Anybody use hidden deck board fasteners

[Captain Dirty]

About 7 years ago I had an ipe (ironwood) deck installed using Simpson Strong-tie EB-TY plastic biscuits. The instructions direct the installer to "toe nail" the fastening screws at an angle. The hired help installed many of the screws vertically. I suspect that was because vertically was intuitive and easier (because obliquely would have entailed drilling a pilot hole or likely splitting the bottom corner of the ipe board). Because there has been no "heaving" or upward force, the deck portion has been fine. However, there are 4 removable gratings around the hot tub to allow access to the side panels of the tub. I made tools shaped like a capital "I" from rod to lift the gratings by inserting one end through the cracks, rotating it 90 degrees, and pulling up on the other end. Movement of the SYP framing and bowing of a couple of the ipe boards caused binding of the gratings; the upward force on the lifting tools bowed the boards and partially pulled the screws from the framing. My fix was to install angle brackets from the underside of the boards to the framing using #10 screws with far more holding power than the #6? screws used with the biscuits.

 

[4570Man]

So, when a board more towards the middle gets damaged somehow and needs to be replaced, you have to tear the whole deck apart?

You could cut it out and face screw it back down.

 

[Captain Dirty]

So, when a board more towards the middle gets damaged somehow and needs to be replaced, you have to tear the whole deck apart?

I suspect one could use an oscillating multi-tool to cut and remove the biscuits and then lift the damaged boards straight up. New biscuits could be inserted on one edge of the replacement board and that edge installed at an angle. Installing the biscuits on the second edge of a single replacement board might be a hassle, but easier if multiple boards were involved. Once the boards are down, vertically driven screws would secure the biscuits.

 

[PILOON]

Shucks, all the decks I've done I simply use a screwdrivers to get consistent spacing between boards and shoot 2.5 or 3 inch nails, 2 per joist.
I generally used galvanized nails or stainless .
Another thing I liked to do is lay strips of roof membrane on the joist, under the decking, to prevent joist rotting.
The idea being that you could replace the decking as long as the joists were sound.

I never recommended the owners paint a deck as my feeling was that paints chipped and flaked trapping water that rotted the wood.
Same for opaque stains which are really flat paint.
I liked to pressure wash a dirty greyed deck followed by perhaps a new application of preservative.
I always dipped a fresh cut end into preservative B4 attaching to the joists.

Always wondered as to the long life claims and how to make a warrantee claim. Did U need to keep all the little tags as well as the lumber yard invoice?

 

[747driver]

I recently installed a Trex deck and used the hidden Trex fastening system. The Trex boards can be purchased with a groove on the sides of the boards. Trex makes a universal "T" clip type of fastener that fits between the boards into the slots on the deck boards and then holds the deck boards flat and also controls the gap (spacing) between the deck boards.

These connectors seemed to work well for me and allowed for a very consistent look and alignment of the deck boards.

If you have the ability to slot the sides of your PT deck boards then maybe these Trex hidden connectors might work for you.

Trex Hideaway Universal Hidden Deck Fastener Clip 5 SQFT Bucket - Trex Fasteners - Amazon.com

The end boards have what is called "starter clips. These are used to begin the install of the deck boards and then side by side boards use the above "T" clips.

Amazon.com : trex starter clips

There are other brands of hidden deck board fasteners that also may work well but the Trex ones are the only ones I have experience with.

Thanks for the info...will look it up !

 

[747driver]

When this house was built they used dry clear straight grain redwood for the deck railing. Those miters are still tight 30 years later. Impossible to get that these days. I use square corner blocks rather than miters, they do not gap as bad.

Good idea ! I use that method of square blocks with a design in the middle of the block for interior door trim sometimes.

 

[747driver]

I tell all my clients to wait four to six months before staining or painting anything pressure treated. The moisture is going to come out no matter what you do, and it will destroy the stain or paint. Another thing that happens while the boards dry out is cupping. Used to be a fairly safe rule of thumb to install all your boards "bark side up" But now there isn't any way to predict what the boards will do. Cupping happens either way, and with any amount of screws to hold the boards down. I give clients a price for six months after I build their deck to come back, sand the deck smooth with a 1ftx2ft sander that I rent from Home Depot, and then stain after that.

The other big issue is cutting a 45 degree on the railings. There is no way possible to have a tight fit after six months. The different thickness of the 45 cut means different drying, and it will open up. I tell them to expect this, and I'll come back and fill the gap with automotive wood bondo, and sand it smooth. When it's stained, it pretty much disappears.

Good idea on sanding the deck !

 

[747driver]

:thumbsup:

 

[4570Man]

I tell all my clients to wait four to six months before staining or painting anything pressure treated. The moisture is going to come out no matter what you do, and it will destroy the stain or paint. Another thing that happens while the boards dry out is cupping. Used to be a fairly safe rule of thumb to install all your boards "bark side up" But now there isn't any way to predict what the boards will do. Cupping happens either way, and with any amount of screws to hold the boards down. I give clients a price for six months after I build their deck to come back, sand the deck smooth with a 1ftx2ft sander that I rent from Home Depot, and then stain after that.

The other big issue is cutting a 45 degree on the railings. There is no way possible to have a tight fit after six months. The different thickness of the 45 cut means different drying, and it will open up. I tell them to expect this, and I'll come back and fill the gap with automotive wood bondo, and sand it smooth. When it's stained, it pretty much disappears.

Wood deck rails suck. It’s well worth the upgrade price for the aluminum rail that’s a lifetime product with zero maintenance other then washing.

 

[buck12]

I've used them on composite deck boards and they all seem to work great. I prefer the metal ones over the plastic ones, but I've never had an issue with the plastic ones. Some of them have to be attached to the bottom of the deck board, which creates more work. The few times that I've done this, I just used what was sold at the store at the time. It seems that they change what they carry, because I've never used the same type twice.

I no longer install 5/4 decking for clients because of how much is shrinks. Modern pressure treating methods forces a massive amount of water into the wood, so when you buy it, it's saturated with water. This takes months to evaporate, and years for the wood to fully adjust to it's true size. The last couple of decks that I used 5/4 on, I installed them as tight together as I could, and a year later, the gaps between the boards where anywhere from half an inch to 3/4 of an inch!!!

For my Grandsons play fort, I used 5/4 boards for his climbing wall. I want gaps between the boards, and I wanted to bend the boards so the climbing wall was angled, and round. They worked great for that, but they cost more then 2x6's, which really surprised me.

Sorry to hijack this thread. Eddie, what do you recommend for decking? I have to rebuild my dock on our pond when treated lumber comes down in price. The dock is only 15 years old and the only thing worth saving is the 6 x 6 posts. I decked it with 2 x 6s and at least half are crumbling.