Concrete Patio Built On Dirt???

   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #41  
Salesman sold you gravel in an area they don't recommend it? Brilliant. Then no deduct to eliminate additional work and materials? Nuts! Finally, they were going on top of grass? What reasoning could they attribute to that? None.

Let's face it. We're all either looking for or trying to be good help. Most companies today have some marginal employees on the roster. You need to talk to the Owner if you haven't already and explain the process thus far from your perspective. They may be a good company, but I'd have real concerns over your experience as you describe it. Didn't read every post. Do you have a signed contract? If so, don't just cut and run. Work out of the contract with a release or work it out with them. Your not the emotional type, so it should be pretty simple.

Also, the part about subgrade gravel trapping water in clay based soil is real unless you elevate the gravel and the slab and let it leech to adjacent lower ground. The topsoil is less concern to me than some of the others given your description. It's a patio with little to no decayable or extraneous material.... once the grass/roots are gone. Won't compress that much more than structural fill if it's already compacted tight now. I poured my sidewalk 4 years ago on well compacted topsoil, few score lines, wire only, no rebar. It won't be cracked 5 years from now either. But it's not an engineered mix either. 4,000 PSI straight, no air. And NO spalling either. Figure that?

HTH
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #42  
Salesman sold you gravel in an area they don't recommend it? Brilliant. Then no deduct to eliminate additional work and materials? Nuts! Finally, they were going on top of grass? What reasoning could they attribute to that? None.

Let's face it. We're all either looking for or trying to be good help. Most companies today have some marginal employees on the roster. You need to talk to the Owner if you haven't already and explain the process thus far from your perspective. They may be a good company, but I'd have real concerns over your experience as you describe it. Didn't read every post. Do you have a signed contract? If so, don't just cut and run. Work out of the contract with a release or work it out with them. Your not the emotional type, so it should be pretty simple.

Also, the part about subgrade gravel trapping water in clay based soil is real unless you elevate the gravel and the slab and let it leech to adjacent lower ground. The topsoil is less concern to me than some of the others given your description. It's a patio with little to no decayable or extraneous material.... once the grass/roots are gone. Won't compress that much more than structural fill if it's already compacted tight now. I poured my sidewalk 4 years ago on well compacted topsoil, few score lines, wire only, no rebar. It won't be cracked 5 years from now either. But it's not an engineered mix either. 4,000 PSI straight, no air. And NO spalling either. Figure that?

HTH
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #43  
Maybe dumb question, building permit and a call to building inspector?
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #44  
Maybe dumb question, building permit and a call to building inspector?
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #45  
Well I am not a contractor but I have poured some concrete exactly like your contractor is proposing. I have poured three different slabs right on top of the lawn. All were 4" thick with no wire or rebar. They were 5000# mix I think. Not sure of the mix but I ordered the strongest mix I could get and also got the fiber glass in it. These are in western NY where it gets pretty cold and were poured on heavy clay soil. One key element of each slab is that they were poured on well drained locations and not in a hole where water could collect and freeze. Worked for me and they were poured as long as twenty years ago with no cracks or other problems. If you have freezing temps you have to keep water from getting under the slab.
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #46  
Well I am not a contractor but I have poured some concrete exactly like your contractor is proposing. I have poured three different slabs right on top of the lawn. All were 4" thick with no wire or rebar. They were 5000# mix I think. Not sure of the mix but I ordered the strongest mix I could get and also got the fiber glass in it. These are in western NY where it gets pretty cold and were poured on heavy clay soil. One key element of each slab is that they were poured on well drained locations and not in a hole where water could collect and freeze. Worked for me and they were poured as long as twenty years ago with no cracks or other problems. If you have freezing temps you have to keep water from getting under the slab.
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #47  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Make sure your gang of hoser masons actually removes ALL the topsoil before they put stone in. Sometimes there is much more than 4"; in spots I have 12-16" in the pasture. )</font>

Happy...NJ has some very rich and deep topsoil in places, friend of mine has a nursery in Hunterdon County and topsoil is just like yours and even deeper in the bottom along the stream. Then you look at my property in the hills of N.E. PA and the topsoil is in the 6" area if you are lucky.
 
   / Concrete Patio Built On Dirt??? #48  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Make sure your gang of hoser masons actually removes ALL the topsoil before they put stone in. Sometimes there is much more than 4"; in spots I have 12-16" in the pasture. )</font>

Happy...NJ has some very rich and deep topsoil in places, friend of mine has a nursery in Hunterdon County and topsoil is just like yours and even deeper in the bottom along the stream. Then you look at my property in the hills of N.E. PA and the topsoil is in the 6" area if you are lucky.
 

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