slowrev
Elite Member
Bob, That quote sounds pretty reasonable for all of that work/materials.
Central air conditioning $$$???
- Thread starter kubmech
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Alan L.
Elite Member
Rat:
My daughter's house A/C unit is sized "by the book". When its hot, they're hot. The unit is not big enough. And the R-values are fine, as they are in my abode. I have a rent house "sized by the book", my tenants complain that it won't cool down when it gets really hot. The house is 2 years old and well-insulated.
Meanwhile, my house stays 68 when its 105, and absolutely no problem with the humidity levels. The building is insulated so the "attic" never even gets as hot as it is outside, and the living quarters has 8 inches in walls and ceiling on top of that.
An A/C can probalby be too big, but "the book" is wrong in north Texas.
My daughter's house A/C unit is sized "by the book". When its hot, they're hot. The unit is not big enough. And the R-values are fine, as they are in my abode. I have a rent house "sized by the book", my tenants complain that it won't cool down when it gets really hot. The house is 2 years old and well-insulated.
Meanwhile, my house stays 68 when its 105, and absolutely no problem with the humidity levels. The building is insulated so the "attic" never even gets as hot as it is outside, and the living quarters has 8 inches in walls and ceiling on top of that.
An A/C can probalby be too big, but "the book" is wrong in north Texas.
Slowrev,
Yes--I've had some comparable pricing done and it's the best I've seen. One other quote was close in total dollars, but they were selling me "low end" (for lack of a better description) equipment.
I'll also say this is a smaller operation and I realize a larger company will have more overhead. This guy does his own inspection of the house, his own quoting and with the help of another employee does the install. A larger firm would have more than one person for the job from start to finish. I also realize that a larger company will have more services down the road including future service work if it were necessary. That is something each person needs to resolve when they are looking at this.
I typically would stick with a larger company for this type of work, but I happen to know this guy well and he's done an install for a friend as well as a changeover from an old oil burning water based heating system to a forced warm air system for my cousin. Both parties are very happy to this day.
Bob
Yes--I've had some comparable pricing done and it's the best I've seen. One other quote was close in total dollars, but they were selling me "low end" (for lack of a better description) equipment.
I'll also say this is a smaller operation and I realize a larger company will have more overhead. This guy does his own inspection of the house, his own quoting and with the help of another employee does the install. A larger firm would have more than one person for the job from start to finish. I also realize that a larger company will have more services down the road including future service work if it were necessary. That is something each person needs to resolve when they are looking at this.
I typically would stick with a larger company for this type of work, but I happen to know this guy well and he's done an install for a friend as well as a changeover from an old oil burning water based heating system to a forced warm air system for my cousin. Both parties are very happy to this day.
Bob
_RaT_
Super Member
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Hi Alan. Here in Norhtern California there are 100 degree days as well. For the most part, we don't have much humidity. My understanding talking with the various HVAC guys in our area is that we definitely size our AC's correctly. You may have a point and having a climate like yours with a different humidty could certainly influence how things are done. My planned home is most likely going to be ICF or insulated concrete form. I will in all likelyhood be undersizing the AC unit. That brings me to the next question. What are the most desireable methods to use with AC only units. That is, are there better ways to duct it, brands of AC only units? Would I be better to have a Heating/AC unit as a back up to radiant floor heating?
I ask as electricity where I am at is quite expensive.
I ask as electricity where I am at is quite expensive.
slowrev
Elite Member
Bob,
If this guy has been in the business a while and seems like he will be for some time, I would give him the business. You are not as likely to get lost in the crowd with a small business as with a large one. I also like to help out the hard working honest "little" guys.
Small one or 2 guy operations tend to do better work as they cannot blame it on not being able to get good help.
If this guy has been in the business a while and seems like he will be for some time, I would give him the business. You are not as likely to get lost in the crowd with a small business as with a large one. I also like to help out the hard working honest "little" guys.
Small one or 2 guy operations tend to do better work as they cannot blame it on not being able to get good help.
thcri
Elite Member
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( So Murph, I plan to use radiant floor heating. I would like to install the air ducts for the AC in the insulated attic along with the air handler. Does that make sense and if you duct it, what is the preferable duct material? The compressor would sit outside of course, what would be the maximum distance the compressor could be from the handler?
Since you turned me on to expert GPS I have shown other folks and they too are amazed. Thanks, Rat... )</font>
Been gone for a while so I will try and answer everyone's question here in this post. Starting with you Rat.
If your putting the wirsbo in the floor then go with the overhead duct system. I am not sure if your in a high humidity area but I recomend that you get an air handler with a DC variable blower and let it run at the slow speed which is about 400 CFM. This way you will circulate air all the time keeping the duct system warm. You could even put a timer on the blower to run 20 minutes out of an hour or something like that. We Won't and I repeat we won't put and attic installation in without the variable blower.
Alan, down south your tonnage per square foot is much greater. You have much higher temperatures. We have lower temperatures with high humidity. If the area you live in has high humidity you do have to watch for oversizing. An air conditioner can not and I repeat can not remove humidity if it isn't running. I get in more trouble around here by oversizing than I do undersizing. As far as building cost, yes Minnesota is way more because of basements, but our construction is so much different than yours also. Windows, Rvalues and ventilation codes. I have relatives in Texas and their house in Texas runs around 180,000. Here in Minnesota that same house built to our codes would run around 500,000.
Bob In Mn, The prices you are are fairly competitive. As far as Lennox. Good product. I am not fond of their furnaces because it is not their furnace. The Lennox pulse had a great name and was what made Lennox famous. However, problems forced Lennox to abandon the furnace. They had no choice but to buy out another line. The air conditioners are as good as any. Again as in buying tractors if you comfortable with the dealer then go for it. Over all Lennox will take good care of you and the product will last. OM me if you have any other questions. I know most of the dealers up there, let me know who your dealing with.
For you guys that asked about Janitrol/Goodman. Great product and very competitive. I was just in the Houston plant for two days. They have become one of the largest manufactures next to Carrier. Impressive. They built the company just like, Dell, Southwest Airlines and yes the Waltons. Great product at a great price. No frills or thrills.
Now if I didn't answer any questions don't feel left out. I had to go through about 10 posts and may have missed some. If you want you can ask here or PM me.
murph
Wow that has to go down as my longest post. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
Since you turned me on to expert GPS I have shown other folks and they too are amazed. Thanks, Rat... )</font>
Been gone for a while so I will try and answer everyone's question here in this post. Starting with you Rat.
If your putting the wirsbo in the floor then go with the overhead duct system. I am not sure if your in a high humidity area but I recomend that you get an air handler with a DC variable blower and let it run at the slow speed which is about 400 CFM. This way you will circulate air all the time keeping the duct system warm. You could even put a timer on the blower to run 20 minutes out of an hour or something like that. We Won't and I repeat we won't put and attic installation in without the variable blower.
Alan, down south your tonnage per square foot is much greater. You have much higher temperatures. We have lower temperatures with high humidity. If the area you live in has high humidity you do have to watch for oversizing. An air conditioner can not and I repeat can not remove humidity if it isn't running. I get in more trouble around here by oversizing than I do undersizing. As far as building cost, yes Minnesota is way more because of basements, but our construction is so much different than yours also. Windows, Rvalues and ventilation codes. I have relatives in Texas and their house in Texas runs around 180,000. Here in Minnesota that same house built to our codes would run around 500,000.
Bob In Mn, The prices you are are fairly competitive. As far as Lennox. Good product. I am not fond of their furnaces because it is not their furnace. The Lennox pulse had a great name and was what made Lennox famous. However, problems forced Lennox to abandon the furnace. They had no choice but to buy out another line. The air conditioners are as good as any. Again as in buying tractors if you comfortable with the dealer then go for it. Over all Lennox will take good care of you and the product will last. OM me if you have any other questions. I know most of the dealers up there, let me know who your dealing with.
For you guys that asked about Janitrol/Goodman. Great product and very competitive. I was just in the Houston plant for two days. They have become one of the largest manufactures next to Carrier. Impressive. They built the company just like, Dell, Southwest Airlines and yes the Waltons. Great product at a great price. No frills or thrills.
Now if I didn't answer any questions don't feel left out. I had to go through about 10 posts and may have missed some. If you want you can ask here or PM me.
murph
Wow that has to go down as my longest post. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
Alan L.
Elite Member
Rat, we have medium humidity here in north Texas. much more than West Texas and the mountain states, much less than Houston. The most humid days are those in the spring in the 80s. When it gets to be 100 degrees, there usually is not much humidity, although more than Arizona or New Mexico.
I can understand the concept of the unit not running long enough, but when you see a unit running constantly and still not cooling down to the desired temp, you want to strangle the guy that decided to put the undersized unit in. I don't strangle, I just insist on a bigger unit up front.
One guy told me the A/C should only be asked to pull the temp down about 20 degrees. So if its 100, then you get it down to 80. Sorry, I'm not comfortable at 80 degrees, or even 75, that is, when I am indoors trying to relax.
I can understand the concept of the unit not running long enough, but when you see a unit running constantly and still not cooling down to the desired temp, you want to strangle the guy that decided to put the undersized unit in. I don't strangle, I just insist on a bigger unit up front.
One guy told me the A/C should only be asked to pull the temp down about 20 degrees. So if its 100, then you get it down to 80. Sorry, I'm not comfortable at 80 degrees, or even 75, that is, when I am indoors trying to relax.
Bird
Rest in Peace
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I'm not comfortable at 80 degrees, or even 75 )</font>
Me, too, Alan. And my wife's even more particular. We keep it at 70 year round and if it varies in either direction more than 2 degrees my wife will complain about it being too hot or too cold. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Me, too, Alan. And my wife's even more particular. We keep it at 70 year round and if it varies in either direction more than 2 degrees my wife will complain about it being too hot or too cold. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
thcri
Elite Member
You guys do have the option of a two stage system. This will give you the power for the high temp days and the humidity removal for the lower temp days. As far as an A/C running constantly, that is ok. A compressor will suck an awful lot of power just in the start up. You can run a compressor for a long time versus starting them up and shutting them down too much. Also a compressor is designed to run more than not. Oil from the compressor runs through the system and a compressor is lubricated much better on a longer run time. I would look into the two stage system.
murph
murph