Creosote "eating" logs

[Red Horse]

How about it-anyone have any experience with those logs you put in your fireplace..."every 60 burns" and they take care of creosote build up? How about anyone use them in a woodstove? I have a Vermont Castings Defiant in my basement. House has a center chimney, two story with a 10/12 pitch roof so I guess total chimney height is close to 45 ft. Had the flue professionally cleaned by same guy I have used for years.. Also, the stove is 7 years old and this fall I replaced all the gaskets in it. What a difference-I am probably burning half the wood I did last season.

HOWEVER- I've been burning for about 3 weeks and Sat night before I went to bed I opened up damper, and air control to get a "high burn" to clear out any creosote. Well I went outside to check smoke and had about an 18" flame coming from chimney. Immediately closed down air supply and it dyed down. Usually you can expect a creosote buildup by end of season but after 3 weeks?? And I'm burning good seasoned oak!

Appreciate any opinions

 

[CalG]

I used them once.

They worked from what I could tell. There are so many variables.

We need "chimney fire tolerant" chimney construction. I'm thinking 8 inch sewer pipe ;-)

 

[Deere Dude]

I don't know if you have a masonry chimney or what, but I have stainless steel insulated chimney that screws together. I can get the fireplace very hot and being insulated I believe a lot of heat goes up the chimney without cooling off from outside temperatures much. A cool chimney and damp wood seems at least to me to cause excess creosote. I would be a little nervous have fire shoot out the top of a stack that high. It must be burning stuff on the walls of the stack.

I run a brush down ours once a year even when we burn some wet wood that hardly burns along with dry wood. Even then we only get maybe a large coffee can or two full of crinkles and dust.

Are you burning oak or a soft wood that flames up more than desired. It doesn't seem to me that oak should flame up that much, seasoned or not..

I never used those logs but used a powder to sprinkle on the coals that are supposed to do the same thing, I think. But I don't get creosote much anyway so I am getting away from using anything.

 

[CalG]

Just a perspective on creosote build up.

I heat entirely with wood, and have done so for over 30 years here in Vt.
I brush out the flue several times a year.
Last winter season was a bit odd with little "cold". 'Saved a bunch of wood!
but

In brushing the flue this spring, there was no less than a bushel of creosote dislodged.
I had never seen as much. I can only attribute the collection to the frequent muffled fires in the stove due to the warm temps. Global climate change has it's down sides ;-)

 

[oosik]

I had a double wall SS chimney on our wood stove. Straight shot from the stove to the top of the stack - around 12 feet. I burned exclusively well seasoned pine. I faithfully brushed down the chimney every spring - never got more than half a coffee cup full of creosote. Once I tried one of those creosote burning logs - didn't seem to do a dam thing. Of course, since I got less than a cup per year - there wasn't much for it to do anyhow. I burned between 4-5 full chords per year.

 

[fishheadbob]

I'd think that they probably work some but I wouldn't want to have my safety depending on them.
It does not take long to sweep out a chimney. After a while you should have a good handle on when and how often your chimney needs a sweeping. If the O.P. had an 18 inch flame shooting out of the center of his house that is a cause for concern.. Either get a contract with your sweep to get cleaned on a more frequent basis, or invest $100 or so into rods and a brush.

 

[Egon]

The powdered granular seem to work for me. Seems to form a loose scale on the chimney that easily comes off with a little vibration. Keeping the air draft open and burning smaller quantities of wood at a time also seems to help.

 

[coldsteelva]

I used the creosote logs a couple times, but A - they stink to high heaven and B - since they are burning (like a Duraflame) you get as much creosote pushing up and out onto everything as you do drying and falling back into the firebox.

 

[Looking4new]

I have two chimnies. A 6 and a 7 incher. The 7" has the longest run from the basement/cellar. Both of them get swept in the summer and if we get a 'January thaw' they will get swept then, too. I have used the powdered stuff, but I can't say for certain that it does anything other than lighten my wallet.
Since I adopted the annual sweeping system and once every 5 years I get a certified sweep to come in and inspect them, I have had no problems. This year I am still burning last winters' left over wood. I have about 2 cords left from last winter. I added 6.5 cords to that for this winter. My wood room is full! There is 2.5-3 cords outside, too.

 

[Red Horse]

Thx guys for all the comments. Letting the stove cool down and then I'm pulling 3' stack that goes out from top of stove, then 90's into thimble at chimney. See what I can find. Like I said- have a professional come in every year before. I start burning. this guy does it all from basement threading rods up thropugh. only thing I can think of is he got lazy and did not add last link. Like I said this sucker is tall-45'

I also will pick up a Rutland product that Tractor Supply stocks. Unlike logs, this is a powder that you dump on coals and supposedly leaves a dep[osit on creosote that then leads to it flaking off and dropping down to cleanout door-I hope.

sty tuned.

 

[CobyRupert]

How about it-anyone have any experience with those logs you put in your fireplace..."
Had the flue professionally cleaned by same guy I have used for years.. Also, the stove is 7 years old and this fall I replaced all the gaskets in it. What a difference-I am probably burning half the wood I did last season.

HOWEVER- I've been burning for about 3 weeks and Sat night before I went to bed I opened up damper, and air control to get a "high burn" to clear out any creosote. Well I went outside to check smoke and had about an 18" flame coming from chimney. Immediately closed down air supply and it dyed down. Usually you can expect a creosote buildup by end of season but after 3 weeks?? And I'm burning good seasoned oak!

Appreciate any opinions

Can't comment on the those creosote-b-gone logs as I've never used them. I sweep my chimney about three times a season. Once before start of season, once during season (Jan/Feb), and once in late winter/early spring when one tends to (barely) burn cold/oxygen starved fires or smoldering fires you keep going during the day just so you have some embers at night. Or if I notice a change in the normal amount of draft, I know I better clean SOON!

How would getting the chimney cleaned or replacing gaskets reduce your wood consumption by 1/2?

Sounds like you definitely had a "high burn". Getting a chimney fire like that after only 3 weeks of burning seems like a short amount of time for dry wood, especially so if your doing regular "hot burns". Like been said, maybe our sweep didn't clean top section.

Do you have a cap on chimney? I don't (but should). I think this leads to a cooler chimney (more creosote), especially when it rains/snows.

Does anyone know if a regular hot fire (but not so hot the creosote ignites) will "dry" the creosote so that it naturally flakes off?
Or what's is the chemical in those special logs?

 

[Red Horse]

Can't comment on the those creosote-b-gone logs as I've never used them. I sweep my chimney about three times a season. Once before start of season, once during season (Jan/Feb), and once in late winter/early spring when one tends to (barely) burn cold/oxygen starved fires or smoldering fires you keep going during the day just so you have some embers at night. Or if I notice a change in the normal amount of draft, I know I better clean SOON!

How would getting the chimney cleaned or replacing gaskets reduce your wood consumption by 1/2?

In think the new gaskets allowed me to turn air control down and as no air was leaking in, my burn time was extended. Before I did the gasket replacement I would NEVER make it through the night on a load of wood. Now the downside, if say I was burning a load of wood in say 4 hours, I had a much hotter fire I would think-and correspondingly less opportunity for creosote to build up. so sounds like I solved one problem-using a lot of wood-but created another

Sounds like you definitely had a "high burn". Getting a chimney fire like that after only 3 weeks of burning seems like a short amount of time for dry wood, especially so if your doing regular "hot burns". Like been said, maybe our sweep didn't clean top section.

Do you have a cap on chimney? I don't (but should). I think this leads to a cooler chimney (more creosote), especially when it rains/snows.

No cap-but this is a center chimney-not exposed on outside wall-but house is typical "Early American"- like I said 10/12 pitch roof so while 30+ feet of chimney-basement, first and second floors is warm, there is 12' in middle of cold attic, plus the chimney extends 4+' above ridge. Those last 16+ ' allo[/B]w for plenty of cool down.

Does anyone know if a regular hot fire (but not so hot the creosote ignites) will "dry" the creosote so that it naturally flakes off?
Or what's is the chemical in those special logs?

CR see my comments above.

 

[CobyRupert]

I think the new gaskets allowed me to turn air control down and as no air was leaking in, my burn time was extended. Before I did the gasket replacement I would NEVER make it through the night on a load of wood. Now the downside, if say I was burning a load of wood in say 4 hours, I had a much hotter fire I would think-and correspondingly less opportunity for creosote to build up. so sounds like I solved one problem-using a lot of wood-but created another
.

I think you're right. My problem this year is my wood is too dry (and too light). If I put too many pieces in the stove (or what in other years is a normal amount ), and have the stove turned down, it pretty much all heats up to combustion temp at once and want to GO!! If the air is turned down, the stove fire will start "thumping" / "breathing" / "backfiring" for air as it cycles between choking and then spontaneously re-igniting.
With more moist wood, or wood with a larger thermal mass that heats more slowly and burns in a more uniform fashion from bottom (coals) to top.
So the trick I use is to let it burn hot (short time) and use the thermal mass of my chimney and soapstone stove to extend the heat rather than trying to burn slow and steady (and "cold").
And if I do have to turn it down because things are getting too hot, I use the stove pipe damper more to smother/decrease the combustion, rather than trying to starve the fire of inlet air. - It definitely makes a difference if that makes sense.

 

[Red Horse]

Well guys, I took the stove down today. Called my chimney guy-of course no return call. So borrowed a pals cleaning rods and would you believe there was a blockage just about at the top. And instead of guessing, I did some measurements and guessing at the amount of chimney above the ridge, I came up with a distance of 37.5 feet from where thimble is in basement, to chimney cap. Significant dimension? 12 ft. of masonry in cold attic plus about 5' above ridge.

My guess is my "sweep" did NOT put last rod on (he cleans it from basement) and I started the season with less than a clean chimney at top.

Bottom line I will be less concerned about going through the night on a full load of wood and more concerned about running stove hot enough to avoid going through this again.

And I will try that Rutland powder product.

thx again to all for your opinions.

 

[CobyRupert]

I read up on that Rutland powder product. Turns out it's active ingredient is tri-sodium phosphate (TSP). Supposedly you can buy TSP for 1/4 cheaper in the paint prep section of most hardware stores. One user says add a tablespoon (or two) in a spray bottle w/ water and hit your stove with it every once in awhile when you think about it.
I might try this, ...but I won't trust it to replace sweeping! If it doesn't work, so what, I have a cleaning product for other uses.

Trisodium phosphate - Wikipedia

 

[Red Horse]

I read up on that Rutland powder product. Turns out it's active ingredient is tri-sodium phosphate (TSP). Supposedly you can buy TSP for 1/4 cheaper in the paint prep section of most hardware stores. One user says add a tablespoon (or two) in a spray bottle w/ water and hit your stove with it every once in awhile when you think about it.
I might try this, ...but I won't trust it to replace sweeping! If it doesn't work, so what, I have a cleaning product for other uses.

Trisodium phosphate - Wikipedia

Thx CR-don't think I will be spraying it in stove but I think the Rutland peoduct just calls for you to dump the powder on hot coals-so if ijn fact it is a "rebrand" of TSP, sounds good

 

[skipmarcy]

I've been using the Rutland Kwik Shot tubes for probably 15 years or better, I toss the whole tube in the woodstove on a good going fire about once every week or 10 days. The little dab of plastic tube it's in is gone in 30 seconds. I have an airtight stove and an external masonry chimney 16' tall and I run my stove at lower temps a lot so creosote is a problem. The chemical is simply to convert the liquid creosote into fluffy, flaky creosote so your brush will remove more when you brush, which I normally have to do about every 3 to 4 weeks during the season. I usually get about a gallon bucket full of very light & fluffy creosote each time. My firewood is oak, cherry, walnut, elm, hickory cut with the sap down and all seasoned at least 2 years or better and fully dry under tarp. The creosote is strictly from me running the smouldering fires and a cold, masonry chimney but that's the way I like to use my stove and I'm willing to do the maintenance necessary to do so. I know people in this area that can burn all season and never have a lick of creosote problem but you go visit them and it's 110 degrees in their house and 2 or 3 windows open !!

 

[Professor Marvel]

I worked in a hardware store a long time ago that sold CSL logs and I believe the active ingredient was calcium chloride
Sometimes I would throw calcium chloride into my fires. Don't know if it worked but it made pretty colors when it burned

 

[Red Horse]

Well here is an update. I bought a tub of the Rutland powder- I think like 8 bucks in Tractor Supply. Been dumping a tablespoon in a couple times a week in AM when I have a bed of hot coals. This since I first had my problem. A week or so ago I pulled the stove pipe that connects stove to Thimble/ flue. I actually could see the red clay of the flue! Have never seen it so clean!

Will see how much creosote comes out-and if in fact its "powder" as they claim you will get when I take the stove down for cleaning in another month. so far so good.