Caroni flail with the Hydraulic shift kit for a Kubota L4600?

[3Lfarms]

Keep an eye out for a used commercial Italian model. Municipalities sell them off every once in a while. I got mine at a local city silent auction for a few hundred bucks. While it’s had a hard life, they did maintain it and after replacing a hydraulic hose and a good cleaning and inspection, it works like a new one at 1/20th the cost. It’s heavy, like 2k lbs or so, but not so heavy that your loader couldn’t pick it up. FYI, moving these things is a bit awkward since they move. They have lifting eyes, I pick mine up with a chain and a couple of clevises.

It would be a bit too big for your current tractor, but it runs just fine on my 60 PTO hp tractor. Which is the minimum the manufacturer recommends for my 200cm (6.5 foot) model. If you are just mowing grass like in most of the videos, you have the hp to turn it, but probably not the weight to handle having that much weight hanging off the side. But...if you are careful and put the correct hydraulic restrictors in the hoses, you could manage until you get a bigger tractor. You won’t be taking down forests of saplings, but you can mow grass just fine. The weight of the mower should be on the rear roller when in use. It’s just the motion of getting it there from the transport position could conceivably tip a cut side tractor to tip over.

 

[BukitCase]

Sid, are you sure about the hydraulic offset being included? I looked at all the pics for this one

Ibex TM73 Flail Mower • Tractor Tools Direct

and, altho it does look a bit better built I saw NO SIGN of any hydraulics - did see some things I woulda liked better than my caroni, like a lifting eye, kickstand -(I have the pieces cut out to add a better designed kick stand to my Caroni)

It also looks like the "non" offset position of the Ibex might actually CENTER the flail on the tractor (the Caroni is either offset by about a foot, or two) - IME, if a feature makes something seem MORE valuable the seller will SHOUT about it; checking their specifications it isn't even MENTIONED

My Caroni tips my crane scale at 673 lbs; they list theirs at 660, so I'd think the two would come out equal on sturdiness, plus they LOOK like they might've come out of the same factory.

also, on the Ibex the second set of hitch mounts (unbolt, move, re-bolt) offsets the flail to the left; the Caroni is slightly to the right, or MORE to the right.

Not sure what a "re-cutter" is, but noticed the Ibex I linked to doesn't seem to have a scraper on the rear roller like the Caroni has.

Also - according to Tractordata.com, your L4600 weighs a little over 1000 lbs LESS than either of my 40 horse older tractors; from my experience using the Caroni at full offset, I don't think I'd like any LESS weight (tail wagging the dog syndrome)

Not tryin' to SELL you my Caroni, I'm keeping it :laughing: but I know I always wanna know EVERYTHING I can before spending a few thou$and on an implement; hopefully I've helped you make YOUR decision... Steve

 

[Sid Post]

Sid, are you sure about the hydraulic offset being included? I looked at all the pics for this one

Ibex TM73 Flail Mower Tractor Tools Direct

and, altho it does look a bit better built I saw NO SIGN of any hydraulics - did see some things I woulda liked better than my caroni, like a lifting eye, kickstand -(I have the pieces cut out to add a better designed kick stand to my Caroni)

It also looks like the "non" offset position of the Ibex might actually CENTER the flail on the tractor (the Caroni is either offset by about a foot, or two) - IME, if a feature makes something seem MORE valuable the seller will SHOUT about it; checking their specifications it isn't even MENTIONED

My Caroni tips my crane scale at 673 lbs; they list theirs at 660, so I'd think the two would come out equal on sturdiness, plus they LOOK like they might've come out of the same factory.

also, on the Ibex the second set of hitch mounts (unbolt, move, re-bolt) offsets the flail to the left; the Caroni is slightly to the right, or MORE to the right.

Not sure what a "re-cutter" is, but noticed the Ibex I linked to doesn't seem to have a scraper on the rear roller like the Caroni has.

Also - according to Tractordata.com, your L4600 weighs a little over 1000 lbs LESS than either of my 40 horse older tractors; from my experience using the Caroni at full offset, I don't think I'd like any LESS weight (tail wagging the dog syndrome)

Not tryin' to SELL you my Caroni, I'm keeping it :laughing: but I know I always wanna know EVERYTHING I can before spending a few thou$and on an implement; hopefully I've helped you make YOUR decision... Steve

Thanks Steve! I've been looking at TractorToolsDirect and the factory website in addition to talking them so, I may be slightly confused with online flail mower overload. :laughing:

The recutter bar isn't a rear roller scraper. I think of it more as a crimper to bust thicker stuff up.

For the most part, I'm not concerned about weight and CG during use. As you mentioned the biggest risk is moving it around off the ground. And yes, the Kubota L4600 IMHO is a bit light for use in rougher field conditions, YMMV. In soft sand, I have spun out more than once with a ground implement and I find it to be very light in the rear end, especially for any ground engagement work. All that being said, I really like the tractor overall but, it isn't the best choice for where I live now; back in Oklahoma it did fine but, East Texas sand, water and, slopes are not its 'best' application. I'm shopping for a Massey 4707 right now so, I'm willing to limp along with the L4600 compromises until then.

The Caroni is a fine economical choice for a lot of people but, for my 'landed' cost in Texas, there are other options to consider. If I lived on the East Coast, the cost advantage would be attractive to go with a Caroni.

At this point, talking with several dealers in the upper MidWest, a 'verge' flail seems like a better option for me. The real question is whether I want to make a significantly larger investment in a Perruzo Elk Cross 1600.

 

[BukitCase]

Know whatcha mean about shipping; IIRC, freight for the Caroni to Oregon was around $300.

The Peruzo site's a dead giveaway to me; "call for price" puts things in the "yacht salesman" territory - as in, if ya hafta ask, you can't afford it

I've toyed with the idea of hanging the Caroni from the boom of my old 580B (with a counterweight hanging from the opposite outrigger) but I've yet to find a higher flow hydraulic pump, the numbers don't quite add up to run the flail on a hydraulic motor - with the right setup, something like that could reach over my crappy neighbor's fence and trim his (never cut) blackberries back enough to see my fence

Oh well, all it takes is money and/or time; and since I'm 74 and on a comfortable but NOT extravagent fixed income, probably ain't gonna happen any time soon ... Steve

 

[Sid Post]

...
The Peruzo site's a dead giveaway to me; "call for price" puts things in the "yacht salesman" territory - as in, if ya hafta ask, you can't afford it

Peruzo is more in the extra heavy county and highway service class of flails. Their verge flail has a "break-away" that most others don't so, if you hook something hard it will release instead of bending the mower or boom. :thumbsup:

The rotar bearings are also mounted outside the frame so you don't have to drop it to replace a bad bearing. Peruzo also has very good aftersale support for parts and service, if you live in the upper MidWest, for an Italian flail.

I've toyed with the idea of hanging the Caroni from the boom of my old 580B (with a counterweight hanging from the opposite outrigger) but I've yet to find a higher flow hydraulic pump, the numbers don't quite add up to run the flail on a hydraulic motor - with the right setup, something like that could reach over my crappy neighbor's fence and trim his (never cut) blackberries back enough to see my fence
...

I watched a Messick's (Kubota) video on YouTube with a new 'verge' rotary/bushog mower powered by a PTO driven hydraulic pump that looks like a good solution for someone like yourself though, it may be a bit spendy. It might be worth a phone call to Messick's to find out just how 'spendy' it is.

 

[Fallon]

I have a Peruzzo Brush Bull 2200 behind my L4060HSTC (40hp engine, 5-6k ballasts with the loader). It's got a 7' working width. A decent bit overkill but I like it. I'm a fan of wide & slow. You cover the same ground but are bouncing around less so it's easier on your machine & back. I have hit more rocks than I care to & have no damage so far. I recently got new hammers & realized mine havent dulled really, the new ones are equally un-sharp.

No issues with stability at all even shifting things around while raised. The loader will barely pick up the 1,700lbs mower but the 3pt handles it fine.

 

[Sid Post]

I have a Peruzzo Brush Bull 2200 behind my L4060HSTC (40hp engine, 5-6k ballasts with the loader). It's got a 7' working width. A decent bit overkill but I like it. I'm a fan of wide & slow. You cover the same ground but are bouncing around less so it's easier on your machine & back. I have hit more rocks than I care to & have no damage so far. I recently got new hammers & realized mine havent dulled really, the new ones are equally un-sharp.

No issues with stability at all even shifting things around while raised. The loader will barely pick up the 1,700lbs mower but the 3pt handles it fine. ...

THANKS! My tractor isn't as heavy as yours but, real-world feedback like this is super helpful.