8N - 9N engine in a 2N chassis??

AKfish · Jan 30, 2008

My FIL has a 1944 2N tractor. He's 85 now but still gets out there and plows the place out when it snows and uses the tractor to put in a big, bejesus garden every spring.

The tractor is gettin' a bit like him --- a little tired and hard to start.

His question to me and my question to the folk's here on TBN that know somethin' about these old tractor's is --- will an engine from a newer 8N or 9N bolt up to the bell housing in the chassis of a 2N?

He's playin' with the idea of finding a newer engine and doin' a swap! (Most likely that will mean I'll be doing alot of the swappin' out and he'll be supervisin'!)

Any advice or info is much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

AKfish

Farmwithjunk · Jan 30, 2008

AKfish said:
My FIL has a 1944 2N tractor. He's 85 now but still gets out there and plows the place out when it snows and uses the tractor to put in a big, bejesus garden every spring.

The tractor is gettin' a bit like him --- a little tired and hard to start.

His question to me and my question to the folk's here on TBN that know somethin' about these old tractor's is --- will an engine from a newer 8N or 9N bolt up to the bell housing in the chassis of a 2N?

He's playin' with the idea of finding a newer engine and doin' a swap! (Most likely that will mean I'll be doing alot of the swappin' out and he'll be supervisin'!)

Any advice or info is much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

AKfish

9N is actually OLDER than a 2N. All but for a very few minor details, 9N and 2N are essentially the same tractor. During WWII, price controls wouldn't allow manufacturers to raise prices on models that were same as previous years. Ford, like a lot of the manufacturers of the day, simply changed a few minor details, changed the model designation from 9N to 2N, then adjusted prices. (Deere had a model "G". To sidestep wartime price restrictions, they made a few minor changes and called it a model "GM", then raised their price)

No where in Ford records was it ever made "official", but logic and reason has led everyone to believe 9N stood for start-up date of 1939, where 2N stood for start-up date of 1942. 8N's started production in 1948 (1947 actually, but as 1948 models)

9N/2N are same. Someone with more knowledge on the subject can tell you specifically about 2N/9N interchange-ability with 8N.

Soundguy · Jan 30, 2008

Yep.. as FWJ said.. the 2n is just an updated 9n. And the bellhousing onthe 8-2-9N are the same.. The engine is practically the same for the 8/2/9 untill you hit the side mount distribuitor.. but even then, it is pretty much the same block with a different cam and timing cover and some other changes onthe front of the engine.. etc.

So yeah.. if you can find an n engine from another tractor.. or a combine / stationary power unit.. go for it.

'Bout the only differences you may have to work around is if you cange from front mount to side mount make sure you get the side mount genny as well, as the front mount genny won't fit on the side mount block.. ( or convert to alternator.. etc.. )

soundguy

ToadHill · Jan 30, 2008

It's almost as easy to rebuild the engine as it is to change it. I'll bet the maine issue is it needs a new set of rings. If it's not popping thru the exhaust or the carb, and it starts hard, it's rings.

Soundguy · Jan 30, 2008

A wet/dry comp test will tell rings or valves.. etc..

soundguy

AKfish · Jan 31, 2008

Thanks for the info and the detail on tractor history. I sure don't know much about the tractor lines or the models that were built back when... what I know you could put in yur' eye and it wouldn't make ya blink!

Nonetheless, he called me a night or two ago and said he was crawlin' around in the snow at about 10F and managed to replace the condensor and get 'er goin'.

Got everything plowed out! But he was cussin' that front mounted distributor and said he'd sure like to have the later engine with the side mounted ignition location.

So, he's not lookin' to overhaul the 2N. He wants somethin' that is easier to work on.

Never thought of the generator --- that could be a twist to the undies!

So... the 9N has the front mounted distributor and we need to keep our eyes open for a 8N.

Thanks again for the feedback.

AKfish

ToadHill · Jan 31, 2008

You need to keep an eye on a 8N of 1951 or later vintage the early 8N's still had front mount distributors. Go to ytmag.com the guys on that site know almost as much about old iron as Soundguy. I know their are places to buy reconditioned engines, and that may be something to look at.

Soundguy · Feb 3, 2008

I haunt ytmag, and there are some sharp cookies over there.

the front distribs aren't that bad.. but the front coils leave a bit to be desired. many of us have cooked up blank off plates to use a standard round coil onthe front distrib tractors and do away with the square coil. that and the proper gaskets onthe coil cover and the distrib cap.. and they are pretty good to go... I like em for the ease of removal and timeing and points while setting in a comfy chair vs bent over the tractor .. etc..

soundguy

AKfish · Feb 4, 2008

I'd be slack-jawed surprised if my FIL has anything close to the right gasket for the distrib. He'd look at that as bein' way too persnickity. Details... smeetails.

He's got a front mounted dozer-blade and metal tracks for his 2N. There's a bogey wheel just behind the front wheel that maintains tension on the tracks. He's used that tractor all over in the back country of Alaska huntin' moose and caribou.

But that distributor has been a pain-in-the-@ss for year's for him. Water pushing (or snow) thru the radiator and the fan throwin' it all around. Pretty soon it's runnin' on 2-3 or not runnin' (coil wet) at all.

I'm not sure how committed he is to actually pullin' the tractor apart and droppin' in a new motor ---- but at 85 --- just havin' him get somethin' between his teeth to chew on awhile is a good direction to go!

Gonna have to check out that ytmag forum.

AKfish

Soundguy · Feb 4, 2008

Sounds like you answered some of the problem.

Detail persnicketyness making you discard and not use the proper 25 cent gaskets onthe distrib cap then lets all that snow bing thrown by the fan get under the distrid cap and coil... the elctrons dancing around inthere don't like that...

Attention to detail will solve many of the nagging problems that people complain about on these front distribuitor fords. IE.. many people find it easier to complain about it for decades than to just use the correct 25 cent gasket that -may- actually solve the problem.

Good luck on the project. You have plenty of options.. IE.. rebuilt side or front mount engine.. PLUS going with either round or square coil... eve on the front mount. Could go with an electronic ignition if you want to convert to 12v.. ( i don't like the 6v version on the front mounts..typically the starter motor drags the voltage down in the start circuit to within a half volt of the cutout threshold for the transistor logic use dint he electronic ignition.. meaning you get unreliable starts whent he battery gets a little old or the cables gunk up.. etc... and that's not better'n points in my opinion.. etc.. )..

good luck.

soundguy