Bush Hogging 8 acres - pricing?

[LD1]

60” cut you should be able to cut 4-5 acres per hour.

Your delusional.

Most mowing with a tractor simple formula. Mower width x MPH and divide by 10.

10mph x 5' mower = 50
50/10 =5 acres per hour.

8mph = 4 acres per hour.

Aint no small wheeled tractor with a 5' cutter gonna mow worth a crap at those speeds ....and that's even if you can stay in the seat.

I had 30hp and 6' cutter and under the best of conditions I could do 3acre/hr. But usually averaged 2. And some thick nasty stuff, or with lots of stuff to mow around....1ac/hr

Now with 50hp and 8'.....ideal conditions I can get 5ac/hr. But better average is 3.5 or so.

You're an idiot if you think you can mow 5/hr with a 25hp compact and 5' hog

 

[Fixastuff]

That $1/$1000 still holds true today.

You don't inflate the $1/1000.....because that's already accounted for with the inflation of the purchase price.

Basically you are looking to pay off the machine (less any services and repairs) in 1000hrs.


20 years ago a $20k piece of equip would rent for $20/hr.....or $160/day.

Same piece of equipment now cost $40k so tents for $40/hr or $320/day.


You don't double dip on inflation. If you bumped it to $3/1000.....you'd now be renting that $40k equipment for $120/hr or $960/day. So the cost to purchase doubled but you charge 6x....don't work. No body is gonna spend $1000/day for a $40k mini ex or mini skid loader, etc. But $300 is just about right

In these numbers are you just renting the machine out or running it and not paying yourself anything?

If you have machinery, insurance, fuel costs, trucks, trailers, transport time, etc and your not getting 1k per day it's not worth doing.

 

[Hay Dude]

$1,000/8 hour day for running larger machinery would be my barest minimum, unless we are talking something like lawn mowing, then $1,000/day would be adequate. We do 1 large day of mowing per week and make about $1,200-$1,400 GP in that day.

I’d like to be more in the $1,500/ 8 hour day for larger farm tractor & 15‘/20’ bush hog.

Just a small example: I am doing a big aerating job for a Customer. I priced me and the tractor out at $1,400/day. The aerator is $30/acre on top of that. ($20/acre rental)
Look, inflation is killing small timers like us. Many of us don’t realize what they are paying now for all your lubricants, filters, parts and service. They all went up 20-50% (fuel 200%) in last 1-2 years. You don’t even realize your arent making money.
Adjust accordingly, or you will go under.

If you didn’t raise your prices in ‘21, you are working at thinnest of margins or maybe even losing money.

One of the things I hate about my business is there’s a lot of small timers making 100 round bales for $60/bale or mowing 2-3 fields per year for $50/hour and they are losing money. They do it because they have fun or feel macho owning some equipment. They rarely carry insurance or have any back-up equipment, but they appeal to cheap skate horse or land owners. Those guys kill us legitimate farmers and insured, proper mowing contractors.

I have half a mind to report them as illegitimate businesses, but I never will because this is America and I believe in leaving people alone.

 

[LD1]

In these numbers are you just renting the machine out or running it and not paying yourself anything?

If you have machinery, insurance, fuel costs, trucks, trailers, transport time, etc and your not getting 1k per day it's not worth doing.

If you read the post I quoted in my reply....I took that as just rental cost of equipment. Not actually the contractor doing the work.

What one pays themselves should NOT be tied to equipment cost.

IE: if you charge $1 per /1000 for equipment and $1/1000 for operator.....someone with a $20k cut and mower is gonna charge $40/hour.....they gonna loose money. Because even an operator on a CUT is worth more than $20/hr.


On the flip side.....someone with a $500,000 excavator may easily get $500/hr for their equipment, but is the operator really worth $500/hr?

 

[LD1]

$1,000/8 hour day for running larger machinery would be my barest minimum, unless we are talking something like lawn mowing, then $1,000/day would be adequate. We do 1 large day of mowing per week and make about $1,200 GP in that day.

I’d like to be more in the $1,500/ 8 hour day for larger farm tractor & 15‘/20’ bush hog.

Just a small example: I am doing a big aerating job for a Customer. I priced me and the tractor out at $1,400/day. The aerator is $30/acre on top of that.

Look, inflation is killing small timers like us. Many of us don’t realize what they are paying now for all your lubricants, filters, parts and service. They all went up 20-50% (fuel 200%) in last 1-2 years. You don’t even realize your arent making money.
Adjust accordingly, or you will go under.

Yup, this inflation is killing the small guys.

I don't bid by the hour, but if I'm not grossing $100/hr from the time I leave my house til the time I'm back home.....I just stay on the couch....lol. A few years ago I was only targeting $75/hr.

Obviously you got equipment that's 3x or more the cost of mine.

Prices are all over the place in my area. I still see guys advertising field mowing for $50/hr and $50 min. Either that is clickbait just to get them to call, or they won't be around long.

There are also a few guys with 3000-series Deere's and 5' cutters charging ALOT more than me. Can't imagine they are getting much work. I had one customer reach out for mowing after someone gave them my number. Little 2acre pasture 10min from the house. My minimum is $200...she was tickled with the price. Took 40 min to mow. The other local guy with the little deere and 5' mower told her $550. And that's just one of about half a dozen jobs I've done this year that said they had that guy bid 2x what my bid was

 

[Yander]

60” cut you should be able to cut 4-5 acres per hour.

For some perspective, I can cut 4-5 acres per hour, of grass, on my 60" ZTR mowing at approx 9-11 mph (ZTR so very little turn around time). I bushhog at approx 2-3 mph which would include a lot of turn around time. This amount of land could not possibly be done with the same size cutter at 2-3 mph.

If your statement is for a ZTR just cutting grass that isn't high, absolutely, but not bushhogging. As has been said, no field is the same either. Bushhogging dense brush, you couldn't even go 2-3mph on my equipment, maybe something bigger you could.

 

[LittleBittyBigJohn]

One of the things I hate about my business is there’s a lot of small timers making 100 round bales for $60/bale or mowing 2-3 fields per year for $50/hour and they are losing money. They do it because they have fun or feel macho owning some equipment. They rarely carry insurance or have any back-up equipment, but they appeal to cheap skate horse or land owners. Those guys kill us legitimate farmers and insured, proper mowing contractors.

This is one of the reasons I had said in an earlier post that I tried not to undercut the established guys.

1. There are people that do this (whatever the job may be) to put food on the table. I don't want to take food off of someone's plate just for me to make a little money on the side.
2. If I'm doing at least as good of a job as the full-timers, there is no reason for me not to be making market rate, or at least close to it.

Also realize there is a difference between long term customers and one time customers. Customers that are going to hire a job out long term are going to typically respect the operator and realize that quality matters. That customer realizes there is value in good work, honesty, and dependability. They are not going to switch contractors just because someone new comes up with a cheaper price. The contractors that under-cut are going to end up with customers that are not typically loyal and will jump for the next cheapest guy as fast as they jumped on the first to under-cut.

There is nothing wrong with being a little cheaper while learning, acquiring quality equipment and improving. But I don't feel it is a good business model to be the cheapest guy out there.

Either offer something no-one else does, or be the best at what you do.

 

[crashz]

Someone asked about my insurance company in a post above (page 7 or so): Next Insurance.

OP - please post after you complete the job and let us know how you first paid job goes.

I cut a customer property yesterday. He is my favorite customer by far. His field is just under 2 acres. He wanted it cut with the finish mower (right decision, looked great!) but its was fairly thick, and my tractor only puts out 19 PTO HP. Fine for a lawn, but dragging a 6ft finish mower in heavy grass 1-2ft tall was a chore. It took me three hours including a bit of trimming I do for him. Oh, and I hit a rock with the mower, probably bending my one of my brand new blades (1st cut).

Over 4 years of doing this for my regulars has brought me to the point of this: I need to upgrade and fully commit to mowing (NEED a cab tractor with more hp and stability) or stop. Not only is it costing more in time than I can justify, but I'm left with the after effects after each cutting: sunburns, hay-fever (I try to wear masks, but yesterday was hot!), poison ivy, and the maintenance afterwards.

 

[LD1]

Someone asked about my insurance company in a post above (page 7 or so): Next Insurance.

OP - please post after you complete the job and let us know how you first paid job goes.

I cut a customer property yesterday. He is my favorite customer by far. His field is just under 2 acres. He wanted it cut with the finish mower (right decision, looked great!) but its was fairly thick, and my tractor only puts out 19 PTO HP. Fine for a lawn, but dragging a 6ft finish mower in heavy grass 1-2ft tall was a chore. It took me three hours including a bit of trimming I do for him. Oh, and I hit a rock with the mower, probably bending my one of my brand new blades (1st cut).

Over 4 years of doing this for my regulars has brought me to the point of this: I need to upgrade and fully commit to mowing (NEED a cab tractor with more hp and stability) or stop. Not only is it costing more in time than I can justify, but I'm left with the after effects after each cutting: sunburns, hay-fever (I try to wear masks, but yesterday was hot!), poison ivy, and the maintenance afterwards.

There is no end to always wanting bigger.

My 50hp MX and 8' cutter is probably middle of the pack.

Not the modern 8n sized machines pulling 5' but nothing like haydude with 150hp and a batwing.

I get on 20-30 acre jobs that take me 6 hours or so and I'm found wishing I had some large equipment.

But on the flip side....I turn down work, or refer customers to competitors that are just too small. I can't fit through 8' gates.....I can get under tree limbs as well, or trying to mow 1/2 acre because their mower broke and lawn hasn't been mowed in 2-months. Just don't have the visibility and "feel" for doing a lawn type without knowing where septic and wellcasing are. Not to mention 7000# machine on what they want to reclaim as "yard". If it's soft at all I'll do more harm than good.

And it's tough to compete price wise when they can tow with a half ton and landscape trailer and I'm pulling a gooseneck behind a 3500 flat bed truck

 

[Lineman North Florida]

60” cut you should be able to cut 4-5 acres per hour.

You might run over 4 or 5 acres per hour but you ain't cutting that much with a 5' mower.