City boy shopping for first tractor

   / City boy shopping for first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#111  
Thanks gemini5362, I think you did mention not having owned an HST before.

The reason I asked is that so far no one who has owned both types of trannies has recommended that we get a gear shifter. I just want to keep the record straight because gear shift owners seem to be constantly trying to influence me to consider a gear shift tractor. That's not a bad thing, I just want to be clear about the experience of the people making the suggestions.
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor #112  
Geedub
I have both. I have a cub cadet HST I use for mowing and light yard work and I have a Kubota L4400 I use for the real work (just kidding).

I prefer the gear drive kubota for most field and ruff mowing work and the HST for the smaller close to the flower bed work.

I can see from your post you have received the gambit of suggestions as I would have expected but the best advise you got and I can give is You and yours need to drive them both and decide your preference. NO ONE can tell you what will best fit your likes.

Both have there good and bad points and just as you have Chev and Ford owners you will always have HST and Gear owners.

Just my opinion but it is the correct answer :D :D
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#113  
Thanks Jack. The problem is that we won't have both types like you do. Also test driving isn't the same as moving a big pile of dirt or working in the woods or around the pond. The fact is we have to decide based on research.

While technically you have an HST machine I don't think I can count your Cub Cadet for our purposes. For that matter Cindy has a riding mower with a sychro shift, but I'm not going to chose a tractor based on that. The people who have recommended HST to me have stressed that it's best for FEL work and getting around more effectively in tight areas like the woods. I know that gear shift tractors do this work everyday, but if you haven't DONE that work with an HST tractor then you can't compare the two types with any authority.

It's funny how much transmissions have been discussed in this thread. I'm sure it's because I clearly stated that I was definitely choosing and HST.:rolleyes:

Hydrostatic Drive. There is nothing new-fangled about this transmission. It has been around for a long time. Nevertheless, it is among the least understood of all transmission types. It is common for it to be compared with the automatic transmission in an automobile. They are different animals altogether. The only similarity is that they both use oil to transmit power. Tech types describe a hydrostatic transmission as being a variable-displacement hydraulic pump, driving a fixed-displacement hydraulic motor. Now, to the un-initiated, that's a bunch of gobblety-gook. So let's s t r e t c h that explanation out a little bit. Any hydraulic pump's sole purpose in life is to deliver some amount (volume) of fluid to some other device, which in turn moves whatever is attached to that device, causing work to be performed. This can be either through linear motion (as in a hydraulic cylinder), or rotary motion (as in a hydraulic motor). If we want to control how quickly our device moves (or rotates), one way we can do that is to vary the amount of oil that the pump sends to it. If our pump is delivering four gallons a minute, things will happen four times faster than if we only pump one gallon a minute. (Are you with me, so far?) Since we can control our pump's output, we can control the motor's speed. Now, unless we just want to go around in a circle all day long, we've got to figure out how to change directions. No problem. (You knew that, didn't you?) Most hydraulic motors don't care whether they are turned clock-wise or counter-clockwise. (They probably don't even know the difference!) Since a hydrostatic transmission operates in what is called a closed loop system, consisting of the pump and motor units, we simply reverse the direction of flow from the pump, causing the motor to operate in the opposite direction. Oh, by the way, closed loop means that a fixed amount of system oil is trapped, or contained, within the pump/motor circuit. Assume that a certain hydro transmission is of a size that it contains 500 ml of oil within the closed loop. That volume remains constant, never changing regardless of tractor speed or direction. So, for any change that we make in the output volume and/or direction of flow of oil from the pump section, a reaction must occur in the motor section, inducing a corresponding change in motor speed and/or direction. In reality, there is a certain amount of oil that is constantly escaping from and being replenished back into the closed loop section of the transmission. This is because a small amount of oil is allowed to flow all around the various components for lubrication and cooling purposes. The greatest advantage of a hydrostatic transmission is the ability to infinitely vary the ground speed and quickly change directions. It's like having a million speed transmission. If you need a travel speed of 1.200589 MPH, it is available. Another advantage is reliability. This transmission is, by way of design, pretty much self-protecting from operator abuse. Also, on foot pedal controlled transmissions, there is a built in safety factor in that you need only lift your foot from the pedal, to bring the tractor to a controlled stop. The only disadvantage of note is a slight loss of power at the PTO shaft. You must also remember to apply the parking brake should you park the tractor on a slope. Hydrostatic is, by far, the best choice for turf mowing applications or for any tasks that require constant speed and direction changes within a small area.

I have compensated for less power at the PTO by increasing the engine HP that I'm shopping for.

Any more suggestions about transmissions?:D
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor #114  
GeeDub,
not having ever owned or driven an HST, I'm going to leave that part of the thread alone. I'm a neo-luddite and I know it :) (manual tranny, manual windows & locks on my truck - but "shift on the fly" for the 4x4 as well!)

throwing you a bone on the price haggling thing -- when car shopping have you ever noticed that around September the price on "last year's model" comes down significantly? It's still a new vehicle, but magically thousands of dollars come off the sale price. Around January 1, it gets even better - because the dealers have to pay property tax on anything left on their lot as of January 14.
This is how I shop for new trucks - and I still haggle.
Why would buying a new - but technically 2 year old - tractor be any different?
I agree the dealer is offering a good deal, I just suggested you try to make it an even better deal, and if he doesn't want to sweeten the pot any, then go ahead and buy it, but the attempt won't cost you anything but a few words.
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#115  
Thanks Erik. Rest assured that Cindy will not forget to haggle. I think I've gotten some good deals through haggling, but I can't compete with Cindy's negotiating skills.

Her last vehicle purchase was a truck which was also a left over "new" model on the dealer's lot. After Cindy bought the truck our neighbor decided he liked it, so he went to the same dealer, looking for a similar price on the same truck. When he mentioned Cindy's name the saleman got noticeably upset and said that she never should have gotten the truck at that price.:p

Cindy knows how to use every advantage to get the best deal.
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor #116  
since you are talking about a lot of money here I do have a suggestion. Have you looked around at a rental place to see if any of them have hst tractors with front end loaders. You can rent one here for around 125.00 a day. If you rent it on saturday before they close you can use it for the 8 hours on the time meter you pay for and not have to worry about getting it back until monday. That would give you the chance to see how it worked in your particular application for not a lot of money. If you really want to compare rent a HST tractor one weekend and a gear drive the next. That way you could see which you liked better for your application
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#117  
That's a reasonable suggestion gemini5362, but since I'm a novice it still might not give me enough experience to make the best judgement.

Did I mention that I've already decided on an HST?:rolleyes:
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor #118  
I dunno GeeDub - have you thought about maybe getting an HST so it'll be easier to drive?

;)
happy shopping - and good luck!
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#119  
HST? What's that? Heretic Style Tranny?
 
   / City boy shopping for first tractor #120  
Geedub, I was out at the ag expo yesterday and I gotta say the JD4720 is a great looking tractor...just wine to Cindy till she bites the bullet and shells out the big bucks:D
 

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