Brake Controller Reese vs. Prodigy vs. ???

[jejeosborne]

I think I was one of the first posters in this thread to suggest that a timer based controller is not ideal in a panic stop situation. That said, there are many factors that affect the stopping distance of a vehicle and it is simply not practical to always drive in a configuration that minimizes stopping distance (no passengers, low on gas, no cargo, and certainly no trailer). You drive conservatively based on the limitations of your vehicle and keep your rig properly equipped within the law and your means.

So you are the reason for the exchange between Soundguy and me. Thanks for taking the heat!

 

[RobertN]

I guess I should dig my manual out. So are you indicating the Prodigy does not brake in reverse?

I do not tow boats; just my tractor/flatbed, and 5th wheel. Not an issue for me, like a boat on a ramp.

Can you elaborate a little on the electric controlled brake systems for a 15,000lb boat/trailer? How does it work once submerged? Guessing the system is water-proof? Only boats I have towed were little 14' w/outboard, single axle no brakes, some years back(pretty lite weight).

Have you ever towed a trailer with the electric over hydraulic brakes on the trailer? Saw a 5th wheel a couple years ago that had that setup. Guessing the system is water-proof?

No, all I have seen have a manual activation but many of the inertia styles will not allow braking in reverse. This is where the timed and pressure based system. Yes, you can always us the manual feature but I dont want to think about it.

Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

I guess I should dig my manual out. So are you indicating the Prodigy does not brake in reverse?

I do not tow boats; just my tractor/flatbed, and 5th wheel. Not an issue for me, like a boat on a ramp.

Can you elaborate a little on the electric controlled brake systems for a 15,000lb boat/trailer? How does it work once submerged? Guessing the system is water-proof? Only boats I have towed were little 14' w/outboard, single axle no brakes, some years back(pretty lite weight).

Have you ever towed a trailer with the electric over hydraulic brakes on the trailer? Saw a 5th wheel a couple years ago that had that setup. Guessing the system is water-proof?

First of all, everything I tow except my car haul trailer have DISC Brakes, not drums. I have battled drums for years and now order them with Disc or convert them asap.

The two bigger boats I tow have electric over hydraulic systems with tri axles and 14" disc on all 6 wheels. It will stop that load in a hurry.

I have seen electric drums on boat trailers but they are not common. They work just fine in fresh water. Not so sure about salt water but I never do that anyway so its not a issue. I have backed my 18' car hauler in the drink a few times to haul dock sections out, ect. No issues with the electric brakes.

Chris

 

[devildog1]

I have the Prodigy and have towed across the U.S. quite a few times, it has never broken or let me down. If it works it works, why switch?
DevilDog

 

[RobertN]

Sounds like your boat elect/hydro is what I also saw on that 5th wheel; I did not ask if it was drum or disc.

Having disc on all our vehicles now, I could see where that would be nice on the trailer. Not that I could afford it right now, but any idea a ballpark to convert a 2 axle 7500gvrw 5th wheel to disc like you describe?

First of all, everything I tow except my car haul trailer have DISC Brakes, not drums. I have battled drums for years and now order them with Disc or convert them asap.

The two bigger boats I tow have electric over hydraulic systems with tri axles and 14" disc on all 6 wheels. It will stop that load in a hurry.

I have seen electric drums on boat trailers but they are not common. They work just fine in fresh water. Not so sure about salt water but I never do that anyway so its not a issue. I have backed my 18' car hauler in the drink a few times to haul dock sections out, ect. No issues with the electric brakes.

Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

Sounds like your boat elect/hydro is what I also saw on that 5th wheel; I did not ask if it was drum or disc.

Having disc on all our vehicles now, I could see where that would be nice on the trailer. Not that I could afford it right now, but any idea a ballpark to convert a 2 axle 7500gvrw 5th wheel to disc like you describe?

Disc brakes are cheap. I just did a conversion 2 weeks ago to a customers trailer. I used Kodiak Disc Brakes and it was about the same price as overhauling the existing drum brakes. It was $219 per axle for all the parts necessary to totally convert it.

This was for a 12,000# trailer with 2 6K axles. I am sure you could do a 3.5K axle for around $175 or so.

Chris

 

[jejeosborne]

I guess I should dig my manual out. So are you indicating the Prodigy does not brake in reverse?

I do not tow boats; just my tractor/flatbed, and 5th wheel. Not an issue for me, like a boat on a ramp.

Can you elaborate a little on the electric controlled brake systems for a 15,000lb boat/trailer? How does it work once submerged? Guessing the system is water-proof? Only boats I have towed were little 14' w/outboard, single axle no brakes, some years back(pretty lite weight).

Have you ever towed a trailer with the electric over hydraulic brakes on the trailer? Saw a 5th wheel a couple years ago that had that setup. Guessing the system is water-proof?

To answer your first questions, my prodigy DID work in reverse with the electric brakes on both axles on my boat trailer. The electo-magnets are sealed in epoxy so have no problems being underwater. You must maintain the connections at the wires just as you would on the lighting. My trailer just has drum brakes on two 3500 lb axles. It came from the factory with hydraulic surge brakes I didn't like and converted them to electric. One of the reasons being surge type brakes don't work in reverse going down hill. I welded up the surge points on the tongue a

 

[jejeosborne]

Disc brakes are cheap. I just did a conversion 2 weeks ago to a customers trailer. I used Kodiak Disc Brakes and it was about the same price as overhauling the existing drum brakes. It was $219 per axle for all the parts necessary to totally convert it.

This was for a 12,000# trailer with 2 6K axles. I am sure you could do a 3.5K axle for around $175 or so.

Chris

I didn't realize they were that cheap. I am converting my camper into a toy hauler and adding a second axle in the upcoming weeks and will look into this option for the new axle.

 

[Soundguy]

No, it's not. You choose to justify it that way to enable your argument. And just because something is mass marketed and easily available doesn't automatically qualify/disqualify it's existence. Sometimes it just means the topic never got much media notice befor the insurance co. settled.
And having driven umpteen million miles on " good enough" doesn't necessarily substantiate a claim either. Really just implies that fate/karma/God had a hand in the game. Remember the old saying, " god protects drunks and fools".

Um... ok.. we disagree. no problem.

soundguy

 

[Diamondpilot]

I didn't realize they were that cheap. I am converting my camper into a toy hauler and adding a second axle in the upcoming weeks and will look into this option for the new axle.

I would not mix and match. If you have drums stay with drums. Same is true for disc.

Chris

 

[jejeosborne]

I would not mix and match. If you have drums stay with drums. Same is true for disc.

Chris

Absolutely, I would replace the other axle as well. I have a car hauler trailer that only came with brakes on one axle. I would put the used set on that second axle. Do you find that the disk brakes are much stronger than the drums? As we have previously discussed on another thread, the drums are not capable of locking a tire with a loaded axle. Do you think a disc brake will lock up a 3500 lb axle wheel with say 2000 lbs (1000 lbs/wheel) on it?

 

[Diamondpilot]

Absolutely, I would replace the other axle as well. I have a car hauler trailer that only came with brakes on one axle. I would put the used set on that second axle. Do you find that the disk brakes are much stronger than the drums? As we have previously discussed on another thread, the drums are not capable of locking a tire with a loaded axle. Do you think a disc brake will lock up a 3500 lb axle wheel with say 2000 lbs (1000 lbs/wheel) on it?

Electric drums will not lock up a loaded trailer most times in my experience but hydraulic drums will sometimes.

As for Disc to Drums comparison its just like on your car. They stop much better today with Disc brakes versus the old Drums. So my answer is yes. I would say 1 Disc axle braked is nearly as good as 2 Drum braked axles.

Maintenance is a breeze, no adjusting, ect. You can service the brakes without removing the hub if you get the right type (some include the hub, some are over the hub), ect. Plus pads are cheap, about $10 per set at Auto Zone.

For these reason and as much as I tow, about 10,000 miles a year, I only have disc brakes except on my 18 car hauler.

Chris

 

[CurlyDave]

Back to the original topic, I put a MaxBrake controller on the F-250 this week and it is the best brake controller I have ever used. Vastly superior to the Prodigy with both my dump trailer and the toy hauler.

I have never tried a factory brake controller, so no comparison there.

Putting a "T" in the hydraulic line is not difficult, and the piece supplied seems well made with little danger of leaking. I wish I could say the same for the sensor, but that piece is at the end of an 8" piece of brake line and has the potential for a lot of vibration which could lead to work hardening of the line and ultimately failure of the line, which would leave the vehicle with no brakes.

I tried to mitigate that by securing the short piece of brake line to the master cylinder to prevent vibration. Just a heads up to anyone who tries a MaxBrake, this is a vital step in installation.

 

[Diamondpilot]

While I agree anything can fail I would put odds on it will not. I have installed a couple of these controllers and I do not see a issue. No more chance than any other part of the factory brake system failing.

As a side note. On a modern brake system there are to seperate circuits, front and back. If it was to fail you would only lose one circuit and you would still have the manual mode on the brake controller to activate the trailers brakes.

Chris

 

[Soundguy]

hmm.. 8" is a pretty good lever.. I've seen plenty of brake line used as fuel line on tractors. vibration cracks, while not at all common.. are certaintly not rare either... especially in unsupported run areas where vibration is present.

( ok.. I hope a modern truck engine has less vibrations under the hood than a farm (old?) tractor see's.. I'll give ya that one for free.. )

I'd strain relief the heck out of it with a stiffener support that touched something else inthe area as a brace, then perhaps some pipe insulation as a buffer...

soundguy