Contemplating Career Change - small business networking questions

[rox]

Hazmat,

Your post reminds me of my former life at GE before I quit and became an olive farmer.

I think it is a good idea to reinvent yourself, keeps you young and mentally challenged. I will echo what Robert_in_NY mentioned, don't underestimate the people aggravation factor in a home repair/remodeling/handyman business. It sems to me that it would be easier to become a skilled tradesman and work as a subcontractor. You are still self employed and control your own destiny but are one step removed from the customer.

I will also echo want Robert_in_Ny wrote, I love farming and it is really rather odd how we came to become farmers. My husband had a goal to retire back to his country when he was 50. I said you are to young to retire and we will need to find some sort of occupation. We tried out different ideas but never could decide on anything, nothing lit a fire under us. Finally I asked my hsuband, "Okay jsut tell me what you don't want to do (instead of what you want to do- he did not want to continue in his field in France)" he only came up with 2 conditions. #1 He did not want any employees. #2 He didn't want to ahve to deal with customers day in and day out. That was his only 2 conditions. For me I only came up with 2 conditions also. #1 I didn't want a boss #2 I didn/t want any set hours, like open at 8am close at 5pm. So instead of looking at what we wanted to do I looked at what we did not want to do, and came up with agriculture.

So instead of "handyman..." have you written down what you don't want to do? There might be different business opportunities you have not thought of if you can figure out what you don't want. You might have on your I don't want his list, "No overnight travel" But if that is not on your list then there are a whole lot more business opportunties you could look at if you are willing to travel. There are highly specialized trades that travel all over. one poster on this forum worked as an independent contractor for a commercial kitchen equipment company and installed the kitchen equipment in restaurants. He made a ton of moeny doing that, but he was young and missed being home with his family at night. Something like that might be up your alley. Think hard and long about what you don't want and then post that lsit here and see what other ideas we TBNers come up with. Oh another very oddball specialized job are people who paint watertowers. They travel all over the country painting watertowers. You might hate the idea of travel or you might like the idea.

Another idea is to buy an existing business, look for existing businesses for sale. I saw on eBay I think a machine for prodcing seamless gutters, the machine costed $75,000 new and it was practically brand new, and they wanted $25,000. Right there is a low investment opportunity to own a gutter business. Instead of general handman you could specialize in decks and patios for example. Beleive me I am not expert but my gut is telling me that you might enjoy more success and enjoy the business more if you had a particular specialty you wnated to promote and advertise. The engineer in yu might enjoy installing dropped ceilings, basement remodels are big right now,er at least they were before the housing market declined. So tell us what you don't want to do, what you would enjoy the least and see what dieas you get.

Oh one final thought, whatever you do hire an accountant. Even if you think you cna't aford it right away, jsut bite the bullet and figure it int he start up expense. Our olive farm is or 3rd business we ahve owned and honestly you get so involed in yur business that you really will want an accountant to handle the paperwork. I would say an accountant is mroe importat than a lawyer, far more important. And good Lcuk to you I wish you well!

 

[EddieWalker]

Hazmat,

I did just about exactly what you're thinking about doing. I was in the Teamsters, a shop steward and on my way to an easy pension. All I had to do was show up and keep myself from getting too bored. After 13 years of playing games, I quit. My biggest regret was taking so long to quit!!!

I sold my house and moved to Texas. It was never an option to stay in California, as I no longer enjoyed living there. Texas was and is the land of oportunity. I just had to create a few oportunities.

The real secret was being able to buy a very small, old, in need or repair, house for cash. I was debt free and looking for work. At first, there wasn't anything. I fliped a few houses and did OK with them, but those TV shows have really killed that market. Every person that's ever been to Home Depot thinks he can flip a house and make a hundred grand in a month. Luckily, my realtor liked my work and he started giving his clients my name and number to get their homes ready for sale. Same thing with buyers moving into a new home. I also work for other realtors now and have even done some work on their real estate building.

I advertise in the free classifieds paper that comes out every week. Between that, the realtors and clients I've worked for before, I have more work then I can handle. I'm by far not the cheapest out there, but I'm also not the most expensive. When I started out, I was only charging $10 an hour and wasn't getting any calls. But after awhile, it got better and I've been able to increase my rates to the point I'm making more now then I did with the Teamsters in California, and working a third less hours.

I do it all. There are only a few jobs I won't take on. Some things need special licenses, like AC. Others are impossible to do right, like leaky roofs. And of course, some jobs are too big for a small business like mine. Concrete and shingling a house are good examples. If I'm not comfortable guranteeing what I'm going to do, then I won't do it. You have to be willing to turn down jobs, as some are not worth the money.

If I had any bills to pay, I'd probably be stressed out. Since I'm debt free, I can spend a week or even a month working on the land and not stress about not earning anything. I'm not out to make as much money as possible, but to make enough to live off of and to be able to do what I want.

Don't worry about the economy, houseing slump or any other negatives. There is always work out there and people who are depserate to find you. Most of the guys I've come across are lazy, full of it, or just plain incompetent. If you answer your phone and do what you say you will, you'll be somebody that they will remember.

I would rather try something and fail, then to wish I had and live a life that I didn't enjoy. You have one life, it seems like a waste to spend it doing something that doesn't make you happy, or that you enjoy.

Good luck,
Eddie

Since we don't have a business forum yet (hint hint) I'll put this here.

I'm currently employed as an engineer at a large company. I'm having a bit of an early mid-life crisis. I don't enjoy my work. I'm on my second "career" in the company currently working as a six sigma / lean blackbelt in supply chain. formerly worked in engineering design. I worked for a smaller company just out of college & didn't enjoy that all that much either (though it was better than the large company).

Anyway - I'm seriously considering starting a handyman / home improvement / eventual General Contractor business this January. I'm an accomplished amature carpenter / all around handyman and often get requests from friends to help them out. I really enjoy the work, and think I would be successfull at it.

I'm putting together a business plan now. Loosely the plan is to start with smaller projects and progress to remodels and perhaps new construction as experience, demand & appropriate liscense requirements permit.

As part of my planning - I'm doing a bit of networking. I'm putting together a list of questions for my mentors. Looking for a little help. So far the list is 3 pages long, which I suppose is too much. What 1 or few questions would you ask someone if you were considering going into business?

Thanks in advance for the help.

My top 5 would be:

What is your best success?
Worst Failure?
Are you meeting your financial goals?
Does your family support the business?
What would you do different?

 

[dmccarty]

Toadhill, Rox and Eddie's comments made me think of The Journal of Light Construction magazine, Journal Light Construction: Home Page. It is a good magazine for those doing construction with reviews on tools and lots of how to articles. The website has every article they have published. I used the website extensively when we designed and had our house built.

There is a column that is business related in the magazine. It covers billing, marketing, legal issues, etc. It would be a good resource to read. Seems like the magazine is $30-50 a year and the website is another $20-30. They also sell DVDs/CDs with all of the articles.

To start a company I would find a good lawyer and accountant.

Later,
Dan

 

[Toiyabe]

Toiyabe: Up to the point of the 'real estate crash' anyone w/ a hammer who could swing it might have claimed to be a carpenter. That market correction adjusted more than prices. OTOH anyone who knew their trade and was a good businessman weathered the storm. In fact those who did more than new construction did OK. If you were flexible and diverse you could do OK.

Right, but before they go bankrupt the marginal operators get desparate, cut their rates and take jobs they wouldn't have bothered with before. That's a terrible environment to get started in. If you have an established buisness with a good reputation and customer base you can tighten your belt and probably weather the storm. If you are starting out, you don't have much of a chance no matter how good you are.

Wait for the weak ones to get weeded out, and then get into the buisness. That may take a couple of years.

 

[3RRL]

It would be great to have a crystal ball to know exactly when the weak ones will be weeded out. But I'm afraid without that aid, it is impossible to tell, even waiting a couple years. By then, new weak ones will have taken the place of others? So what do you do? Keep waiting?

When I went into business I also had a great job but I had a burning desire to go on my own. I struggled at first, just like most, but I dedicated myself and worked my way through it. It was the best thing I ever did. I was dumb enough not to know when the right time was. As far as I was concerned, the right time was when I wanted to do it. That is key.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

I agree, there are always ups and downs with all business ventures. If you want to do something then commit to it and trust your self. If you start doubting your decision then it will go down hill quick.

 

[hazmat]

Thanks for the additional thoughts.

A couple random responses:

Alan - Hazmat is the name of my family's Boston Whaler. My mother though it was hazardous material with 4 teenagers (2 sets of twins) piloting it.

Dan - I've already subscribed to JLC online - I can search & read all the back issues for the last 20 + years online.

Regarding what I don't like about my current job: - That is really good food for thought. I guess the basis for my discontent is primarily ego related. To be honest & less than humble , I consider myself a smart guy. It frustrates me that I can work at 1/2 throttle and still be "rated" (annual reviews etc.) above most of my peers. Whenever I've come across something that excites me a little and kick it up to full throttle, I am immediately constrained by the inertia of the rest of the company.

A perfect example, my company has spent lots of money training me in this six sigma thing, yet can't seem to find me something to work on that will actually impact the business.

In the 7 years I've worked at my current job, I've never actually interacted with a customer. Kind of makes you lose purpose. Also I don't have any actual interest in the products my company makes. An ephiphany for me was when I was in a workshop with one of our vice presidents. He was describing how much he loved his job (He seemed to genuinely mean it beyond the executive pay scale). I thought, hmmm, even if I wasn't experiencing my current frustrations, would I love my job - no.

What attracts me to the home improvement area is that it has been an interest as long as I can remember - from building a pedal car with my grandfather at a young age. I also see an opportunity to apply my engineering skills to help advance the field. New England seems to be the slowest to adapt to new technologies in the building field. I expect I'd be able to determine where I could apply the new technologies to save the customer money, make for a better product or "greener" process etc. Besides, I'm a tool junkie but isn't that a given on tbn?

Eddie you're my hero

Robert - regarding the "people" aspect. I'm sure everyone has heard the cliche that their business would be great if it wasn't for the customers... I consider myself a people person - I'm comfortable interacting with anyone from the garbage man to the CEO. I was always amazed at how my co-workers were so "star stuck" when the CEO was perchance around - He's just another human being (granted presumably one with good business sense). They would put him on a pedastal a 1/2 step from god.

All of my friends and family are encouraging - they have all had difficulty finding "good" help with their remodel projects.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

I am a people person also and have the same range of friends. The difference is when you work for some homeowners they really do think they own you and will treat you like a slave if you let them.

The best people to work for are the people with the money. Our best customers happen to be friends also. The own their own companies and do very well. They treat us with respect when we do work and we don't take things personally if there is a change. Now the people who treat us the worst usually have no money and the only reason we are at their home is because they applied for lead money thru an organization we do a lot of work for. The worst guy paid $247 for his share of the project. The total project was around $14k. We were brought in to appease this guy as we generally get called in for clean up work when other guys mess up and make the homeowners mad. But no matter what we did or what we said this guy threatened us, treated us like garbage, told us that we worked for him and had to do what he said and not what the contract said, tried to throw my father down the stairs (the inspector is over 300 pounds and stepped in between him), refused to let two of our workers on the job because he couldn't supervise them while trying to keep an eye on us and constantly harassed us verbally as well as the organization that gave him the money.

The best part is, we were never allowed to finish the job as the guy wouldn't let us inside to do the last few things on the contract until we did some extra things he wanted done outside that was going to cost us even more money. So the grant company gave him back his $247 and we walked away. This last year we have had three projects that gave us headaches because the people either thought we made too much money or didn't listen to the inspector and didn't read the contract to know what exactly we were contracted to do.

You can be the best person in the world but in this business all that will do is let people walk on you. Some people seem like the nicest people in the world but as soon as you don't do an extra for them they turn nasty quick. My advice to you if you do pursue this line of work is use a contract. Spell out everything you will do right down to the size nails you will use. Any changes must be spelled out and signed. And never do any extra freebee work because it will come back to bite you eventually. If you have a signed contract spelling out exactly what you are to do then you have a better chance of talking to people if there is a problem. If you do extras that go against the contract then it opens up the contract for interpretation if there is a problem. So make sure everything is spelled out and signed and dated by both parties. It is a lot of paperwork but is worth it if there is a problem and if you do enough work you will run into problems.

The more I think about that one idiot the more I like my vineyard. It makes money and doesn't talk

 

[rox]

Hazmat,
Anther day and you still ahve this idea on your mind. God or you! Actually i was asking you to list things you would not want to do in your next job/New Business although your current frustrations did give us insight. In my old job almost all the 6 Sigma projects were business process related. Reduce cycle times in business processes. Hey there is a mountain of waste in business processes. Reduce the cycle time of a credit approval. Reduce the cycle time of sending the custome back the final complete document package. Reduce defects in document packages sent to customers etc. Oh I am so happy to be growing olives...

 

[EddieWalker]

The best people to work for are the people with the money.

This is an obvious statement, but also one that has allot of problems. I live in an area with allot of money. Oil money is all over, but we're also the medical center of East Texas with three major hospitals. I don't have any idea how many country clubs we have here, but they are all very impressive.

I tend to avoid the high dollar, country club type homes and clients. Money is money, but headaches are usualy not worth it. For whatever reason, those homes tend to be tough to get payment from. They never want to pay what I quote them and we play games. I have a price and I'm not going to leave the house for less.

My very best clients are the poor blacks. I do allot of jobs for them and always seem to give them a little bit extra. It's not that I feel sorry for them, or anybody else, but because they always pay in cash. They don't haggle with me, or get in the way trying to help. It's just the way I like it!!!

Of course, it's not what you do, but doing what you enjoy. My current client asked me if I was working hard the other day when I was building a platform for her AC unit in her attic. It was 103 that day with high humidity and who knows how hot it was in that attic. I was soaked in sweat. My reply to her was no, this isn't work for me. This is fun. I've worked before, but since going out on my own and doing jobs for others, I havent "worked" a single day.

Eddie