Call out to Tennessee Farmers, I have lots of ???

[MrSteve]

Hello… To start off this post, we are going to relocate to Tennessee from Florida. We are just starting to do this by putting up our land for sell and knowing we would like to go to the Crossville area of Tennessee. Are plans are to get as much farm land (no house/structures) as we can afford then start from there to build our “Horse Farm” with a house, barn, hey storage, and so on. To be a bit personal, our budget for just the “land” is around $400,000. We are hopping to find 100+ acres (more would be great, even if we never use it) with 80% to 90% clear for growing hey, pastures for the horses and structures. So there is the new history of our plans, so to the point of this post with all the questions I can think of at this time…

We are “kind of” thinking it would be best to buy something small 1st with a house/barn and so on then find what we need/want while already living there. We have 6 horses now so we would need to find something with about 10 acres (pretty much clear) for the horses to have space. Is this a good thought?

Is our price range going to get what we want in land (100+ acres)?

What is the average cost per acre of clear or mostly clear land with a bit of rolling hills (max of rolling hills)?

What type of hey can be grown? (T&A?)

How many cuts per season do you get in hey?

What is the frost line? Asking for fencing, water lines (are hydrants needed for pastures?)

How is the water supply for wells, if city/county water isn’t available?

How is perk testing for septic?

Are septic a problem with cost of building? In other words, will we need a mini sewage factory ( I am being funning with that statement) to take care of waist?

How are the Contractors for home building? Are they great, good, average or worse?

Say with building a “Farm” house of around 2500 sq ft what is the time frame we would be looking at?

How about Log Homes… Any good Companies in the area and time frame for about 2,500 sq ft?

Ok I guess that is it for now… I know asking the thing I have is a hit and miss to good replies, but if you have done any of what I said any reply to me is a great reply. Yes I have more questions, but I think some of them will be brought up by others and answered.

Thanks for ANY and ALL replies.

 

[scott_vt]

Hi Steve,
Boy that was a mouthfull /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Is your wife givin you money again /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I dont know much about Tennessee realestate, but you can get a ton of land for that price.

Rule #1 Dont go flashin your money around /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Rule #2 Make it sound like your lookin for the moon on a shoestring budget /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Rule #3 Have fun doin it /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Good Luck in the hunt!

scotty
ps One other thing, I have been to Bristol Speedway, and Tennessee is one beautiful state IMHO /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[SnowRidge]

Another couple of Floridians relocating to Tennessee. I'll try and answer some of your questions.

<font color="blue"> Is our price range going to get what we want in land (100+ acres)? </font>

You could have gotten 1,000 acres for that a couple of years ago, but now with all the people coming up from Florida, you will be lucky to get 2 1/2 acres and an outhouse.

<font color="blue"> What type of hey can be grown? (T&A?) </font>

With land, I would have thought you would have wanted to grow 'hay.' However, if it's 'hey' you want, you are definitely in the right area when you talk T&A. There are a couple of T&A joints in Knoxville (so I'm told), where 'hey' is only one of the shouts frequently heard. Knoxville is somewhat downhill from Crossville, so check your brakes first.

All of the above with tongue very firmly in cheek. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Welcome aboard. I'll see if I can be a bit more serious for the rest of this.

We are 35 miles southeast of downtown Knoxville and just within commuting distance, so our prices here are driven somewhat by demand from people looking to live and/or work in the Knoxville area. Frankly, land prices are going up. Right now, I would say about the cheapest you can buy good undeveloped land is $3,000 an acre. Some people are paying more. Crossville may be slightly higher or lower; I'm not sure which.

While it is out of the Knoxville commuting area, it seems to be growing quite a bit. I can't quote official figures. It just looks that way to us. Personally, I like the area a lot, but my wife has to continue to work at her high tech job in order to support me in the style to which I would like to become accustomed, so we had to locate a commutable distance from Knoxville.

About the only place I have seen mechanical irrigation is the State tree nursery down in Etowah. Nobody in my valley irrigates for hay that I have seen. I don't grow it myself.

I think your idea of getting a temporary place to live while you research the area is a good one. I think it takes about a year to learn a place well enough to make sure you are getting the best deal that can be gotten. We looked for several months, and had a dickens of a time finding some of the undeveloped property that was on the market. It was pretty clear that some of it had not been visited by the listing agent for months. Descriptions were vague and signs were frequently completely missing or laying flat making them difficult to spot from a moving vehicle. Knowing the area better would really have helped.

Don't forget to check the tax rates in the various counties and towns around the Crossville area. You may find significant differences, if it is anything like the Knoxville area.

I would also suggest surfing the net for property listings. Most realtors today have a web site. The good ones have all their listings easily accessible.

The rest of your questions are pretty specific to the Crossville area. I'm not sure if there is anybody on TBN located right in that area, but with luck, somebody will pop up.

 

[MrSteve]

Scott... Um right, the wife giving ME money that’s funning, no I have to do the leg work and she gets to spend it all… Once in awhile see might feed me. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Yes I know the post was a big one, but there is so much info I need to make this move (when it happens) easy as possible for use humans and the horses.

I know what you mean… The moon is our goal for the cost of a pound, no money will be said or shown until after the fact.

We have heard so many nice things about Tennessee, that is why that state is our goal. Also looking at the area we are thinking of, we “hope” to get a view of the Cumberland Plateau.


EDIT... SnowRidge thanks for the post, I was making a reply as you made yours, I am reading it now.

EDIT again... Thanks for the info SnowRidge. Yes my typing/word skills are from the greatest /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif . I know what you mean about us Florida people "trying" to take over your part of the woods. Just think of it this way, the wife, oldest daughter and I are from Western New York, so our 3 year old daughter will be the only Florida born person coming with us.

 

[SnowRidge]

Er, I came up from Florida, too. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[KentT]

I'm a native of the area around Knoxville, but have been away for many years. However, I just went through the "land search/buy" scenario last year, looking for a much smaller piece of property for retirement. I can't talk specifically about that area, but will offer this general observation -- the farther you get "out of town" or "off the freeway" the lower the prices are. When you're in the rural areas, land is priced based upon its value as a farm or ranch. Anywhere within commuting distance, land is priced based on it's value for potential development into subdivisions.


What type of hey can be grown? (T&A?)
How many cuts per season do you get in hey?

Timothy and orchard grass are commonly grown, and you can consistently get at least two cuttings, and most often three if the weather cooperates.

What is the frost line? Asking for fencing, water lines (are hydrants needed for pastures?)

Frost line is under 12", but most people go that deep just to be safe.

How is the water supply for wells, if city/county water isn’t available?

This varies from area to area, and elevation to elevation, but overall there is plenty of water, but your well may need to go 200 - 300 feet deep. Most don't bother with irrigation.

How is perk testing for septic?

Varies by county, but in general it's a two step process. Step one (done as part of the purchase) is to have a "soil survey" done to ensure if it will support a septic system. Only questionable soils are actually perk-tested -- which is more expensive. Then, you typically must have the county health department approve the location of your septic system before you can get electric service to the building site -- this is done to ensure that you DO get an approval for your septic system.

Are septic a problem with cost of building? In other words, will we need a mini sewage factory (&#61663; I am being funning with that statement) to take care of waist?

Septic systems for most homes should be less than $5,000 installed -- since most areas won't require a mound system -- unless the site requires that you pump it uphill (such as from a lakeshore). Again, this varies by county, but that's what I've generally found.

How are the Contractors for home building? Are they great, good, average or worse?

Haven't gotten there yet... but to give an idea of cost. The mortgage company I used says that they use $85 sq ft as a rule of thumb for rural areas -- where it's $125 sq ft here in Mass. Towns/cities are proportionally higher in both places.

Say with building a “Farm” house of around 2500 sq ft what is the time frame we would be looking at?

I'd allow 9 months minimum, though it can be done in close to 6 if the weather/timing is right... 12 months is "comfortable."

How about Log Homes… Any good Companies in the area and time frame for about 2,500 sq ft?

Many are headquartered in Tennessee, and the challenge will be deciding which one to use:

http://www.loghomes.org/member.phtml?state=tn

Two at the top end of the scale (for machined, versus hand-crafted) are Tennessee Log Homes from Athens and Heritage Log Homes from Sevierville. There are many others...

 

[MrSteve]

Kent... Thanks so much for that info!

 

[SnowRidge]

<font color="blue"> This varies from area to area, and elevation to elevation, but overall there is plenty of water, but your well may need to go 200 - 300 feet deep. </font>

Ours is at 400 feet, FWIW. So are at least two of our neighbors' (the wells, not the neighbors). A driller I talked to says he has gone to 1,500 feet, but it was unusual. I think it will be highly dependent upon exactly where you relocate to, and is probably one of the first things you should look into when you are able to communicate directly with someone from the Crossville area.

They still seem to use steel casings here, BTW. They were using nothing but plastic when I was in Florida.

 

[KentT]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="blue"> This varies from area to area, and elevation to elevation, but overall there is plenty of water, but your well may need to go 200 - 300 feet deep. </font>

Ours is at 400 feet, FWIW. So are at least two of our neighbors' (the wells, not the neighbors). A driller I talked to says he has gone to 1,500 feet, but it was unusual. I think it will be highly dependent upon exactly where you relocate to, and is probably one of the first things you should look into when you are able to communicate directly with someone from the Crossville area.

)</font>
My soon-to-be neighbors are in the 300' range also, but that's at 1200 ft elevation in the foothills near the Foothills Parkway. Our well in Sevier County was 96' and the water came up to within 3' of the top...

As I said, it varies by location. I'm guessing 1,500 feet well was on a ridgetop/mountaintop somewhere. The whole Tennessee River valley and much of the eastern part of the Cumberland Plateau is undermined by limestone caves and underground streams. Some of the biggest artesian springs I've ever seen are around the edge of the plateau...

 

[EddieWalker]

Don't know anything about the area you've chosen, but I'm sure it's a nice one.

My advice when searching for land is to get a general idea of what the comps in the area are and what dictates those values. Land closer to town in comute distance will be worth more. Land with pasture or marketable timber will be worth more. Anthing that says horses on it is gonna be way more. The most overpriced land is horse property!!

Look online and get an idea of what interests you. Get some maps and figure out what's where. How close to walmart, home depot and hospitals. Do you want to drive two hours to get groceries??? What is the road like getting to the property? Do you have to drive by trailer trash **** or a sewer plant?

Things to watch for are easments, deed restrictions and future development in the area. A good real estate agent is key here to learn these things.

The biggest mistake everyone makes is to hire the first agent they come across. Second mistake is to hire a family member or friend as a realtor. Don't do neither!!!!

Start contacting agents now and see what type of replies you get. Lie about what you can afford and are willing to spend by at least 20 percent. I contacted a hundred by email and recieved replies from about half. Of those, only three responded to my queestions and only one offered advice about the land I was interested in. He told me not to buy in that area because of the crime rate there.

One out of a hundred.

Most replies I got were phone numbers to call them because they were experts on the area and couldn't give out the info over the phone. Remember, the agent works for you. Always have a clause in any contract that you can fire them for cause.

A bad agent can still be etitiled to payment even if you give up on them and buy the land on your own if you still have a contract with them. I made that mistake once.

Get everything in wriiting from your agent. If they tell you that the land has certain types of trees or anything else, make them write it down. Most wont because they are full of it. If they say you can build or improve the land, get it in writing. If they tell you teh easment doesn't exist any more, get it in writing. GET EVERTHING IN WRITING!!!!!

The second the deal closes and they get paid, your new best friend will no longer take you calls or know your alive.

Good luck and have fun,
Eddie

 

[gunslinger101]

Really watch out and look around real good. I bought a farm in East Tenn, in Dandridge and turned out to be a nightmare.
I am not saying all in E.Tenn is like this but where we bought it was.
Neighbors hated us since we weren't born in Tenn, my dog was shot, 2 horses killed, barn was burned down when we went to town.
After we bought the place locals warned us about 2 neighbors we had that ran the last owners off. They were related to one of the local cops, so what they did was ignored.
Just ask around, take your time and be sure you know who your moving in close to.
After we left and sold out at a loss, the DEA busted these people for growing pot. All I know is that area Dandridge, Jefferson city and Newport area is rough, a lot of moon shine still being made and pot grown around there and they don't care who they shoot at.
This was back from 2000 to 2002.

 

[MrSteve]

Thanks for the info Eddie…

gunslinger… OMG that just well sucks that happen to you and your family. You would think in this day and age we can just go on with our lives and not deal with something like that. Hearing things like that have me worried to a point. All the work you have to do just to make sure you are getting what you paid for and also worrying if you have Neighbors down the road 100ft or miles that are going to be a problem to you. I will say I am not one to make the 1st move on being a friendly neighbor, don’t get me wrong, I am a good and friendly neighbor, I am just not the one to say hello 1st. BUT just maybe I will have to make the 1st move when it comes to going to Tenn., if anything before things are bought I could get a feel for who I could be dealing with. Thanks for the heads up, to be honest if that was even on my list it was way down there, now it is nearer to the top.

 

[riptides]

No endorcement here, but a nice tool to use for getting information.

Zillow

-Mike Z. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[scott_vt]

Mornin Jim,
Wow that is a horror story for sure /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

I bought my place in Vt back in the beginning of 2002. No sooner did I buy the place, and I told my wife I was goin out to meet the neighbors. She asks me what Im talkin about, and I said Im going to introduce myself, tell them a little about me and what Im doin here! She told me I was nuts /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Well, I dont have very many neighbors to begin with, but I knocked on doors and did just that. Told them where I was from and so on. Told them Im interested in doin a little farmin at some point in time and told everyone Im not lookin to change a thing! I told them about my grandparents and their small dairy farm in Ny state, and how I grew up next to a dairy farm in Ct. Well, they told me they liked that and that I would always be a flatlander /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif but they have grown to accept me as I am. Hve got some real good friends there now!

Case in point, a year after I bought the place, I managed to forget to bring my toolbox one weekend! It was so darned cold about -25 I managed to break one of my water pipes. Well, made a few phone calls, and in about 10 mins, I had three neighbors at my door with every tool I needed to fix my pipes /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif When everyone left, I looked at the wife and said do you understand why I introduced myself to my neighbors??? She finally got it, the light turned on in her head!
Im not saying, I have never had any issues, but all and all things are good. If my neighbors need help, Im there, like the guy pourin concrete for his barn floor, I was there to help, it goes both ways!

OK, Im outta breath /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

scotty

 

[midlf]

In WI the agent is legally working for the seller unless you have signed an agreement that agent is working for you as the buyer. If you haven't signed such an agreement then always remember who the agent is working for. Their obligation is to get the best deal for the $ELLER.

 

[KentT]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( In WI the agent is legally working for the seller unless you have signed an agreement that agent is working for you as the buyer. If you haven't signed such an agreement then always remember who the agent is working for. Their obligation is to get the best deal for the $ELLER. )</font>

Tennessee is similar -- it has a buyer's agent disclosure form that requires the buyer to sign, acknowledging that he/she understands that they will be paid by the seller....

 

[MrSteve]

Yes, it is the same here in Florida... I have talked to our agent; we ALL understand who is the one that has to pay (us), so I made sure he understood he is working for us when it comes to selling this place. That was even said again after he told us he has investors he will be calling that he knows well.

riptides... Thanks for the site that could/will come in handy.

 

[Slamfire]

$400,000 eh? I've got 30 mountain acres that I'll let you have and leave you with $100,000 to start your mansion with. Only one troublesome neighborhood family, who claim an acre down at the end of the property. You won't get that I'm gonna donate it to the Forest Service, they own a right of way on it anyhow. Of course we're not near Crossville, that's at the other end of our state highway. Rumor has it the Dollywood neighbors are gettin' tired of the congestion, and with a new senic hwy goin' in here they want in on the ground floor. Auction companies claim 10.000 an acre. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[capt_met]

hello mr.steve,
i am a native tennesseean. i would say that most of your ideas are very doable. one point of advice would be to meet the neighbors prior to purchasing your property. you have to be careful how this is handled. i grew up in nashville so i have an accent much diffrent than in the rural areas. which makes me an outsider as well. what has always worked for me is a lot of smiling and compliments about the scenery or weather at first. you will find many friendly people as well as some that will be leery no matter what you do. but usually won't have a problem once the ice is broken.
the crossville area is a wonderful part of the state. great scenery. i have noticed a lot of new construction in that region. much of it is retirement communities and the like from what i can tell. the land prices have gone up a bit the last few years. you might want to check prices in a diffrent area also. i would suggest looking in the area that is north of morristown and south southwest of kingsport. very little industry, tourism, and still conveniant to knoxville and the tri-cities. the further you get west of interstate 81 i think you will find better prices.
good luck in your search
and please don't fly a gator flag. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[MotorSeven]

MrSteve,

Those that piped up about the neighbor thing are giving good advise. Last year, after deciding that my 32ac didn't have a suitable building spot, i got a wild hair and started looking aroung the area for another tract. Found 70ac bordered by a good sized creek on the long side, an old dam that i coulda hydro'd the whole house off of, and a nice flat top of the ridge building location. It is a gorgeous piece of land. The asking price was 1k an ac....hmmm...well it was going to cost quite a bit to get a road into it, but something else nagged at me. So, i went up there 3-4 times, and the last time i walked the entire property line. Saw a fellow in an adjoining pasture on a wheeler doing some deer stand work, so i walked over an introduced myself. He was a local guy that now lived 45min away and hunts the family property as much as he could. I listened more than i talked, but i did tell my intentions of retiring soon and wanting to build a modest home. We both hunt, so we spent quite some time talking about bucks and toms. He then told me about the guy that just got out of prison for pulling a gun on a kid that rode a wheeler along the creek....which meant that this knuckle head would be my neighbor for the tune of about 1500yards. There were rumors of dope being grown and other conflicts with this guy and other folks in the area.
Well, another fellow on a wheeler drove up and stopped. He was looking at the same tract, and was also a displaced local that owned a farm further up the creek. He was looking at the tract strictly for hunting. Believe it or not these two guys knew of each other but had never really met. After another hr of shooting the ----, the second guy starts telling more horror stories about the ex-con and all the equipment that has come up missing around his farm. We all had alot in common and i would have loved to have these two guys as neighbors, but the ex-con was a deal breaker.
Do your homework:

Check the US Census bureau for county facts.
Talk to the neighbors, but be humble.
Drive around the immediate area and look it over.
Make sure that building site is not on a northern saddle that won't get any sun in the winter(i think you can guess how i know that /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif).
Most TN creeks are capable of flooding during heavy rains, so building next to one is not a good idea unless you are above the high(flood) water mark.
Walk every inch of the property more than once.
If you are looking in a more remote area, remember, the locals have lived there since the 1700's, don't step on their toes and respect their way of life, they may not have alot of money but they are rich in many other ways.

Turns out that 63ac next to my original 32ar came up for sale so i jumped on it. My surrounding neighbors are friendly hard working people that have already helped me out(storing my new Kioti in their barn until i get mine built) with a few projects. I do not wish to drag suburbia with me, i wish to adopt their way of life with just a few slight modifications.

Oh, and one more thing, do not assume that a survey it the last word on property lines. Surveying is much more complex in the rural seting, and can frequently be wrong. If you do get one done, take a copy to your neighbors and double check with them that it is correct. This way you can avoid conflict after it is too late.

Sorry for the long post, but i wish i had known about TBN in '01 when i was buying my first tract.

RD