idiot without the proper training and experience to be doing what they're attempting.
One morning after an ice storm I came upon a guy in a shiny red brand new pickup truck located solidly in a big farm drainage type ditch. I skated my way over to check if everything was ok. The guy's first words were "4wd doesn't help you turn on ice"... Yeah no crap dude. Some people just blindly assume things will help when they really will not without making an effort to educate themselves on it. The absolute basics. How hard is it to teach "never do more than one of the following at a time: Steering, Braking, Accelerating, otherwise you will run out of traction and lose control of the vehicle." Nobody "gets it".
Personally I absolutely hate ABS, I think it's among the worst things invented, because people assume it's a miracle stopping method. In many cases it takes longer to stop a vehicle with ABS versus regular brakes with a skilled driver. Still I see tons of vehicles just flying up to intersections in the winter time with no thought of slowing down before they get within 100 feet or so of it and slide right through when the roads are bad.
I think the real problem isn't that people who understand how it works think it means they can take more chances. The problem is the people who have no clue what it does beyond what the ads say, think they can drive like a professional stuntman/driver and don't have the skill or luck to make it work. Basically it still boils down to very stupid people who take stupid chances because they are not intelligent enough to understand how various "safety" features work.
As for drivers' training, I think it is not nearly stringent enough nor does it cover all situations. I personally think everyone should still learn to drive a manual transmission, everybody should get to spend some time training on a slick track (at least in those climates that include snow and ice) to practice vehicle skid recovery, etc, and so forth. These days it seems to be about doing whatever we can to easily, and quickly churn out a new batch of horrible drivers as fast as possible. I still see people who can't freakin' merge onto the expressway due to being too timid or whatever. Mash that throttle, match the speed of traffic, and slip into the nearest gap. What's so hard about that? Yet many people can't seem to figure out how to do it.
Back to the ATV subject, I think people just don't have a real understanding of what the safety gear can and cannot do, just like they don't understand ABS brakes are not more effective than regular brakes with a good driver. A helmet is a good idea, but it's not going to necessarily save you if you hit a low hanging solid branch at 45mph or something. Lack of training is another thing. It will never change and people will just claim to be victims instead of taking charge themselves, and learning how to safely do things. Sadly that's the way of the future, I don't see any reversing it. It was all the big bad ATV's fault, not the idiot without the proper training and experience to be doing what they're attempting.
RayH
Banned
The biggest difference between standard brakes and ABS brakes is that with standard (non ABS) brakes, you slide into other objects or off the road. With ABS brakes, you just DRIVE into objects or the ditch.
4X4. Heres what I told my wife about using 4WD in the snow/ice. Its not there so you can go faster than 2WD vehicles on snow, its there so you can go slower and not get stuck.
I agree completely with the post above. Ive also done a little more reading on Risk Homeostasis and it is exactly what Ive believed for while now, I just didnt have a name for it.
4X4. Heres what I told my wife about using 4WD in the snow/ice. Its not there so you can go faster than 2WD vehicles on snow, its there so you can go slower and not get stuck.
I agree completely with the post above. Ive also done a little more reading on Risk Homeostasis and it is exactly what Ive believed for while now, I just didnt have a name for it.
