Another "too big?" thread

[DH44]

I'm looking at upgrading my current tractor within the next several months. Currently I have a 2009 Case DX45 HST with cab,FEL. Like many folks, I have acquired implements matched to its size- a 6' disc harrow, box blade, bucket, landscape rake, etc. We have 130 acres and since we bought it I have been "domesticating" more and more of it. Right now I spend most of my tractor time shredding the areas I can get to, and the pasture I've been improving (about 50 acres total). The 45 has been ok, especially with the number of mesquite trees you have to maneuver around, but it's over 1400 hours now and the hydraulics are feeling "tired". We also have cattle, so during the winter I'm feeding large 6x5 rounds and the tractor is struggling with them. I also disc and plant about 20 acres of wheat every winter.
I've looked at JD 75,85 and 100 HP and Kubota 75 and 105 HP models. One of the most essential things for me is a good cab and AC. It gets HAH where we are, and the trees are frequently hiding wasp nests that don't like being disturbed. The Kubota only has AC vents coming out of the console, no overhead ones in the cab like the DX45 does. I have a friend that has a 100 HP JD and he says the AC is fine, but he doesn't use his near as much as I do mine.
There are also some good deals on the 105 Mahindras to be found, but I have no experience with them and don't know anyone that has one.

I think a 75 would probably do, but I'm retiring in 5-7 years and I hope this is the last tractor I buy. We could end up with more acreage, so I don't want to undersize, but I don't want to get something too big to maneuver, either. I'm usually of the "more than you need" mindset, but not sure about how big to go.

 

[oosik]

Got to admit - I had to look up HAH. Didn't think you meant Healthcare Assoc of Hawaii, either.

My Kubota M6040 is open station and 64 hp. However - in the fall I go to my nearest neighbor - 4.5 miles south and help him with the hay and wheat harvest. There I will get to drive large, cabbed air conditioned tractors. He has JD and Versatile in the 250-350 hp range. During fall harvest it can get to be HAH here, in our context. I'm amazed at the difference in the air conditioning between the JD and the Versatile. Quite honestly - I DO NOT like either. The cold air is blowing on me like an arctic blast out of PT Barrow and the sun comes in thru the massive glass windows - seems to get magnified and gets burning hot.

I've been in Houston once, in July. So I have a weeks experience with the heat AND humidity down there.

North Texas might be a bit less humid - Houston almost did me under. Having gone from Anchorage, AK where I lived. I was there for a week long meeting.

I am sure glad that, most of the time here, open station is very comfortable. We have our stinging bee types but not the ground dwelling type or the type that build nests in my pines. I can honestly say - I have never been bothered by any type of bee while operating my tractor on my 80 acres.

Because I have first hand experience with the two brands of tractor and their unique AC systems - recommend that you spend time, at the dealership, testing out the AC systems. This will be a MAJOR purchase, at least in my book, and I think you need time in each unit to experience "how it fits".

You know - I don't think we ever hear much from the fellow who says - Oh, H E L L yes, the tractor I just purchased is too big. Its usually the opposite.

Good luck in your search. I hope you find the perfect unit. I know for a fact - my M6040 is the last tractor I will own.

 

[MickeyDBC]

If you buy a new one over 74HP you are going to have to mess with DEF (diesel exhaust fluid) and that is a whole nother can of worms. Couple of vendors try to work around it using tons of EGR but that just dumps a lot more carbon into the engine and oil system. DEF is mostly good if you run the machine a lot (don't let it sit for a couple of weeks), but unless you run it hard and almost daily expect problems. We have 85 acres and I went with a Kioti RX7320 (about 40K with a loader) with the cab and powershuttle transmission. AC has overhead vents and works very well here in hot and humid central Texas, and the loader will lift almost 4K so hay will not be a problem. I am eventually going to get another bigger tractor for some future projects, but it will be a pre-emissions one like a Deere,

 

[crashz]

Since I'm spending your money, I would suggest the biggest and best. Go with a 100+ HP rig with at least a loader and cutter of your choice. And keep the Case too.

The reasons are multi fold:
- You may not get much in trade for the Case. Or at least what it could be worth to you.
- If you have some help, you could get the cutting done more than twice as fast.
- The 100 HP rigs will likely not be HST, and your current rig could be handy for delicate loader work like stalls and such.
- If you acquire more land, the larger tractor will help, but combined with the your current tractor you'll have more tools to chose from.
- You only need to upgrade implements that you need immediately for the larger machine such as the loader and cutter. The Case could handle the rest as needed.

I realize this is perfect world circumstances, and I'm the type of guys that thinks that if one tractor is good, ten is even better! But I think if you start looking at numbers, maybe it will come out as a wash.

 

[kthompson]

As to slow hydraulics something is either wrong or more likely you have just gotten use to the tractor, my opinion. I had a 68 HP (m6800) kubota with open station. Farmed just short of 40 acres of corn or soybeans. I bought a JD 5525 with about 91 hp engine. You are talking about same percentage increase. I only planted row crop one or two years after getting the JD and did not get any larger implements but used those I did with the Kubota. Only exception was with the chisel plow was able to reinstall two shanks had to remove for the Kubota. What I found was I was riding heavier tractor (with cab and cold air) and air seat that was much smoother. The other thing was I picked up for such as disking or using field cultivator was my best guess at least two mph which percentage was is about 40 to 50% which is impressive. Running planters no improvement as planters were already being run at max speed.
I do think you will end up with bigger disk for a 6 foot is small for even 75 hp. At least here.

 

[Turbys_1700]

I just upgraded from a Workmaster 50 to a New Holland t4.75 so that I could get into a cab. I traded in a 2016 for a 1000 hour 2012. That model is New Holland's top seller. The comforts of a cab with the added longevity of a hydraulic shuttle and competitive pricing all add up to a good selling unit. I currently have 100 acres that the neighbor cuts hay off of about 70 but at his age that could be problematic in a year or two. Another farm of about 45 acres that requires bush hogging of about 15 acres or so. So far I am very pleased with my purchase. I would suggest what ever you get go with a hydraulic shuttle or power shift. Not aware that Mahindra has those options in that big of a tractor.

 

[DH44]

Thanks for all the good info. I had considered keeping the Case, but wasn’t thrilled about having to maintain two- and barn space would have to be expanded as well.
I have heard from a lot of guys that the air seat is worth every penny. A lot of my pasture is rough from grubbing years ago, but I’ve been gradually smoothing and dragging over the years. The Case will turn your kidneys to jelly after a long day bush-hogging.
Think I’ll check out a 75 Kubota and Case and Mahindra. My Case dealer now carrries Mahindra, too.
I wasn’t aware DEF was a problem if it sat. I am only at the ranch pretty much every weekend, so it would never sit more than a couple of weeks.

 

[searcyfarms]

agreed on maintaining and space - more motors/tires means a lot of things - just traded personally because my dad is 80 and needed something to get in/out easier and not having the $$ to buy for himself, I made it happen and told mom - were doing this......he was so surprised and has a new spring in his step like a kid - get the air ride seat worth EVERY penny - drive and test for noise/AC - I help maintain over 400acres of CRP ground for others and we have 80acres of row crop. That cRP is tall/thick when mowing time comes around not to mention 2 yrs of growth - no 100hp tractor is going to handle that w/out slow mowing and watching temps - trust me I know. 15' batwings are what we run. Personally I went w/out an FWA - why, I never mow when wet, turns tighter, easier to see w/out tires blocking view of where im going, I don't feed cattle in the winter, I don't row crop very much just a little here/there and with that big of a tractor I have duals if needed I can slap on, it weighs plenty for what I have to do. I don't play in the mud, we rarely get enough snow to mess with and I have a skid steer for that. I do have a loader for it for dad as he likes to piddle around with that stuff and push trees/brush around fields. It our only tractor - what is it? Its a 5088 IH 135 to 140 PTO HP - I wanted to get a 7120/7220 but $$ and trading for a different sub compact kept me from that. Its very quiet, its very smooth with the air ride seat, the A/C in it is wonderful and is cold for sure!!! Never lack for power yet. yes its a 35 y/o tractor but whoa...............it even has a cup holder and I can listen to Bott Radio Network all day while mowing. I would look at the 5130/5140 Case IH, I would consider a MX110/120 - if you have a case ih dealer sitting there those are all great units and cold/quiet w/fwa if you want it - they are out there I have looked at a bunch of them - if you are wanting new...........so many options, no budget was mentioned do you have one? only units with over 75hp I believe are required to use DEF? I have heard Kubota are nice, will always stand behind the IH and Case IH stuff I have owned and ran. Not a clue regarding Mahindra. If size and weight are a concern, go with the FWA, u will want it from time to time pulling things and if you ever get in the mud. No perfect tractor, FWA and 2WD have their plus/shortcomings.

 

[BMan2005]

If you had good service with your Case and your dealer then look into the Case C models. It's the twin to the New Holland T4 series and I absolutely love the T4 series New Holland's which are just blue Case's and vise versa. They have one of the best cabs imo.

 

[EddieWalker]

No personal experience, but a cab tractor is going to be my next big purchase after I finish paying off my wife's mini van.

Guy I bought hay from has three cabbed Deere's that are all M models and he swears that they are the best machines on the planet. He might be right, the M model is very impressive. No problems keeping cool while working all day long in the summer. He also just bought a brand new E model open cab that he doesn't care for. He calls it the Economy tractor that is used for loading bales at the house, but will never be used to do real work. I would be hesitant to buy a cabbed E model Deere if you are doing serious work.

My neighbor loves his Zetor. I always considered them to be kind of on the low end of things, but he has 240 acres and a 15 foot bush hog that he runs all day long during the summer and he loves it. I'll look at when I'm ready to buy, but I'm still hesitant.

Mahindra hundred HP tractors are made in Korea, and that means better quality then India in my opinion. I saw a used 105s for sale that was very tempting. If I had just a little more cash at the time, I might have gone into debt for it.

Kubota is king for a reason, but you pay for them being number one. I know they had some AC issues awhile ago, but that they where actually talking to owners and working on ways to improve their AC systems. Every time I decide to by something, from small tractor, to zero turn, to side by side, I always go to Kubota first, get a price, look at what they have, and then go to the other brands to compare. I've never bought Kubota, but it was always in my top three after looking at everyone.

Case kind of scares me. I have a 1988 Case bull dozer that they no long support. They just decide that it's not worth while to keep parts for it, so good luck finding them on your own. That mentality in a major company is disappointing. They sell their Farmall and other line of tractors, but they seem to be pushing Mahindra over their own brand. To me, this is just odd, and it makes me wonder whats wrong with their brand of tractor? Sadly for me, I just love that shade of red on the Case tractors. I don't want to make my decision on paint color, but I would be lying if it wasn't a strong pull for looking at Case when it's time to buy.

On the same note on paint color, LS is just the ugliest shade of blue that I've ever seen. The Zetor dealer also sells LS, so I might take a look, but I can't see having to look at one of them for the rest of my life.

I don't think that I would even look at any other brands.

 

[searcyfarms]

fyi - I am looking at compacts and I just was informed LS makes the CNH and FNH compact tractors - while I am sure they are spec'd a lil different still the LS blue has underpinnings of red and blue outside of their own shade.......

I too am partial to Red/Green as they are what I grew up on and learned on and they were built reliable - it was hard to convince a farmer that anything mechanical was better than the reliability of a horse back in the day so they built them that way for a reason, now its about comfort/fuel economy/ergonomics reiliability has taken a hit due to complexity of the intelligence - I just purchased my first cabbed tractor and well, its a true joy - the novelty of sitting in the hot sun and picking up round/square balls every 20 feet has worn off over the years but it still is the root of who we are. Im tough and I can take the heat, but do I need to?

So dad at 80 is taken care of now and can live out whats left of his life in the cabbed one and enjoy every second of it. I am blessed to be able to help that come true for him.

So while you are looking I would look at LS - they are Korean I think still researching and looks like I have a dealer within an hour of me - have a call into them to discuss things but I like you am partial to the red stuff in ways. I do see the deck on the Farmall/Boomer looks fabricated vs stamped like the deere, THAT is something I like the looks of. I am definitely checking into that more.

I cant say enough about an AIR RIDE seat - ive never owned one until a month ago and OH MY !!! like riding in a Lincoln.......I would have said caddy but im a ford guy and never owned one but I do have my share of experience with Lincolns

 

[Deerherd]

I have a P series LS and It has been basically problem free for 5 years and 600 hours. I see there are a few P7040 CPS tractors still hanging around and if I wanted/needed another large tractor, I would pick one up in a heartbeat. No DPF and compares favorably with a Deere M series feature wise at a substantial savings.

 

[Rm9610]

I don’t know where you live in north Texas I live north of Denton tx. I farm an do dirt wort, land clearing. Would like to help you if your interested.

 

[LightningCamaroGuy]

No problems keeping cool while working all day long in the summer. He also just bought a brand new E model open cab that he doesn't care for. He calls it the Economy tractor that is used for loading bales at the house, but will never be used to do real work. I would be hesitant to buy a cabbed E model Deere if you are doing serious work.

Why? Would you hesitate considering buying say a M7060 for serious work? The 5E is pretty much its main competition, and it shows when driving both tractors as they handle very much the same, and are similarly outfitted to be priced in the same ballpark. Your friend sounds like a smug dude with too much $ trying to justify his decision to buy tractors costing an extra $15k+ more for a tractor that if you say is 10% nicer or more capable then you're being generous. Maybe you might say that for the price the M series sucks and you should just spend the extra for a R series because while they look alike the R is noticebly better equipped with much more/nicer features and amenities? (unless you're looking at the 50xx tractors which makes the M vs R series a moot point )

Kubota is overrated. Very good products, but overrated. I know this is a forum that's highly bias toward Kubota, but Kubota and their owners are like Toyota and their owners meaning they ride and push a reputation. (JD fans are often the same) They'll say your F150 or Silverado is an unreliable POS because Toyota is at the pinnacle of build quality and reliability and that no one else (particularly domestic) can compete. They're delusional. Yes the product they push is well built and overall reliable, but so is most everyone they compete with, and that is how they stay competing. They make none of their competition obsolete. And yes people do have issues with them.

And it's not just Kubota on here it's several of these other newb Asian brands that people like to push like LS, or Kioti, or even Mahindra, etc. Not that there is anything wrong with any of them, nor do I have an issue with anyone buying one it's just how they are pushed on here compared to JD. What I mean by that is if someone starts a thread saying, "hey I'm thinking of buying a new Kubota. What do y'all think?" (or LS, Kioti, etc) People will only go on about how that's great, and they're awesome tractors, and that they'll love it because they love theirs, and things of this nature. On the other hand if you say that you're thinking about any given new model of JD (or maybe even CNH, and MF) people want to question it, and recommend other brands because they know someone with a cousin, who's friend owns that same tractor, and it's been nothing but a POS.

For some reason everyone on the interweb seems to be under the impression that the 5E series is some crap machine. I'm not sure why as I see them probably more than any other tractor in their class around here, and if you're wanting to talk about serious work I see people using they with large/folding bush hogs, offset harrows, planters, etc. I mainly use mine to hay farm, but will take it in the woods and pull out trees I intend to saw up, or pull up smaller trees out the ground, or whatever else I need it for, and it hasn't failed me yet. I'm not saying they're the greatest tractor ever, but I am saying that they are very competitive with the competition that they are built to compete with. If you've heard of issues with them I'd say sure as most machines have issues in one form or another, and the 5E series sell like hotcakes. (around here anyways) So naturally since so many are sold it gives you greater opportunity to hear about someone having an issue with one. Kind of like you may hear more of people having issues with an AK or AR than a MP5 because more civilians own AR's and AK's than they do MP5's. The dealers I talked with claim to love them because they sell so well, and cost them relatively little in terms of warranty work for the amounts that they sell.

I also say that they are more American than people credit them for as I have family on my wifes side that work at the JD plant in Grovetown, GA where they put them together. They assemble so much of the tractors that the people there seem to think that they actually make the tractors (both 3 and 4 cylinder models) instead of putting together pieces coming from India.

 

[Texasmark]

1400 hours and hydraulics are tired on a 2009 tractor??? I suppose you have changed fluids and filters as recommended with the fluid type (or equivalent) recommended, like for that tractor "Premium" universal trans-hydraulic fluid.....what does tired mean?

Years ago I tried hauling densely packed 5x6 rolls with an IH 464, 2wd, OS, no FEL, 45 hp and I had to weight the front end so I can understand your problem there.

I moved up in old school tractors peaking at a 25 year old JD 4230 2wd, 100 hp, no FEL, restored including "Sound Guard" cab interior and new 134a AC system...1st cab, really nice for baling hay and other hot weather/dusty chores here in N. TX....like you are.

In 2007 I wanted a new tractor and bought a 65 hp, 4wd, cab with all the amenities including air seat......yes on the seat and the reason is that sitting on air is like sitting on air. Speaks for itself. I use the same implements with the 65 I used with the 100 in mid range gears, like used with the 100. No doubt 4wd makes a large tractor out of a small one and with your comment about work and size, today's 4wd offerings help you achieve that.

In shopping brand, in the spring of 2007 I went shopping all the popular colors (but Kubota) and didn't find anything that rang my chimes. That fall I found what I wanted in the Branson. Lots of options out there. Best thing I could recommend is get a demonstrator and try it before you plunk down your money. All aren't alike and some things can really be a personal (for you) annoyance. I don't think I have seen anybody on 4 farm sites saying that they bought a lemon considering all the brands available today. Figure out what's important to you and go for it.

With the size of your place and the time element to get things done you might consider several tractors, at least two, one for the big jobs and the other for the smaller ones, with implements to suit each. I don't have the lineup I have just to have it. Right now I have hay on the ground and by the time I finish with it, I will have used all 5 since I work alone and each has it's niche of excellence and with more you aren't swapping implements all the time which, when considering a tractor to buy, if working alone as I am, ease of hooking up implements on your selected tractor definitely DOES make a difference. Again, in this area, all brands aren't the same!

Lots of good, used tractors out there, like the 30 year old Ford 3910 I just bought with 900 hours. Only thing it needed was fluids changed and off to the field it went. Had some cosmetic things I wanted to change and did, but weren't gotta haves...the seat being one. I bought it because I wanted a mowing tractor in my hay operation since I don't need a cab to cut hay....no dust and cut in the morning when it's cool. The cab tractor is for the baler where baling is done in hot weather and is a dusty process. This way I don't have to keep swapping back and forth between the cutter and the baler on one tractor...again connecting and disconnecting is a pain.

On glass and heat, it comes with the tool. Obviously there is auto window tint but I have picked up on chat mentioning something better for tractors. Maybe a www with the question will find what suits you. If I were still working large acreage, at my age, I'd install it in my current cab, on the 6530.

 

[daugen]

They assemble so much of the tractors that the people there seem to think that they actually make the tractors (both 3 and 4 cylinder models) instead of putting together pieces coming from India.

This really struck a chord in me, because it involves final QC. Engineering on a Deere is likely top drawer, manufacturing computer controlled and inspected, and none of that has value if the folks putting it together screw up. Those folks at the Deere plant apparently take ownership of the tractor mentally and all the final adjustments that make the tractor so effective have to be done just right. The hydraulic hoses torqued down just right. Even greasing the seat slides. And today...getting the software right on the dash. Likely hundreds of tasks in assembly. (I own a competitive Indian relabeled tractor btw and love it) So yeah, last folks to have their hands on it makes all the difference.

This way I don't have to keep swapping back and forth between the cutter and the baler on one tractor...again connecting and disconnecting is a pain.

Six thumbs up, keeping a bush hog or something with a pto connection on a second tractor all the time saves you
time, aggravation and grease all over you. And sometimes you need to go over areas you just don't want all that big tractor weight on.
Keep the second tractor. I wound up with four... all inexpensive except the Kubota.

I think everyone knows the Biscaynes of the Chevy world come from India. And those models are bought up by many other companies,
some who seem to just repaint and relabel, and others set higher specs and add value to the containers of tractors that come in by giant container ships. The Indian tractors are basic. Not everyone needs or wants or can afford to drive a Cadillac or Mercedes.
What Indian tractors generally have is cheap weight. Sophistication? No. Mahindra will get there but they are like Hyundai trying to sell $60k sedans. Not a good business case for that.

LS blue. Electric robin's egg blue. Sure not going to get missed in that tractor, but since it seems to be
an outstandingly good value in a high quality tractor, folks will put up with the color. I pass a New Holland dealer almost every day and slow
down just to drool over all that shining beautiful blue. You say potato, I say potahto

I suggest the OP will find long term satisfaction in a 100hp 8000 pound tractor with a comfortable cab and a transmission he finds easy
to use. And keep the current tractor, just get the hydraulic pressure checked. Might be something easily fixable.
Most of us always want more capability than we've got, until we get to what I think OP needs. Anything much bigger than that you are into dual rear wheels, gps and big ag farming.

 

[Texasmark]

They assemble so much of the tractors that the people there seem to think that they actually make the tractors (both 3 and 4 cylinder models) instead of putting together pieces coming from India.

This really struck a chord in me, because it involves final QC. Engineering on a Deere is likely top drawer, manufacturing computer controlled and inspected, and none of that has value if the folks putting it together screw up. Those folks at the Deere plant apparently take ownership of the tractor mentally and all the final adjustments that make the tractor so effective have to be done just right. The hydraulic hoses torqued down just right. Even greasing the seat slides. And today...getting the software right on the dash. Likely hundreds of tasks in assembly. (I own a competitive Indian relabeled tractor btw and love it) So yeah, last folks to have their hands on it makes all the difference.

This way I don't have to keep swapping back and forth between the cutter and the baler on one tractor...again connecting and disconnecting is a pain.

Six thumbs up, keeping a bush hog or something with a pto connection on a second tractor all the time saves you
time, aggravation and grease all over you. And sometimes you need to go over areas you just don't want all that big tractor weight on.
Keep the second tractor. I wound up with four... all inexpensive except the Kubota.

I think everyone knows the Biscaynes of the Chevy world come from India. And those models are bought up by many other companies,
some who seem to just repaint and relabel, and others set higher specs and add value to the containers of tractors that come in by giant container ships. The Indian tractors are basic. Not everyone needs or wants or can afford to drive a Cadillac or Mercedes.
What Indian tractors generally have is cheap weight. Sophistication? No. Mahindra will get there but they are like Hyundai trying to sell $60k sedans. Not a good business case for that.

LS blue. Electric robin's egg blue. Sure not going to get missed in that tractor, but since it seems to be
an outstandingly good value in a high quality tractor, folks will put up with the color. I pass a New Holland dealer almost every day and slow
down just to drool over all that shining beautiful blue. You say potato, I say potahto

I suggest the OP will find long term satisfaction in a 100hp 8000 pound tractor with a comfortable cab and a transmission he finds easy
to use. And keep the current tractor, just get the hydraulic pressure checked. Might be something easily fixable.
Most of us always want more capability than we've got, until we get to what I think OP needs. Anything much bigger than that you are into dual rear wheels, gps and big ag farming.

Nice post!

 

[rngrrymd]

If you buy a new one over 74HP you are going to have to mess with DEF (diesel exhaust fluid) and that is a whole nother can of worms. Couple of vendors try to work around it using tons of EGR but that just dumps a lot more carbon into the engine and oil system. DEF is mostly good if you run the machine a lot (don't let it sit for a couple of weeks), but unless you run it hard and almost daily expect problems. We have 85 acres and I went with a Kioti RX7320 (about 40K with a loader) with the cab and powershuttle transmission. AC has overhead vents and works very well here in hot and humid central Texas, and the loader will lift almost 4K so hay will not be a problem. I am eventually going to get another bigger tractor for some future projects, but it will be a pre-emissions one like a Deere,

Case Farmall 75C does not use DEF or DPF. Uses DOC. Once you go to 85HP on they use DEF. Extremely comfortable cab but will it be big enough for OP's needs or does be need to go bigger?

 

[Bigpuddie]

You should give a hard look at the new Massey Ferguson 4700 series. Top notch. Affordable. Weigh close to 10k with a loader. Cab is second to none. No DPF.