Buying Advice Backhoe on a SCUT - yea or nay?

[dragoneggs]

I got myself unstuck with the backhoe dozens of times. A wrecker bill is probably $200 so that paid for like half the backhoe. Then again I’d have probably been more careful without it. I told a guy that had his 4x4 truck stuck that I wouldn’t have got my 2wd truck stuck there because I’d have known I couldn’t do it and wouldn’t have gone there.

Well... maybe it should be part of your buying decision. Now that I think of it, I have unstuck myself 3 times in the mud that I can remember... all in the same place (I'm a slow learner) and where I'm at there are no other tractors around and no way to get my 4x4 truck in position to help.

Another real handy use is traversing a steep slope and using the boom to counter balance towards the side hill to minimize a catastrophic roll over.

 

[4570Man]

Well... maybe it should be part of your buying decision. Now that I think of it, I have unstuck myself 3 times in the mud that I can remember... all in the same place (I'm a slow learner) and where I'm at there are no other tractors around and no way to get my 4x4 truck in position to help.

Another real handy use is traversing a steep slope and using the boom to counter balance towards the side hill to minimize a catastrophic roll over.

Well I’ve never paid a wrecker bill to get anything unstuck but it goes faster and easier with a backhoe. I swing the backhoe to the high side of a hill all the time. That’s one of the biggest reasons why I don’t like a 3 stick case backhoe.

 

[djefferis]

In my opinion at least 25% of the prices for JD machines are in the paint and badging. The actual machines aren't really all that different. I'm thinking a red 1025R with MF badging would probably be priced about the same as the 17 series MFs.

Agreed, but financing is a part of that too - at least for me. Prices quoted were cash by MF dealer and cash/finance from JD (no cash discount). If I went finance - 0% on the MF, price between a 1720 and 1025 was actually in the Deere favor by about 3%. Of course spec wise a GC1720 beats a 1025 to me. Metal over plastic, higher PTO HP.

I checked on the next level up MF to get a fair comparison to a 2025, price would be more..and I知 at the high end of my comfort range on a 2025. Not that the MF is lesser, it beats the 2025...but got to draw a line somewhere.

Also, do I think I壇 notice 3 horses - not really....if I WAS, then that痴 a sign whatever I selected was underpowered to begin with. Specs are great for shiny pamphlets in showrooms - in reality you have to try both side by side to determine what痴 best for your needs. Of course that痴 not possible most times, so you just need to ensure what you select meets your needs. My reason for not liking green and orange cheerleaders comes in when they somehow mistake their selection meeting their needs as their selection being 都uperior somehow. Lots of great reasons to go with either...but internet popularity contest ain稚 one in my opinion. Of course there are great support areas for these and other bandwagons on the net with some invaluable free resources.

 

[MaineGuy1]

Agreed, but financing is a part of that too - at least for me. Prices quoted were cash by MF dealer and cash/finance from JD (no cash discount). If I went finance - 0% on the MF, price between a 1720 and 1025 was actually in the Deere favor by about 3%. Of course spec wise a GC1720 beats a 1025 to me. Metal over plastic, higher PTO HP.

I checked on the next level up MF to get a fair comparison to a 2025, price would be more..and I知 at the high end of my comfort range on a 2025. Not that the MF is lesser, it beats the 2025...but got to draw a line somewhere.

Also, do I think I壇 notice 3 horses - not really....if I WAS, then that痴 a sign whatever I selected was underpowered to begin with. Specs are great for shiny pamphlets in showrooms - in reality you have to try both side by side to determine what痴 best for your needs. Of course that痴 not possible most times, so you just need to ensure what you select meets your needs. My reason for not liking green and orange cheerleaders comes in when they somehow mistake their selection meeting their needs as their selection being 都uperior somehow. Lots of great reasons to go with either...but internet popularity contest ain稚 one in my opinion. Of course there are great support areas for these and other bandwagons on the net with some invaluable free resources.[/QUOTE

Just don't finance through Massey, Finance through a bank or credit union. If you deal with the right people you can get low interest rates on tractors.

 

[edgarrian]

You can load a truck quicker with a excavator, dig holes faster, carry a grade much easier. Of course in different scenarios the backhoe is going to be better. I will tell you that i don't see to many excavation companies that have backhoes any more. Some do. But if you are installing any kind of pipe, clearing land, loading trucks, digging basements, dig footers then the excavator trumps a backhoe every day and twice on sunday. Id say the poster probably doesn't have a lot of work for a bh attachment and if he can run an excavator it would be much easier. He would get the work done twice as fast. If he needs to move material have a friend run the massey

An excavator fails in versatility against a backhoe. Mobility is important to me. The excavator can稚 drive 25 mph down the road, you can稚 buy an excavator for half what a backhoe cost and use the other half for a skid steer. If you dropped the excavator to a size where I could haul it and a skid steer at the same time you have little chance of beating my full size backhoe. If you lost 2 hours on a days work to go get the second machine you have little chance of beating my backhoe. If youæ±*e using the excavator to do a job you should do with a loader bucket you have little chance of beating the backhoe.

 

[Gary Fowler]

Also, do I think I壇 notice 3 horses - not really....if I WAS, then that痴 a sign whatever I selected was underpowered to begin with. Specs are great for shiny pamphlets in showrooms - in reality you have to try both side by side to determine what痴 best for your needs. Of course that痴 not possible most times, so you just need to ensure what you select meets your needs.

Unless your tractor is really underpowered to start with, 3 or even 5 HP is not going to be missed. Most small tractors run out of traction way before running out of engine power. Of course if you are using the PTO for task like bush hogging, you can overload them really easy in tough mowing conditions. This is overcome by just going slower. When selecting a mower, I never select the size based on using it in high range in the roughest conditions. 5 HP per foot is pretty consistent with folks advice but in normal conditions 4 or even 3 HP per foot might work well. The previous owner of my B26 used a 5 foot light duty bush hog with it and he cut waist high grass with it (19 PTO HP). One can always overlap previously cut area in the rough stuff.

 

[4570Man]

You can load a truck quicker with a excavator, dig holes faster, carry a grade much easier. Of course in different scenarios the backhoe is going to be better. I will tell you that i don't see to many excavation companies that have backhoes any more. Some do. But if you are installing any kind of pipe, clearing land, loading trucks, digging basements, dig footers then the excavator trumps a backhoe every day and twice on sunday. Id say the poster probably doesn't have a lot of work for a bh attachment and if he can run an excavator it would be much easier. He would get the work done twice as fast. If he needs to move material have a friend run the massey

Mini excavators can’t load trucks faster. Construction guys have excavators and skid steers. One or the other can’t beat a backhoe. If you can afford to buy both and have a way to move both then the excavator and skid steer is the obvious better choice.

 

[atsah]

I agree with ed, rubber tired backhoes are not even comparable with excavators. I rent them once in a while, just being able to swing it around and it's capability, It's just made to do that kind of stuff. Messing around with a SCUT with a backhoe on it is fun to some but not for me..

 

[djefferis]

[/QUOTE Just don't finance through Massey, Finance through a bank or credit union. If you deal with the right people you can get low interest rates on tractors.[/QUOTE]

True - but manufacturers are offering 0% - perhaps I've been asking the wrong people, but even with a credit union 5-6% is seemingly more in line with what they would offer.

So borrow 20k over 5 years at 5% - your looking at about $3600 in interest cost over the term, perhaps a little more. Granted if your able to cut this down by half, or make large payments up front you can save quite a bit on interest...but its still a good example of why Deere and Kubota are commanding a lions share of the market for financed units. They can borrow for next to nothing through their respective finance companies (US Fed overnight lending rate is 2.5% while Japan is at -.1 and Germany is a flat 0 presently) so very easy to borrow for pennies and lend out at the same, while marking up things 5-15% the selling price you would expect with normal selling conditions sans financing.

Also, I understand when people point out how Kubota for example is a Japanese based company, and Deere is clearly US based - that said, both are large multinationals - and are not limited to borrowing from their respective countries fed banks solely. In fact both clearly use several different banks for a variety of reasons. Just because the US Fed is lending at 2.5% does not make it "more" expensive to borrow from - remember, we loan in USD - Japan lends in Yen, ect..so if the USD is outperforming other currencies, it may actually be CHEAPER to borrow dollars than Yen for example.

 

[edgarrian]

Mini excavators can’t load trucks faster. Construction guys have excavators and skid steers. One or the other can’t beat a backhoe. If you can afford to buy both and have a way to move both then the excavator and skid steer is the obvious better choice.

Just have to disagree. Even a big mini excavator can load a truck faster than a backhoe. If you set up properly, biuld the pile up and sit on top of it and load the truck. Plus in hard compacted dirt the little tractor and the BH will fumble around and not work very good. Add in some stones that are good sized and its just a lot of messing around with a backhoe. You are also not really comparing apples to apples. I was suggesting mini ex bc it will do the job much quicker. Your suggesting the backhoe will load a truck faster. Well if you use the Massey to load a truck good luck getting that done. Good sized backhoe in comparison to a similar sized excavator. Excavator wins every time