Backup for wood boiler

[stumblinhorse]

Have you owned a wood boiler before?

I had over a dozen friends and coworkers in the mid 2000's put in wood boilers (i have a jutol stove myself)

Not a single one is still doing it. Some the boiler failed and they were sick of being a slave to it and were not saving any money. Other just simply gave up on it. They burn 20 plus cords a wood a year. I burn 2 cords in an efficient wood stove for the same size house plus about 400 gals of propane for shoulder season or when we take trips but that is hot water and stove as well

I am now in the propane business and see the same thing every summer, new customers giving up on the grind of a boiler.

I know one customer that still does have a boiler but its not a wood boiler. Its a big bale boiler and it opens so he can stick a bale of rotten hay or cornstalks in the sucker every other day. He can throw wood in it as well. He is heating his house and his fathers house plus a shop so it make sense.

If you still want to do that, a condensing modulating tank water heater could provide your hot water needs plus be plumbed to the in floor system for heat/freeze protection of the boiler if done right. They are like a modulating boiler with a tank. Much more efficient and the tank provides buffering so it doesn't short cycle. Propane is going to be cheaper than any electric resistant heat unless your electricity is hydro.

I own an outdoor wood boiler. It is a central boiler eclassic. It is 14 years old.

I would say that 99% of people are not motivated enough to run one. They are sold on the idea you fill it and forget about it. They just don’t work that way. I add wood 2x a day and clean it the first of every month. You cannot leave it unattended for more than 1 day. The more wood you add the more it burns. Everyone that I talk to tells me to fill it and forget. That doesn’t work. Or it is wasteful and inefficient.

Not clean or overfilled it will burn massive amounts of wood. But this morning, temp was 4°F, I added 2 pieces of split pine from a 16” round 24” long. So basically, 1 24” long 16” pine log split into 2 pieces. That will still be there in 12 hours. I will add 4 more pieces for sub zero temps tonight.

I have slowly reduced my total wood usage to about 4 cords a winter. It is very cold here, but luckily this year has been “warmer” as we have only had 20 days of temps less that -20° F and most days have reached positive temps for a high. I think we have had about 15 days that reached over 32° for a high.

But certainly most people will not have the results I have. They do not pay enough attention to what works and what doesn’t.

 

[Zerk]

I had heard stories about outdoor wood boilers rusting out in 10 years. I don't know if true. If true for the price build a shed with ventilation? I use about 800 gallons of propane to heat my house. Less than 1500 a year.

I heat with wood at camp, because I enjoy it, and I don't like listening to the the furnace. I have thought about wood back up at home for the sake of back up, and I got some dead trees.

 

[USMC43]

I had heard stories about outdoor wood boilers rusting out in 10 years. I don't know if true. If true for the price build a shed with ventilation? I use about 800 gallons of propane to heat my house. Less than 1500 a year.

I heat with wood at camp, because I enjoy it, and I don't like listening to the the furnace. I have thought about wood back up at home for the sake of back up, and I got some dead trees.

Its not to far off, 15 years seems to be more common, and its a crap shoot if its cracked or rusted through but same result.

They are not pressurized and open to the atmosphere so lots of oxygen in the system. Adding corrosion inhibitors to the water helps but doesn't eliminate it. They rust from the inside out, heat cycles from the fire crack them and Stainless steel ones don't necessary last longer as it expands/contracts more with heat cycles and cracks.

Most already have a shed prebuilt over them to protect from the weather

I own an outdoor wood boiler. It is a central boiler eclassic. It is 14 years old.

I would say that 99% of people are not motivated enough to run one. They are sold on the idea you fill it and forget about it. They just don’t work that way. I add wood 2x a day and clean it the first of every month. You cannot leave it unattended for more than 1 day. The more wood you add the more it burns. Everyone that I talk to tells me to fill it and forget. That doesn’t work. Or it is wasteful and inefficient.

Not clean or overfilled it will burn massive amounts of wood. But this morning, temp was 4°F, I added 2 pieces of split pine from a 16” round 24” long. So basically, 1 24” long 16” pine log split into 2 pieces. That will still be there in 12 hours. I will add 4 more pieces for sub zero temps tonight.

I have slowly reduced my total wood usage to about 4 cords a winter. It is very cold here, but luckily this year has been “warmer” as we have only had 20 days of temps less that -20° F and most days have reached positive temps for a high. I think we have had about 15 days that reached over 32° for a high.

But certainly most people will not have the results I have. They do not pay enough attention to what works and what doesn’t.

Yes, ever single guy that I am talking about never got ahead of cutting wood and getting it dry, and would pack as much as they could (of wet and unsplit wood)

I some day may install a Garn.

 

[Zerk]

Most already have a shed prebuilt over them to protect from the weather

Would another shed help? Or is it jus the air like you said? It just doesn't seem like long for what I hear you pay. If you got a big place and you like it warm, maybe it works out.

I used to think I wanted one, but in my case I don't know if math works out. Again I think it matters if you got big place heated shop, ect. I like cutting wood and you have wood often to deal with that comes down.

I know someone with boiler in attached garage with shute to load wood into. Not going to get the long burn time and has to split into smaller pieces. But I am guessing it last longer.

 

[stumblinhorse]

Mine is outside…. No protection.

Most people are just not willing to do what it takes. Clean it when it needs. Fill it a little and more often. It sucks to be out there troubleshooting a problem when it is -25°F. Trust me, I know. I try to plan ahead and if it is going to be really cold I clean it in advance. The colder the air it draws in the more it can get an air restriction. Once a little restricted, in a couple of days you might need to completely shut it down to fix the blockage…

I also cut/split wood in the early spring to dry all summer. I slowly am doing less to not have a bunch left over.

 

[Billy Bee]

20th year on my Woodmaster 4400 not in a shed. Have replaced 2 circulating pumps and a rope seal.

 

[USMC43]

Would another shed help? Or is it jus the air like you said? It just doesn't seem like long for what I hear you pay. If you got a big place and you like it warm, maybe it works out.

I used to think I wanted one, but in my case I don't know if math works out. Again I think it matters if you got big place heated shop, ect. I like cutting wood and you have wood often to deal with that comes down.

I know someone with boiler in attached garage with shute to load wood into. Not going to get the long burn time and has to split into smaller pieces. But I am guessing it last longer.

The then another shed helps over the boiler is keeping a couple of days wood dry next to it and keeping you out of the rain.

They do pencil out more if there is multiple buildings.

As stumblinhorse stated if you use small pieces that a dry and often it works better.

 

[stumblinhorse]

Just that easy…

 

[geteh]

Not really possible to give you good advice here without knowing the general location. Heating efficiency is completely dependant upon climate conditions.

That said, my 1650 sq ft house is heated primarily with our woodstove. We have baseboard electric resistance radiators in the bedrooms, and bathroom toe-kick heaters on individual thermostats that never, ever get used. A couple thousand extra bucks during home construction to satisfy our local zoning inspector, and our own conscience about the "out of town" scenario. But we never, ever use them.

Instead, we do occasionally use our 24k btu ductless mini-split in heat mode for nice, quiet air heating. It works splendidly in the "shoulder" seasons when you want to take the chill off but not blast the house with a full load of firewood. And still works pretty well down to ~20°F to hold the house above 65f inside when necessary.

Other considerations of my house that probably won't apply to yours (but should!) :
- passive solar design. No solar radiation blocking from our copious south facing windows (check your glazing options!). If it's sunny, we don't even need a fire.
- earth bermed design: the north wall and most of the west wall of our house is set into the hill side https://londoncityplumbers.co.uk/service/boiler-installation-london/
- house is on slab with no basement. 4" of insulation under the slab to hold a huge mass at room temp and condition the home inside
- Super tight and super insulated walls/roof with full thermal break (R30/R50) with fully taped layer of poly-iso boards on the exterior of the sheathing.

I have a 1400 sq. ft. apartment in central Maine in a renovated barn with radiant floor heating. The floors downstairs are concrete and upstairs wood. A Tarm gasification boiler with 820 gallon storage tank is used to heat the floors and DHW. This system was designed by professionals and the total heat load is 40kBTUs/hr. It is a passive solar design so when the sun shines it helps but it doesn't shine a lot in the winter. I have been very happy with the system but I would like to leave for a week or two and I'm looking for a back up system, any recommendations would be appreciated.

 

[Rustyiron]

I have a 1400 sq. ft. apartment in central Maine in a renovated barn with radiant floor heating. The floors downstairs are concrete and upstairs wood. A Tarm gasification boiler with 820 gallon storage tank is used to heat the floors and DHW. This system was designed by professionals and the total heat load is 40kBTUs/hr. It is a passive solar design so when the sun shines it helps but it doesn't shine a lot in the winter. I have been very happy with the system but I would like to leave for a week or two and I'm looking for a back up system, any recommendations would be appreciated.

Check out my response on page 2.