Cold weather starting

catvet · Sep 18, 2005

Okay so I'm jumping the gun a bit but I was thinking about starting the tractor when it's 30 below. Would it be advantgous to keep say a gallon of fuel in the heated garage and add that to the fuel tank to warm up the diesel which is already in the tank. And to answer your question before it's asked, no the tractor is not going to get to live in the garage for the winter. It does have a block heater which I would also use.

ronjhall · Sep 18, 2005

Make sure you use the recommended amount of Heavy-Duty Diesel Fuel Additive to prevent gelling.
I use Power Service. Which can be purchased at Wally World.
What are you going to wear for protection in temperatures that low? /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

beenthere · Sep 18, 2005

I think there are additives already in the winter diesel that will work for you in the cold weather, as far as fuel goes. Just run it low this fall and fill it with the winter fuel, if you can find out when it is available. There may be some additional tricks with a small amount of gas added, but I would not recommend them for someone else to try. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I've not had trouble starting in -20° with the fuel I buy at the local station. Before this winter, I will check for water in the system, and will add winter diesel when the cold weather comes. I don't have a heater, but at -30°, it would be a good idea.

One thing I added two years ago for 'winter' tractor work, was a snowmobile helmet with dual visor. Really takes the force and bite of that 20 mph, -20° F wind down a notch or two. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif Don't know why it took me so many years to figure that one out. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Deerlope · Sep 18, 2005

Any fuel that you buy in the Northeast is treated unless it is the off-road red stuff, then you have to treat it yourself. All you need to do is plug it in an hour or so before you want to use it and it should start right up. Pre warming the fuel will do no good.

catvet · Sep 18, 2005

Thanks for the feedback. This is my first winter with a Diesel vehicle and you hear stories about how hard they are to start. I expect there will be times when it isn't run for a couple of weeks when it's cold out. Depends how much snow we get.

frank_f15 · Sep 18, 2005

My tratcror is in an unheated garage, i make sure i use fuel that is already treated for cold weather. do not have a block heater, just 10 or 15 sec. on the glow plugs and it fires right up. But i think you might be well advised to make sure u use the heater and mabey a litlle additive,. don't forget to keep yourself protected.

thcri · Sep 18, 2005

For the most part the newer diesels that don't start is because of fuel. Make sure your fuel is treated and the block heater is a must at that temperature. Your diesel may start at that temperature but it will be very hard on it without the block heater. The block heater will warm everything up for you. You will have some hydraulic fluid concerns and may have to warm up the tractor an extra long time. Adding the warm fuel won't help you a bit and will be a waste of your time. Oh yes, make sure you really have some warm clothes at that temp.

murph

trlong · Sep 19, 2005

catvet,

Lots of good advice in the responses.

Last year was my 1st with the J.D.. I did add a little additive to each 5 gallons of diesel during the really cold weather. Not sure if it needed it but, "Twin City Equip." recommended it, saying this is what all our customers use. I've still got the quart bottle. It's probably still 3/4 full.

A few suggestions:

Use of the block heater is a definite a must. I let it heat for at least 1/2 hour (an hour if I can....but then I'd have to get up at 4:30 instead of 5:00 a.m. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif ).

Get a good heavy cold weather extension cord, only as long as you need to get from power to the block heater. No matter how supple the cord, at -30 F it's going to get stiff (as we all do /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif).

The snowmobile helmet is a good idea, especially if you're using a blower. The only problem I have with wearing a helmet is when I'm backing up to use the rear blade...it restricts my peripheral vision.

( What are you going to wear for protection in temperatures that low? )

Get a good set of "Coveralls". I bought "Carhartt" Extreme (the Black 100% Cordura shell...) locally for $50 less than the best on-line price I could find. Agway was having a sale. You know those folks up on the mountains, making snow? That's what they wear all night at sub-zero temp.s /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif. I don't use the hood when I'm clearing snow for the same peripheral vision issue but it's great to have. I'm not trying to promote a specific brand but, I was out at -25 F several times last year and my body never got the slightest chill. Driving the CUT, you don't work the way you would with a walk-behind blower or (dare I say it) shoveling /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif. Also, good warm boots, ofcourse.

The only thing I can't seem to keep warm is my hands. Still can't find a pair of gloves that will do it and everyone was out of the Mil style arctic mits. I need to start looking earlier this year.

Sorry for the longwinded reply but, I think you're getting an idea of how cold it can get up here and frostbite is not nice...been there, don't want to repeat it.

Now, if I just had a heated cab /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif.

Tom

bczoom · Sep 19, 2005

( Use of the block heater is a definite a must. I let it heat for at least 1/2 hour (an hour if I can....but then I'd have to get up at 4:30 instead of 5:00 a.m. )

Tom,

Put your heater on one of those 24 hour household timers. I set mine to come on in the AM as well as an hour before I would be plowing in the PM. It's off on the other hours.

Helmets are nice when blowing but otherwise I use a balaclava with a regular winter hat over that. If you ride other things that require a helmet, I'd recommend one that fits under the helmet. Most ATV/snowmobile places sell them.

Tom - check out gloves made by The North Face. I found they work very well.

Brian

trlong · Sep 19, 2005

Brian,

I thought of the household timer (exterior grade...CUT sits under my deck). Problem is I'd used all mine for all the Christmas lights on the deck /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif. Also, I don't need to run the tractor every day. So, I'd be wasting electricity and the bills are high enough already /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif. I used to have a dedicated exterior outlet, for my van block heater, that I had switched (with a nice little indicator light). I'd start the coffee, let the dogs out in the run, switch on the outlet and by the time I was on my second cup, the van's block was nice and warm. Renovations eliminated my switch. Time to wire a new one, I guess.

Thanks for the tip on the Northface gloves. I'll check them out. I may still need mits as the frostbite I mentioned was my hands and they get cold real fast. Got the frostbite > 25 yr.s ago maintaining a skating rink with a firehose at sub-zero temps and insufficient clothing....my young and stupid days /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Tom

RalphVa · Sep 19, 2005

Used to start diesels in NJ and in VT and was a chemical engineer in my previous life. Engine heater and either diesel fuel additive or up to 1/2 kerosene in the diesel works. Engine heater is needed to start, and additive/kero is needed to keep from having wax gelling in the fuel filter. Only takes about 0.1 to 0.2% additive for it to depress the gel point of the fuel. Just follow the recommendations.

Opening the throttle as much as about 1/2 will help, too. You can throttle back a little bit once started but probably want to idle it as much as 500 rpm higher when it's really cold.

I've started (immediately, with engine heater) at below -20 F and had the fuel gel in the filter stop me (happened twice, until engine heated the fuel filter that is mounted right on the engine on a Benz). Have also had the engine stall when not having the fast idle set.

Ralph

Jagmandave · Sep 19, 2005

Is an hour with the block heater really enough to get the whole thing warm? I thought the right way to use block heaters was to leave them plugged in on a warm engine all night. That way you're only maintaining temp instead of trying to warm all that mass from -30 to + 80 or so.

dicker · Sep 19, 2005

I don't have a block heater on my JD4310 and it starts every time.

I use the glow plugs any time it gets below plus 20 degrees Farenheit. It has started as low as minus 30 Farenheit and it is kept in an unheated garage.

Richard

rockyridgefarm · Sep 19, 2005

use the glow plugs any time it gets below plus 20 degrees Farenheit. 

Not to be picky, but the JD4310 doesn't have glow plugs. That is an air preheater....

escavader · Sep 19, 2005

ALL RIGHT ILL WIND EVERY BODY UP. Up here in Maine the old school farmers cut their diesal with kerosene in the winter.My kubota dealer cut mine in my new tractor,and reccomended 50-50 in extreme temps,never had a problem with my off road and kero. Sounds strange to you warmer climate folks huh? No block heater.kept in cold barn,started fine at -10 with just glow plugs,
ALAN

Egon · Sep 19, 2005

A little farther North where the temps dip a little lower the good old boys just add a little conditioner to the winter grade fuel. They may also plug in the block heater before starting.

Uhh - - 10 ain't cold!

Egon

Skinman · Sep 19, 2005

I have a Yanmar with thermostart. It ignites fuel in the intake to preheat it. Not always enough so I've clamped a heat gun on a sawhorse pointed at air intake. Sucks up the warm air and starts easily. Don't get it too close (18" or so) or you'll melt some paint.

Skinman

Farmwithjunk · Sep 20, 2005

I have heat in my shop. That's where I store all my paint/pesticides/stuff that can't freeze. Heat stays set at 55* unless I'm going to be working there, in which case it gets shoved up to 65*. One tractor spends the winter in the shop. That way there's always one "warm" and ready to roll. If I'm using the shop to work on a project, and the tractor needs to set outside overnight, I plug in a block heater that's timer controlled.

With livestock, I don't have much choice in the matter. SOMETHING has to start every day. (Although in sub-zero weather, I USUALLY feed from the pick-up truck. )

MikePA · Sep 20, 2005

It's kind of interesting, there are seasonal questions on TBN and this is one of them. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

1. If you buy your fuel from a place that sells a a fair amount of diesel, the fuel should already have winter additives in it.
2. If you want to be sure, or if you have diesel you bought in the summer, add a conditioner (anti-gel) like PowerService or cut the fuel with kerosene.

Some invariably chime in that they don't have a block heater and their tractor starts fine at x degrees. By and large, you do not buy a block heater so your tractor starts, you buy one so it starts easier and takes less time to warm up.

trlong · Sep 20, 2005

[At the risk of completely highjacking catvet's thread]

Mike,

I agree...easier starting. However, it is scary how fast my JD 4115 start in the coldest weather. It's not the starting I use the block heater for, it's the cold steel with cold oil that I don't like. I just can't help but believe that it is less wear on the parts to be a little warmer than sub-zero (F) when starting. Also, I don't figure (perhaps incorrectly) that a touch of anti-gel/anti-wetting agent can hurt in a 5 gal. can.

Now, as for those mentioning -10 in Nova Scotia.... -10 C is downright balmy, might need a flannel shirt and long pants /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif (just kidding).

Tom