Anyone know where the seat and PTO switches go?

[WayneW]

Ok, this is heavy....... (you've been warned)

On my B7610 there are 2 saftely switches, one for the seat (normally open, closes when you sit down or jump it) and the other for the PTO (normally open, closes when the cam attached to the PTO lever pushes it into a closed position when the PTO is disengaged - it goes to an open condition when either the mid or rear PTO is engaged)

Where do these go? Rather, what are they wired to. I assume they must be seperate circuits,

Conditions are:
1. On seat, (closed switch) PTO switch can be in either state -Fine.
2. Off seat (open switch), PTO must be in a closed state (PTO off) or .....shutdown.
3. On seat (closed), PTO on (closed) ....won't start. But she runs fine.

Therefore - these switches can't be in series, cause either an engaged PTO OR getting off the seat would shut her down (not the case with no PTO engaged)

And they are not wired in parallel cause that would mean that if you were ON the seat, it would not matter if the PTO was engaged or not, then the tractor would still start and/or run (not the case)

This leads me to believe that the switches are on connected to some other type of circuit, that monitors both switches, but what? And where?

I think that circuit (the mystery one) might be flaking out on me, since I've checked all the switches and verified that they are working properly. But since they all need a closed condition to make the Bota happy, I'm not ruling out a loose connection somewhere either.

 

[WayneW]

Ok, this is heavy....... (you've been warned)

On my B7610 there are 2 saftely switches, one for the seat (normally open, closes when you sit down or jump it) and the other for the PTO (normally open, closes when the cam attached to the PTO lever pushes it into a closed position when the PTO is disengaged - it goes to an open condition when either the mid or rear PTO is engaged)

Where do these go? Rather, what are they wired to. I assume they must be seperate circuits,

Conditions are:
1. On seat, (closed switch) PTO switch can be in either state -Fine.
2. Off seat (open switch), PTO must be in a closed state (PTO off) or .....shutdown.
3. On seat (closed), PTO on (closed) ....won't start. But she runs fine.

Therefore - these switches can't be in series, cause either an engaged PTO OR getting off the seat would shut her down (not the case with no PTO engaged)

And they are not wired in parallel cause that would mean that if you were ON the seat, it would not matter if the PTO was engaged or not, then the tractor would still start and/or run (not the case)

This leads me to believe that the switches are on connected to some other type of circuit, that monitors both switches, but what? And where?

I think that circuit (the mystery one) might be flaking out on me, since I've checked all the switches and verified that they are working properly. But since they all need a closed condition to make the Bota happy, I'm not ruling out a loose connection somewhere either.

 

[KennyV]

If like any safety interlock system they are in series, between the starter solenoid and the start position on your key switch.

You can check this circuit by from the positive terminal on your starter (large cable terminal) to the small terminal on the starter solenoid while you turn the key to start. ANY voltage across these terminals (with the key turned to start) is voltage dropped across the pto, seat, and shuttle shift switch or the wiring that connects them. KennyV.

 

[KennyV]

If like any safety interlock system they are in series, between the starter solenoid and the start position on your key switch.

You can check this circuit by from the positive terminal on your starter (large cable terminal) to the small terminal on the starter solenoid while you turn the key to start. ANY voltage across these terminals (with the key turned to start) is voltage dropped across the pto, seat, and shuttle shift switch or the wiring that connects them. KennyV.

 

[DanR67]

Wayne -

The switch system is a bit more complex that "in series / in parallel" - combinations of both in some cases.

There was a thread a few weeks ago about someones' problem with a non-starting BX24 - thread here. I posted what all the switches did referring to my B7610 Work Shop Manual - and what requirements were needed to get the engine to start (for that problem). The multitude of safety switches collectively perform "Operator Presense Control".

I'm not sure if you are referring to just the two (2) switches under the drivers' seat - one is needed for starting in the first place - the other is for when you flip the seat forward - you can push the clutch in by hand and put the PTO lever into gear - for example to run a post hole digger.

Does that help any? You didn't mention exactly what problem you are experiencing...I can recommend that the B7610 WSM is quite detailed if you are technically oriented - definitely worth the @ $75 the dealer will charge for a copy.

Dan

 

[DanR67]

Wayne -

The switch system is a bit more complex that "in series / in parallel" - combinations of both in some cases.

There was a thread a few weeks ago about someones' problem with a non-starting BX24 - thread here. I posted what all the switches did referring to my B7610 Work Shop Manual - and what requirements were needed to get the engine to start (for that problem). The multitude of safety switches collectively perform "Operator Presense Control".

I'm not sure if you are referring to just the two (2) switches under the drivers' seat - one is needed for starting in the first place - the other is for when you flip the seat forward - you can push the clutch in by hand and put the PTO lever into gear - for example to run a post hole digger.

Does that help any? You didn't mention exactly what problem you are experiencing...I can recommend that the B7610 WSM is quite detailed if you are technically oriented - definitely worth the @ $75 the dealer will charge for a copy.

Dan

 

[midlf]

Don't forget you are not dealing with a gas engine ignition system here. On my BX the tractor is killed by the system energizing the cut off solenoid. The safety wiring is a network of switches and wires. There is the seat, the PTO and the transmission. Some are prevention of start, others are kill a running engine. Some are both, some are conditional. The schematic for your specific model will show it all.

 

[midlf]

Don't forget you are not dealing with a gas engine ignition system here. On my BX the tractor is killed by the system energizing the cut off solenoid. The safety wiring is a network of switches and wires. There is the seat, the PTO and the transmission. Some are prevention of start, others are kill a running engine. Some are both, some are conditional. The schematic for your specific model will show it all.

 

[WayneW]

Thanks for that link Dan. Now I'm even more confused. I had NO IDEA that the 7610 had that many safety switches. So far, I've only found 3. One under that seat (apparently I'll have to look for a second one) One for the PTO. (I did not find a seperate one for the rear & mid. Just one switch on a cam at the end of the PTO lever shaft) And the third one I found at the clutch pedal. Did not know ther has one at the hydro pedal either.

Oh, and my exact problem is.......sometimes when I lift my hiney from the seat, the tractor shuts off. (Like the PTO is engaged. But it's not. AND without touching the lever, I get an Ohm-meter and verify that the PTO switch it in fact CLOSED)

Now, after this happens, the tractor will NOT start for some time. I can jiggle every lever
on that thing and nothing. Wait 15-20 mins, and Ok, she starts.

Now, in this same situation, if I shut down the tractor by the ignition key, she'll start back up fine. (I know it's the same situation, because I've gotten good at sitting back down on the seat really fast when I can tell she's going to stall.....that keeps her running. I then proceed to shut her down with the igintion key...she'll fire right back up)

 

[WayneW]

Thanks for that link Dan. Now I'm even more confused. I had NO IDEA that the 7610 had that many safety switches. So far, I've only found 3. One under that seat (apparently I'll have to look for a second one) One for the PTO. (I did not find a seperate one for the rear & mid. Just one switch on a cam at the end of the PTO lever shaft) And the third one I found at the clutch pedal. Did not know ther has one at the hydro pedal either.

Oh, and my exact problem is.......sometimes when I lift my hiney from the seat, the tractor shuts off. (Like the PTO is engaged. But it's not. AND without touching the lever, I get an Ohm-meter and verify that the PTO switch it in fact CLOSED)

Now, after this happens, the tractor will NOT start for some time. I can jiggle every lever
on that thing and nothing. Wait 15-20 mins, and Ok, she starts.

Now, in this same situation, if I shut down the tractor by the ignition key, she'll start back up fine. (I know it's the same situation, because I've gotten good at sitting back down on the seat really fast when I can tell she's going to stall.....that keeps her running. I then proceed to shut her down with the igintion key...she'll fire right back up)