Central heat/AC..how much $?

[N80]

I built a log cabin from a kit about 3 years ago. I use my tractor to maintain and improve the property and roads around the cabin. It was much harder to build and more expensive than I expected but in the end it cost a lot less than having someone else build it and we've been enjoying the place a great deal so I think it was worth it. It remains a work in progress (the kitchen cabinets are not finished yet, closets aren't finished, etc.)

There are some pics of it in my TBN photo gallery:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/photos/showgallery.php/cat/500/ppuser/22347

The biggest problem is that it has no heat or AC. It is about 1000 sq ft with a great room, one small bath and 2 small bedrooms. Kitchen is in corner of great room. In the winter we get by with a kerosene heater in the great room and an electric/oil radiator in each bedroom and this is manageable but not always cozy. In the summer....we roast. I have a small cheap window unit in one bedroom that does okay. High 90's are normal this time of year.

I've looked at a number of options in terms of additional window units, wood stoves, etc, etc. To get heat and air it all adds up a lot and I'm wondering if I should bite the bullet and have central heat and air installed? This would make the place much more user friendly for guests and more pleasant year round but I have no idea what the cost would be.

We have electricity but no gas lines. Some folks use delivered propane for heat. A heat pump would also be an option.

I would greatly appreciate any advice, experiences and cost estimates for anyone who might know about this sort of thing. It pains me to have this done, because I did everything else myself other than laying the foundation, but I think central heat and air are beyond my skills.

Thanks.

 

[EddieWalker]

Putting in a HVAC system isn't very complicated. Fixing them is!!! Here in Texas you can do just about anything without a license, but HVAC is one of those things that you have to be licensed to buy and install.

My house is also 1,000 square feet. It's two story, so that changes things some because we went with an oversized unit versus two units for the different zones. Two would have been better, but the cost would be allot more.

I have a 2.5 tonne unit. Basic rule of thumb is you double your square footage for the size unit you want and take away all the zero's. For you, I'd guess a 2 tonne unit would be about right.

Price will vary, but you just use the same formula again for ballpark estimates. A two tonne unit should run you around $4,000.

This is very vague guessing, but it should also give you a starting place. Variables to consider that could raise the price are things like ducting. Do you have places for the ducts? Where will the unit be located? Can you drain the condensation from there? Is there a way for the air to return to it? Do you have enough power for it?

What you really need to do is find out who's decent in your area and give them a call. It's always better to talk to as many companies as you can, and it's not always best to go with the cheapest. Research what brands they sell. Some brands are actually low end units manufactured by major companies without any support or minimal warrenties.

I had a brand new Trane unit put into a spec house I built. It was a 3.5 tonne unit that had the compressore go out after 11 months. I had sold the house and the new owners were living there. The guy who put it in was no longer in business and wouldn't answer his phone. I called one of the bigger companies in town, who are also one of the most expensive, and had them come out to repair it. Luckily it was under warrantee and it didn't cost me anything. He said it would have been close to $2,000 otherwise.

Just having to deal with the frustration of tracking down the first guy, who did it cheap, but it didn't last, versus paying a few bucks more and knowing they will be there to fix your system is cheap money. I had them put in my system in my current house and will use them again.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[ultrarunner]

It cost $3200 (Bay Area, CA) in materials 3 years ago to put in a 2 1/2 ton higher end Tempstar HVAC in a 1950's ranch style home with no previous central heat or air. At the time, the house was 1200 square feet and has since doubled to 2200.

The recent heat wave has given it a real test.

The home never went above 78, even when the outside temp reached 115. We did all of the work, over sized ducts (for quiet operation), electrical, plumbing, etc. The only thing we needed an HVAC contractor for was to evacuate the system for the initial refrigerant charge.

The material cost was higher due the energy efficiency of the unit, locating it in the attic, over size ducts, dampers, insulation and because we specified two stage burners with a variable speed blower.

I can't recommend enough the quiet operation of the variable speed blower and the energy savings of the two stage burners. The unit will select from 25,000, 50,000 or 75,000 Btu as needed.

By using a 2 1/2 ton unit we were able to avoid up-grading the existing electrical service. The 2 1/2 ton unit only requires a 30 amp 220 volt disconnect.

 

[CharlieTR]

Last year I paid $3600 for a 3 ton Rhem unit for my 956 sq ft one story.
I wanted bigger for a future expansion to 1500 SF.
I think the 2 ton unit (all I need for 956SF) was quoted at $3200.
I really wanted to do the duct work myself but the dealer said that's the only place he made any money, so I let him do it.
The dealer mentioned at the time that prices were going up becase of new federal regs on energy effeciancy. Last week the guys in the coffee shop were saying that dealers with older units can still be sold if they are currently in the dealer's posession. But I have no idea about the actual timeframes for this new law, I think it was for this year though, but a dealer can get you exact info.

 

[N80]

Great advice guys. This at least gives me an idea of a starting point. The cabin has no duct work or anything. It is on a fairly high crawl space so everything would need to go underneath.

 

[sandman2234]

I would probably consider a two or maybe a two and a half ton heat pump. Find someone that knows HVAC and discuss with them the floorplan and how you should run the ductwork.
I am pretty sure it is 450 sq ft per ton of heat pump. A/c is probably 400 sq. feet.
Have you considered a Thru the wall, wall mounted A/C like they used to put in motels right below the window?

Good luck
David form jax

 

[schmism]

with the pond so close you could do a geothermal heat pump with a simple loop layout on the bottom of the pond. no big trenches to dig or anything.

At least id look at a "simple" heat pump and you could supplement spot heat with electric baseboard heaters.

 

[hilld]

I recently installed a 2.5 T 12 Seer R-410 Heatpump for $1399 +$150 freight +thermostat and wiring + ducting.

At least the indoor/outdoor units were decent price. I purchased them online from this source:

http://store.wspisp.net/all-goods/Search.bok?keyword=Electric Heat Complete

Overall I have been pretty happy to have a name brand (Rheem) system, but had to do wiring, soldering, etc in order to get it to work. Since I am using this in a barn (studio), I don't have any ducting, once I do install that it will be exposed along the ceiling. I reused my old electronic air filter and did some sheet metal work to fabricate the panels between all the components. I did have to purchase a horizontal drainpan and line set to complete the install, if it had been an updraft or downdraft system, the drain pan that came with the unit would have been sufficient. Mine is laying on it's side.

Overall I have less than $2000 in the entire high efficiency system. Also remember as of January of this year, the new minimum standard for HP's is 13 seer, a lot of older high efficiency (in my case 12 seer) is out there and available.

As a rule of thumb, 1T per 500sqft of living space, adjustments need to be made for heat load such as windows, insulation and number of people living in the house.

Hope that helps.

Derek