Branson 3510 New Fuel Pump & Filter - no fuel at injectors

[Scooter74]

Ok I replaced both the fuel pump and the Fuel Filter - including the housing top because the 90 Degree insert on the inlet side came out.

This all started when I brushogged a small field (2 acres) At the very end as I turned toward the barn the engine bogged down. I hit the clutch, disengaged the brush hog and it recovered. Drove back to the barn and shut it down. two days later I went back out to replace the filter and the pump (The filter housing was only half-full and I figured that this indicated the fuel pump was terminal.) As I reconnected everything I noticed the little elbow from the filter housing was loose. So after several tries to re-seat it unsuccessfully I called our dealer - $20.00 for a new housing, and filter sounded cheap after paying $15.00 at NAPA for their filter.

So yesterday I replaced the housing and started the process of bleeding the system. Starting with at the filter housing, then at the inlet to the injector pump. Tried to start, No go.
Then I loosened each of the injector lines at the cylinder head end and Cranked the system a little, very little fuel bubbled from one injector line. I repeated the process cranking it for no more than 10 seconds at a time. After 5-6 tries still no flow and the starter motor was feeling pretty warm. I quit for the day.

This morning I started all over again with the bleeding process from the filter on. Plenty of fuel at each of the two screws on the filter and at the injector inlet bleed nut. STILL nothing at the injector lines at the head. Confirmed I had them loose enough to see any fuel present.

So - What's next in the troubleshooting process?

I will call a tractor repair shop if I have to but I can't transport this tractor (no truck or trailer) So if I can do it myself that going to be a big $$ savings. Our nearest dealer is about 30 miles away in Siloam Springs Arkansas and I'm on the North End of Rogers, Arkansas.

Open to ideas. Willing to replace the injector pump if need be But wondering if there is some other control/shut off device in the stream of things that I should be checking.

 

[ericm979]

It's unlikely that the injection pump is the problem. When it doesn't run correctly after I worked on something, it's almost always caused by the thing I just worked on.

Did you test the new lift pump? Is the filter bowl full of fuel with no air in it?

There's probably a lot of air in the injector lines.

When you're bleeding the injector lines do you have the throttle at full?

I don't know if injector pumps are self priming... seems like they ought to be.

 

[Scooter74]

Just rechecked the flow at the injector inlet - very good flow. Would post a picture but apparently I don't currently have the permission level to do that.

 

[ptsg]

Just rechecked the flow at the injector inlet - very good flow. Would post a picture but apparently I don't currently have the permission level to do that.

Yeah, you need 10 posts I think. Just post something here or on another thread.

 

[Scooter74]

Well - I called my Branson dealer- the service department says they have never replaced an injector pump on this model so... I went over the various steps I have done. The only thing he added is a question about whether or not the solenoid was actuating. It's just to the right and down from the injector pump. I turned on tractor with him on the phone and it was actuating. He was at a loss.

So I thanked him and hung up.

Checked the bolt sizes on the injector pump with my socket wrench, wiggled the solenoid and actuator arm nothing loose or strange. Tried one more time to bleed the injectors at the head...... Eureka !

Now thinking about. I'm not sure I was seeing the solenoid move nor did I hear is making noise as I was cycling the switch on and off until I had the mechanic on the phone. It was a clear and unmistakable sound and I then remembered seeing and hearing in when I first started the bleeding process.

Here's my suspicion... When I finished bleeding the lines at the filter and the Injector inlet I got out my citrus de-greaser and thoroughly de-greased the area. At the bottom of that area are the electrical lines to/from the solenoid. Since I didn't remember hearing that solenoid operate until the Dealer Mechanic was on the phone - I am wondering if I got those connections wet and it just took 3 days to dry out.

Lines are bled and the engine is running. So be careful when de greasing the engine especially when rising off the de-greaser around those electrical connections. Branson has had issues in the past with silly things like the ignition switch and moisture. My tractor was out in the rain for a little while less than a year after I bought it. I looked out and the flashers were flashing. I called the dealer and it was a known issue that the boots on those switches were not properly waterproofed.

 

[Scooter74]

Update - Ok Water on the contacts may have made the problem worse but I think I've got a failing or failed Solenoid. After cleaning the contact and drying them I tried the solenoid - it twitched but didn't fully actuate the fuel cutoff. I then manually pushed the lever and the lever stayed retracted (Fuel from Injector enabled) I cut the same 2 acre field again and a little more in our woods. When I got back to the barn of course everything should have been plenty warm and dried out. Shut off the motor, then turned the ignition back on. Solenoid didn't move a bit. SO tomorrow I'm going to call my dealer and check price and availability of the part. Replacement should be easy.
Unfortunately there is ZERO in the Service manual of any part that remotely resembles that solenoid. Thanks, Branson.

Going to also check on parts and what 'normal' price would be to fix the hiccuping 3 point problem. Again the Service manual with the tractor is worthless. Anyone with decent pictures diagrams of what it takes to replace it ?? Otherwise I may have to find someone who can do the work for me at my location.

 

[ptsg]

The 3 point hiccuping problem is a known problem on the 3510 and it's caused by bad piston seals on the lift cylinder for the 3 pt. All it needs is the seal kit and a couple of hours to fix it.

For the solenoid, since the 3510 uses the A1700 engine (May need confirmation on this), it shouldn't be too bad to find. Although there is another thread where a owner used an aftermarket solenoid. It's a matter of doing some research I guess. You may also find something on Cummins parts.

Parts manual (doesn't include engine):

View attachment 3510h,4720h CHASSIS (040109).pdf

And you can also use: Branson Tractor Parts | TYM Parts Dealers to either buy or check part numbers for your tractor.

 

[LouNY]

You may want to consider a universal fuel stop cable when you see the price of the stop solenoid;

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/TWRR21CX06

even better for $8;

John Deere Stop Cable For all John Deere - PTSTOP

 

[Scooter74]

Thanks LouNY and ptsg

Ok the Branson dealer has an aftermarket Solenoid at $97.50 +tax

And as LouNY mentioned the Branson part is ridiculous at $227.00 (Dealer would have to order it)

Think for this time I'm going to go with the aftermarket and if that fails I'll resort to a cable.

Before I head over to the dealer (30 Miles (45 Mins best time on back roads)) I'm going to get some alcohol and clean the contacts.

BUT Even if that is NOT the problem - I think moisture contributed to it. That snap fit connector is directly under the fuel filter area so bleeding the filter and degreasing is DEFINITELY going to put diesel, degreaser, and water onto that connector and it is Not Water proof.

Still cannot load pictures here ....yet ? BUT I was able to load an avatar (See left) and that is a picture of the Fuel filter, the injector pump/lines. Along with that, while it's hard to see, the electrical connector for the solenoid is the cream/white connector directly under the fuel filter and the solenoid is in the lower left corner. NOTE: The solenoid rubber housing is NOT compressed as is should be when the ignitiion is on. BUT you ca clearly see the shower of red diesel from the injector pump bleed point.

 

[thepumpguysc]

Just a quick point.. IF the DEALER has an aftermarket solenoid .. then U can find 1.. & its gonna be cheaper than the dealers..
U can prob. get it shipped to your door for a lot less than driving to get it.??
Look for the P# on the sol. itself.. Good luck.
BTW> Great diagnosis..!!!