Back pain...

[Bird]

I'll be taking my wife to a 10 a.m. appointment at the surgery center this morning where they'll put her to sleep and do three injections in her spine to hopefully relieve her back pain for another 6 months or so, as I mentioned in post #7 of this thread.

Last week, I started waking up in the morning with some back pain. After about 3 mornings of that, I lowered my Select Comfort sleep number bed from 75 to 65 and no more problem.

 

[timster2]

I finally sought a surgeon when I couldn't walk. Chiropractors helped but did stop the progression of a herniated disk. The surgeon did a lumbar laminectomy which relieved pressure on my spinal cord. A few days later I was walking again. The surgeon said the longer you put off the surgery the less effective it will be. If you wait you loose even more.

I was good for a few years, however, the pain is coming back. I can sit and work no problem just can't stand or walk any distance. A walk to the mail box a hundred yards or so round trip requires ten minutes or so of sitting time for the back to calm down. I think its time to see the surgeon again.

When I was young and indestructible I did a lot of heavy lifting as a heavy equipment mechanic. I'm paying for it now. If it wasn't for pain killers I would be totally useless.

 

[Western]

With the Stenosis, i can usually sit down for a minute and that does it for a while. When a nerve gets "pinched", that seems to last 1-3 days, sitting helps, but I have to find the right angle even then.

I have used the stretcher and they do work very well, usually last me a week or 2. The PT at the Surgeons office does it much better, than I have myself using a lesser quality machine, I haven't tried the "hanging one.

Bird. hope things go as planned. I was given that option (injections) for the "next step", but I 'd rather do as you did and just have to release some air:laughing:

 

[dmccarty]

A year or two back I was standing around waiting for a meeting listening a couple of old guys talk about their bad backs. Better to be an old guy with a bad back than a young guy with a bad back.

One guy was talking about a doctor visit about his back. He did not want to do the surgery and the Doc said that was fine and to come back for the procedure when he could not longer handle the pain.

Which is what the guy did. I think the advice was good advice.

A neighbor had back surgery last year. Danged near killed him with an infection. As it was, he lost a kidney and was in the hospital and nursing home for almost a year. He finally got better enough to go home but then had another setback and went back to the hospital. The docs wanted him to go to a nursing home but his wife said no, he is going home where she could care for him.

Sad thing is that both he and his wife just got married in the last five years or so after dealing with long illnesses of their previous spouses.

Later,
Dan

 

[Depmandog]

Back pain. I have had back problems since 1985. Lifted a transmission off the ground from an oil distributor truck - playing he-man. Felt something squeeze in my lower back. Issues started shortly thereafter.

Used to be the chiro could fix me up when I had a flare up, but in 99, something popped, and I was is the worst pain of my life (sciatic) Took there months to finally get the operation. The surgeon removed a bone fragment that had imbedded in my sciatic when my disc herniated. For the next year, all was good. Pretty much babied my back - then wham - pain is back..although not quite as intense.

Went to a parade of specialist surgeons - no one would operate. Scar tissue. No one will operate on scar tissue - afraid of causing spinal meningitis.

Was referred to pain management. Since 2000, I have had 13 epidural injections, usually 3-4 at a time. I am on my second neurostimulator implant for pain control. Currently take two different narcotic pain meds including morphine. In addition to that, an anti depressant that has a pain relieving side effect and a muscle relaxer.

I am stiff as a board in the mornings, and it takes me a while to get going. If I can keep my pain level at a 5 on a ten scale - its a good day.

Still working, by the grace of God was able to secure a position where I work from home. I do have some travel, but the company bought me a full size truck - which is actually more comfortable than any chair I have at home. Some days I just can't go, but my work is flexible - and if I am laid up in the morning, I make up the time at night.

It could be worse...and fully expect it to get that way as part of my problems are degenerative. But this is the hand that I was dealt, so I am just going with it.

The message - take care of you back - oh you don't know how many times I have thought - if I hadn't picked up that transmission...

 

[foggy1111]

^ Ouch! Hang in there.

My back story is somewhat similar....but I lifted tree stumps. Seems I felt I was bullet proof in my youth. It may only take one incident to hang with you for a long time.

I had surgery a year and a half ago. Instant relief from what was debilitating pain over a 4 month period. I lost some feeling in my thigh....but have little complaints. The surgery was a big success for me. Seems a good surgeon has so much more info going into surgery these days with all the images and such.

Lately my back pain is what wakes me up each morning. Feels like the muscles get tense. I need to get into my back exercise routine again.

I back away from the heavy lifting these days.

 

[dmccarty]

...

The message - take care of you back - oh you don't know how many times I have thought - if I hadn't picked up that transmission...

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000 :thumbsup:

At least your trouble started with a Tranny! Real Man Lifting!

<Insert Tim the Toolman> Ho Ho Ho<\Insert Tim the Toolman>



I messed up my back TILING a bathroom.

I too thought I was bullet proof.....

Later,
Dan

 

[Lloyd_E]

This does not look good for me...

Last October I tried to shinny a long further onto my loader forks.( I apologize if I posted this earlier in another thread...) I felt something "pop" in my lower back - right side - just above my butt. I fell over the log and slowly got up - pain was intense - like hitting your thumb but worse! I continued to work another 5-6 hours. Job needed to get done. Next morning ended up in emergency because I could barely move and we were supposed to drive to Boston that day. Started the drive, well medicated. Don't remember much of the trip down.

Returned home and sought help. Did physio for 5 sessions - nothing. Saw a sports medicine Dr. after I had x-rays. No slipped disc or fractures. Eased up a bit. The irony is that when I would start to work - like pile wood or split wood or move and build stuff - the pain would go away but as soon as I stopped the pain would come back. The pain has lessoned over the months, moved from my back down my leg and up again. I started to see an osteopath about two months ago - about 7 sessions. Things started to look good until she really twisted me two weeks ago. The pain is back differently and is lower in the back and down my leg 24/7. I am booked to see her tomorrow but we are going to have a little chat.

Of course I haven't stopped - continue to do stuff - things need to get down.
Everyone thinks it is a severely torn ligament. I can do certain things like twist sideways, tie my shoes, kneel and get up without pain...

So - those of you that have had torn ligaments and muscles tell me your story. What did you do to recover and how long.

Sorry for the ramble... can't do much...

 

[Western]

Lloyd, sounds very similar to what I experience. If I hurt on the left side, the left leg tingles or the toes even go numb, but the pain at the lower spine is intense. Same for the right.
I finally went to a spinal surgeon and he said (posted early in this thread somewhere) I have onset of early Stenosis, likely due to poor lifting habits or early damage such as you elude to. So far he has told me to deal with it best we can without surgery, best thing he has done so far is had the Physical Therapy dept put me on a "body/back " stretcher, that gives me immediate relief and last several weeks.

Next recommended is the "shots", as some of the posters here have mentioned then surgery, but as he said and (several guys here have had it), the surgery is procedures now are much better.

When those nerves get agitated, it can be a nightmare. I have had day's where I can only sit in one way, If I stand in one position for a while it starts. Strange thing is, if I stay moving and not in the same stance, i do quite well.

 

[dmccarty]

...
So - those of you that have had torn ligaments and muscles tell me your story. What did you do to recover and how long.

Sorry for the ramble... can't do much...

I have messed up my upper back twice, once tiling and then moving retaining wall blocks before I was completely healed. A traffic accident really messed up my neck.

With the first back injury I went to a sports medicine doctor who filled me up with drugs, Hydrocodone, muscle relaxer, and 800mg of Motrine I think. Seems like there was something else. It sorta took the pain away but I was a sleeping, drooling blob on the couch for a week. When my manager called and mentioned short term disability I got off the couch.

The wifey was nagging my to go to the bone cracker but I refused. The back slowly healed but I was in pain for months. Then I pushed too much with the retaining wall blocks. The pain was increasing, I did not want the meds so I went to the bone cracker....

After the car accident I went to the bone cracker and a MD. The MD said the bone cracker is what I needed....

What I learned though all of this is that inflammation causes pain. Pain causes more inflammation. Repeat. You have to stop the pain and/or inflammation to feel better and to heal. The bone cracker had me use ice packs every hour for seven minutes for as many hours a day as I could. It worked. He had me on Ibuprofen to help with pain and inflammation. I thought he was nuts when he sent me home with no treatment until he say the Xrays. Figured I was on heavy drugs last time and this guy wants me to use ice and headache pill?

It worked though! :thumbsup:

Because of the car accident, the wifey has had two shoulder surgeries. The Doc had her use one of the ice machines that you connect to your shoulder to run cold water to the site of the operation which help reduce pain and inflammation. Along with the heavy pain meds she was using Ibuprofen and Acetaminophen to help with pain and inflammation.

For us, the drugs, over the counter or prescribed, just bought time for the body to heal. Healing took months at best and a good year or so for some of our injuries. It is VERY hard if you have chores to do, to do nothing, or at least limit what you do physically. In the end that is what I had to do.

I pulled my ankle tendon as a teenager. That took years to fully heal. The ankle would be fine and then it would be injured again. It took years but it finally got better and is no longer a problem.

Hopefully the Doc can help you manage the pain to reduce inflammation to give you time to heal.

Later,
Dan

 

[Lloyd_E]

Lloyd, sounds very similar to what I experience. If I hurt on the left side, the left leg tingles or the toes even go numb, but the pain at the lower spine is intense. Same for the right.
I finally went to a spinal surgeon and he said (posted early in this thread somewhere) I have onset of early Stenosis, likely due to poor lifting habits or early damage such as you elude to. So far he has told me to deal with it best we can without surgery, best thing he has done so far is had the Physical Therapy dept put me on a "body/back " stretcher, that gives me immediate relief and last several weeks.

Next recommended is the "shots", as some of the posters here have mentioned then surgery, but as he said and (several guys here have had it), the surgery is procedures now are much better.

When those nerves get agitated, it can be a nightmare. I have had day's where I can only sit in one way, If I stand in one position for a while it starts. Strange thing is, if I stay moving and not in the same stance, i do quite well.

Western.

Bang on! You nailed it. It's exactly how I feel. I did see the osteopath today and she did some different work methods. Actually tried acupuncture - 5 needles I believe. One hit the muscle nerve-painful but manageable.

I have been working on a project all day at my desk/computer. I actually feel less pain than yesterday. Hopefully this will work.

Are you still icing your back? It works for me. NO heat - it only inflames the muscle/nerves.

lloyd

 

[dmccarty]

Western.

Bang on! You nailed it. It's exactly how I feel. I did see the osteopath today and she did some different work methods. Actually tried acupuncture - 5 needles I believe. One hit the muscle nerve-painful but manageable.

I have been working on a project all day at my desk/computer. I actually feel less pain than yesterday. Hopefully this will work.

Are you still icing your back? It works for me. NO heat - it only inflames the muscle/nerves.

lloyd

With the neck pain from the car accident I did acupuncture and cupping. Both relieved the pain for hours. Cupping is when they put little shot like glasses on your back and heat them up. The heat causes a vacuum and pulls the skin into the cup. It actually hurt a bit at times but I was without pain for hours. Go figure.

I told the first bone cracker that if he said running around the house, counter clockwise, under a full moon, singing Yankee Doodle Dandy would get rid of the pain, I would try it.

HEAT at the wrong time can MESS you up. I would use a different word but TBN is Family Friendly. I found this out the hard way and the easy way. Unfortunately in that order.

With the first injury I was really in pain a week after the back went POP. I woke up Sunday morning and could not take the pain any longer so I went to the Doc In A Box. They did XRays, wrote me up for 800mg of something, told me to see my doctor, what doctor I ain't got no doctor, and sent me home. :laughing: The 800mg of Motrin? must have worked because Sunday night I was feeling a bit better. Still in pain but better.

Figured a nice long hot shower would help....

Figured wrong.

Took the shower at 10:00pm. At 2:00am I was driving myself to the ER with my arm held over my head. Figured if I got pulled over it was going to look real bad. :laughing: The ER was a waste of time and money since they did NOTHING but right a script for 800mg of Motrin.

The next day the doctor hooked me up with he real pain meds.

But, there has to be a but, the wifey thought as did I, that a heating pad would help. Oh lordy NO. It took awhile to figure out that HEAT was NOT the thing to do to relieve pain.

With the next injury and my trip to the Chiropractor they specifically told me NO HEAT until much later in the treatment. Months into treatment they had me use ice, then heat, followed by ice. Each was on the back for something like five minutes. Heat causes inflammation which can be good or can be bad. In my case, early in the treatment, heat was painfully bad.

The first bone cracker moved out of town to be closer to family so we found a new Chiropractor. The new guy told me the same thing about heat during my third injury.

Later,
Dan

 

[timster2]

When those nerves get agitated, it can be a nightmare. I have had day's where I can only sit in one way, If I stand in one position for a while it starts. Strange thing is, if I stay moving and not in the same stance, i do quite well.

Same here, I can sit and work and the pain is manageable. Can't walk through a shopping mall but I can walk through any store leaning on a shopping cart. There are a few things that I can do and can't explain why. I can use my log splitter for hours but can only use the chain saw for a few minutes. I was pleasantly surprised recently when I took a cruise with the wife, the constant motion of the ship actually helped my back stay loose and in a lot less pain than I expected. As long as the ship was moving I was happy.

 

[Western]

I have only iced my back a few times since when it hurts the worst, is when I'm at work or otherwise not in a place to use ice. If I use heat, it is a full body "tub". Since localized heat brings in blood to an injured area and made which feels great for about 10 minutes, but then.....

My back is strong, it's those pesky little nerves at the bottom. When the nerves gets agitated, the muscle around it tightens, that in-turn puts more pressure on the nerve, it is "round and round" .


As Tim said, I can split wood all day walk, hike, but just stand their or do something repetitive, I'm looking for trouble

Dan, I haven't considers Acupuncture, well, not in the "professional" sense. I have been known in times of Pain, to tell my wife to get the "wire cutters"

Backstretching really works, that said from a serious skeptic, $19 a session at the Surgeons office, or you can by one for the home. I haven't tried the "hang-by your heels" but hear good about them too.

 

[foggy1111]

When my back was pretty bad I thought that heat would relieve the ache.....and it did for a little while. But I quickly learned that ice packs were my friend. Ice does more to relieve back inflammation than any other treatment in my experience.

Before my surgery...there were times I literally had to slither on the floor, in agony, in order to get to the bathroom.....and could barely make it onto the toilet. At times the pain was unbearable. When pain and numbness are going down your leg.....I would not be spending much time with chiropractic. IMO that's the time for a specialist. Some of that nerve damage may be irreversible.

 

[dmccarty]

I have only iced my back a few times since when it hurts the worst, is when I'm at work or otherwise not in a place to use ice. If I use heat, it is a full body "tub". Since localized heat brings in blood to an injured area and made which feels great for about 10 minutes, but then.....

I think this is why the Chiropractor had me ice, then heat, then ice again. I only did this after the pain had greatly subsided after months of treatment.

Dan, I haven't considers Acupuncture, well, not in the "professional" sense. I have been known in times of Pain, to tell my wife to get the "wire cutters"

Backstretching really works, that said from a serious skeptic, $19 a session at the Surgeons office, or you can by one for the home. I haven't tried the "hang-by your heels" but hear good about them too.

I only we could use the wire cutter to cut the pain. That would be easy! :laughing:

With my first injury to my neck the bone cracker sold me this neck do hickey. The thing was U shaped, was folded up like the bellows on an Accordion, and had a little hand pump. You put this thing on your neck and squeezed the hand pump which filled up the bellows which in turn expanded you neck.

This would pull your neck bones apart and relieve the pain a bit. It really helped. I was supposed to do this quite a few times during the day so I had to take it to work. At the time I was working with a dozen or so people in an open environment. My coworkers loved to watch me stretch my neck. They got a good laugh out of the little exercise I had to do multiple times a day to relieve pain.

What was funny was how many people wanted to help pump the thing up to stretch my neck! :laughing:

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

When my back was pretty bad I thought that heat would relieve the ache.....and it did for a little while. But I quickly learned that ice packs were my friend. Ice does more to relieve back inflammation than any other treatment in my experience.

Before my surgery...there were times I literally had to slither on the floor, in agony, in order to get to the bathroom.....and could barely make it onto the toilet. At times the pain was unbearable. When pain and numbness are going down your leg.....I would not be spending much time with chiropractic. IMO that's the time for a specialist. Some of that nerve damage may be irreversible.

Yes on the ice! :thumbsup:

The bone cracker can only do so much. Then it is off to a specialist or surgery.

I have numbness in my fingers from my first injury. I don't think the damage was from the initial injury but in the length of time it took to remove the inflammation with drugs. There was no pain for a day or so after I got hurt. But as the days went on the pain got worse and worse. I think that is where I took the damage.

They wifey has had two shoulder surgeries due to a car accident. Before and after the surgery she was doing PT per the Doc as well as acupuncture and some other things at the Chiropractor. The Doc was perfectly ok with this. Before we left the recovery room the wifey was hooked up to a TENS unit to relieve pain. We have had one for years from the bone cracker. Dang thing works. Just don't hit the power wheel by accident. :laughing:

For people who don't know about a TENS Unit, Transcutaneous electrical nerve stimulation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It is a box about the size of a pack of smokes that holds a little itty bitty 9 volt battery. There are two wire that each have two pads. You put the pads around the area that has pain and SLOWLY turn on and crank up the power on the TENS unit. The TENS unit shocks the site of the injury and really helps reduce pain. You can wear the TENS unit on your belt. This is good. This is bad. It is easy to hit the power adjustment wheels on the TENS which will rock your wheel. And not in a good way.

The TENS unit really has helped us reduce the pain. It is another tool in pain relief.

Later,
Dan

 

[Depmandog]

.....,

For people who don't know about a TENS Unit.......

It is a box about the size of a pack of smokes that holds a little itty bitty 9 volt battery. There are two wire that each have two pads. You put the pads around the area that has pain and SLOWLY turn on and crank up the power on the TENS unit. The TENS unit shocks the site of the injury and really helps reduce pain. You can wear the TENS unit on your belt. This is good. This is bad. It is easy to hit the power adjustment wheels on the TENS which will rock your wheel. And not in a good way.

The TENS unit really has helped us reduce the pain. It is another tool in pain relief.

Later,
Dan

Several years back, my ortho surgeon wanted me to purchase a TENS unit. He gave me the name of a rep. I called him, asked how much this TENS unit was (we have 5k deductible). He said the price was $3100. I thought to my self - holy smokes that's high.

A few days later, I visited my chiropractor. I was telling him the Doc had prescribed a TENS, but I didn't think I was going to purchase it because of the price. He excused himself, came back im a few minutes with a thin catalogue, thumbed a few pages then said "Do you think this would work?" A TENS unit for less then $200!!! Looked just like the one the rep was trying to sell me!

I had the Chiro order it in, he didn't charge may any markup, and two days later - I had a TENS unit!!! You can bet the next time I saw that ortho I gave him a piece of my mind!! I told him there is no reason he couldn't order the same thing my chiro did, and save everybody some money.

I have have an internal stimulator now, so I don't use the TENS unit too often. But it was money WELL spent.

Dan I am curious about your neck stretcher. Do you have a pic you could post? That sounds like that would feel might good some days.

 

[Depmandog]

I found this neck stretcher for $30 plus shipping. Is this like yours Dan?

http://www.neckstretcher.net/

Looks like this would be the ticket!!
Thanks!

 

[Robert_in_NY]

End of last year, I finally was diagnosed with Stenosis. After several years of light to moderate and sometimes severe pain, it was nice to find out what it was. It is a PITA, literally, when your lower back gets messed up.

Good thing is Doctor said at this point it is manageable, I.E. no surgery, that was probably one of the biggest factors in why I neglected to see a surgeon sooner. I have heard SOO many horror stories about back surgery, but the surgeon said
"those day's" are pretty much over with all the new technologies now.

Treatments right now are an occasional "stretching" (totally awesome) Steroid injections, (haven't done that yet) and of course the "knife" ( don't want to).

Last 3 day's been laid up and all I did was take the wife fish'n:thumbsup: Better today, actually got out and watered the flowers.

I am only a "hard" 48 years old, doc said I have really overworked my back and he see's that more now day's in the younger folks, used to be nothing to grabbing 2 square bales and head for the trailer.

Word to the wise::: Take care of your back and pay attention on how and what you lift, it "aint " worth the drama to be a tough guy when you start getting older.

I understand your fear of having back surgery but your doctor is right. The horror stories are mostly a thing of the past. In your situation you are lucky in that you can do your research and find the best doctor available if it does come to the point where you need surgery. When I broke my back I didn't really have much time to think it over. I was flown directly to ECMC (which is the Erie County Medical Center). The neurosurgeon on staff at the time ended up being a good one. He went over all my options and gave me plenty of time to decide what to do. I was there 7 days before we actually did the surgery. My pain is only from pushing myself too hard. I don't have chronic back pain. In fact, I actually have less back pain now then before I broke my back. I not only take things a little easier but I also do things smarter and with less stress on my body. So if it does come down to it just take your time, ask lots of questions, get a second opinion and find the best doctor your comfortable with and hope for the best.