B 3030 will start in gear

[cart99]

jgbiker:

I appreciate your concern, I have two young children myself. However, I think you may be going down the "strangled by the salt shaker" road (a story where a man spills salt, throws some over his shoulder but leans back too far, chair falls back into a curtain and becomes entangled and suffocates, proving that salt shakers are deadly)

The two year old scenario - What is to keep that same 2 year from crawling into your car and starting it? I'm guessing the keys aren't in the ignition. I'm sorry, but I could go on and on this way. It's a dangerous world and parents have to be vigilant. Tractors are very dangerous tools. My Bushhog scares the living crap out of me. My kids aren't allowed anywhere near me when I'm mowing and the dogs get locked in the house until I'm done.

Actually I am sure a 2 year would not have the hand strength to turn the key. My son couldn't turn an ignition key until he was about 5, even with both hands.

Manufacturers have been encouraged and even forced by litigation (and hopefully a conscience) to make their products as safe as possible WITHOUT SERIOUSLY HAMPERING THEIR FUNCTIONALITY. As several posts have shown, there are practical advantages to being able to start the tractor from the ground and (surprising to me) even working the hydro pedal from the ground.

To reiterate, I definitely want safety features on my tractor, but not at the expense of reasonable functionality. I accepted the responsibility of owning and operating a deadly piece of equipment when I bought it. My well-travelled neighbor has regaled me with every "death by tractor" story he knows. Caveat emptor.

Put it in neutral
Set the parking brake
Remove the key

Doing even one of these things when you leave the seat would prevent your scenario. Why not do all three. That's what they are there for.

 

[jgbiker]

cart99 :

> (a story where a man spills salt, throws some over his
shoulder but leans back too far, chair falls back into a curtain and becomes entangled and suffocates, proving that salt shakers are deadly)

Please ! I believe guns don't kill people. People kill people

> What is to keep that same 2 year from crawling into your car and starting it?

If the keys were left in the ignition and the car were a stick shift the clutch would have to be depressed or it wouldn't start. If it were a auto trans. it would have to be in park to start but it wouldn't move

>Actually I am sure a 2 year would not have the hand strength to turn the key.

The scenario I described almost happened to us. My grand daughter was able to turn the key to get a partial crank over. And she was leaning over the pedal.

> Manufacturers have been encouraged and even forced by litigation (and hopefully a conscience) to make their products as safe as possible WITHOUT SERIOUSLY HAMPERING THEIR FUNCTIONALITY.

I agree but in this case the Kubota manual says that the tractor can only be started if the gear selector is in neutral. This is not so. Unlike the automatic transmission car you may own, this vehicle will start in any gear. The western area rep knew this and said that there is a typo in the manual. I think the 2630 and the 3030 have been out since May of 05. I would think by this time Kubota would have come out with a revised manual. Also the dealerships I spoke with were never notified about the no safety issue. I wonder how many 3030 owners are out there with a false sense of security as I was.

> As several posts have shown, there are practical advantages to being able to start the tractor from the ground

I don't have a problem with that, as long as the tractor has to be in nuetral to start as the manual claims

> To reiterate, I definitely want safety features on my tractor, but not at the expense of reasonable functionality. I accepted the responsibility of owning and operating a deadly piece of equipment when I bought it

So are you saying the safety feature in your cars is detrimental to reasonable functionality. Because what we're talking about is the same safety feature

> Put it in neutral
Set the parking brake
Remove the key

> Doing even one of these things when you leave the seat would prevent your scenario. Why not do all three. That's what they are there for.

Could of, should of, would of doesn't work for me. I purposely
left the 3030 in gear thinking that it couldn't be started this way. I'm an adult but I'm also human. Humans make mistakes, have memory lapses, and sometimes are just lazy. If you can do without, more power to you.
I think I've gone as far as I care to go on defending my position and on my lesson on how to operate a tractor.
John

 

[jgbiker]

> As adults we should know better,it's our sons or daughters,grandsons,granddaughters,the kids next door that I am concerned about

Hi wbfllamas
Adults are not perfect, They're only human. So what's wrong with a little mechanical backup. I have safeguards in the form of no trespassing, please don't feed the horses signs to protect others from injury and us from litigation.
Sorry need to get of my soapbox.
What I really wanted to say was, the person I spoke with in CA. is the head of all western area reps. Although my area rep was aware of the no safety neutral switch, this guy was not. While I was on the phone with him he was looking at the drawings of the 3030. This guy must have some clout. He told me if I decide to keep the 3030 he would instuct the dealeship to install the safety neutral switch. He said it's no big thing, it's the same switch as on the pto and the speed control pedal. It would all be done under warranty. I haven't decided if I want to keep the 3030 or take him up on his other offer: B7800 with a pto with a control valve instead of the Mickey Mouse quarter inching valve. So if you are serious about doing something make a call. You're in Northen CA. ?
Call Torrence I already opened the door there.
John

 

[wbfllamas]

Hi John, Thanks for getting the ball rolling with the factory.Will call Torence tommorow,in fact will be at Big Valley Tractor in Stockton in am,will talk to Service Manager at that time and I will call from there.Neutral Saftey Switch off B7800 sounds like the fix.Thanks again for all your input. Dave

 

[jgbiker]

Neutral Saftey Switch off B7800 sounds like the fix

Dave
Sorry to confusion. The safety neutral switch is not from a 7800. The 7800 is another choice of tractor being offered to me by the rep. The switch in question is the same type as is on your pto & your speed control pedal.
John

 

[cart99]

jgbiker:

Thanks for the well thought-out response to my long winded post. Although I still stand by my assessment, I will agree that the typo. in the manual is unacceptable and must be addressed by Kubota.

As for the rest, everyone else here will have plenty to read in order to make their own judgement.

I love TractorByNet!!

 

[HODAK]

cart99, I'm with you on this one. Adults need to take some responsibility when it comes to safety. I suppose lawsuits have advanced(?) us to where we are today with some of these improvements. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[strokerduster]

my apologies if it doesn't apply to you but lawyers don't see this a safety issue but as an income opportunity. what ever happened to common sense?

 

[HODAK]

strokerduster - my point exactly. Very well put!!

 

[jgbiker]

> my apologies if it doesn't apply to you but lawyers don't see this a safety issue but as an income opportunity. what ever happened to common sense?

strokerduster in most cases where the defendant is a big money pit I think your right. But they're still trying to get the best deal for their client. The attorney isn't going to turn away a potential client who has done something really stupid and injured themselves like maybe drilling a series of holes in the foldable ROPS of their tractor to lighten it when they fold it down, and they nick themselve with the drill bit.
The attorney would probably say " My god Mr. Smith this is an injustice we must make the public aware of the manufacturer's unsafe practices. We'll do whatever it takes to get you a fair settlement. Now I want you to go see this doctor that ... Then we'll file against the drill bit manufacturer for not putting a warning label stating that you could nick your finger on each and every drill bit . Then we'll go after the drill manufacturer for making such an unsafe product as a drill. Because if the drill hadn't been made you wouldn't have had anything to put the drill bit in, so you would still be safe and whole. And then we'll go after the tractor manufacturer because if they had made a lighter ROPS, you wouldn't have used that unsafe drill bit in that unsafe drill which i think needs to be banned, to drill lightening hole in that safety product on the tractor. We'll sue for pain and suffering, mental anguish, your unableness (is there such a word ?) to perform in the bedroom. Now Mr. Smith tell me about your childhood.
You know what ? I really believe the insurance companies would settle with the plaintive because it would be cheaper to do so. This is what the attorneys count on. IMHO
You know, I can't picture myself standing in front of a judge and jury making that presentation.I couldn't look anybody straight in the face. I wouldn't be able to keep from laughing.
I need to add that my best friend for 26 yrs. and the father of my god daughter is an attorney, and he is a very good poker player
John