deep water well advice

[amashinga]

Hi, First the background info:

I have a deep well. 480' with a 1hp submersible on galvanised pipe. I live on top of a high area in the pacific NW. 90% granite and pockets of soil. The water even at that depth has an extremely high iron content and is very hard.

I have a hole somewhere along the pipe. It is an irritation because the pipe is only 12 years old. I need to pull it and replace it.

My questions are, considering how badly the galvanised lasted, should I look at a different solution ?. I have heard of folks using pvc with a nylon rope to support the pump. I have even heard some say that the threaded pvc will take the weight (480 feet, yikes).

Any suggestions ?

Bruce.

 

[CrownHawg]

My well is approximatley 75ft and I use black plastic pipe with a nylon rope to the submersible, works great! 480 foot of pipe will be HEAVY though!! Might look at a good vinyl covered steel cable. Good luck!

 

[Mousefield]

Our pump is down about 140 feet into the well that is 160 ft deep. First year we had to get fixed. It is on a black poly pipe and nylon pull rope. When they pulled it out they had a rig mounted on a pickup truck and rolled the pipe onto it, (big drum). Not sure how thick the poly pipe it but think the diameter is 1 inch.

 

[jonyyuma]

Our pump is down about 140 feet into the well that is 160 ft deep. First year we had to get fixed. It is on a black poly pipe and nylon pull rope. When they pulled it out they had a rig mounted on a pickup truck and rolled the pipe onto it, (big drum). Not sure how thick the poly pipe it but think the diameter is 1 inch.

My well head was down 140 feet too in 170 ft shaft. It was on white pvc 1 in diamenter., with the #10 wiring taped to the pvc. No rope needed. But 480 foot yikes, that will be hard to pull up and scotch and disassemble too.Spike arresters are recommended here, i had one motor fried in the shaft.

 

[gsganzer]

My pump is also set deep at 450'. The pipe is also galvanized. The first year I owned the place, I had a short down the well and had to pull the pump. Like yours, the galvanized pipe was rusted through in several places, so we had to replace several sections. They were replaced with the same thing.

I'm not sure there are any other choices for that deep. hopefully someone else will chime in.

You would think that they could put a sacrificial anode somewhere, so the pipe wouldn't rust. Might we worth checking with a corrosion engineer.

 

[Mousefield]

My pump is also set deep at 450'. The pipe is also galvanized. The first year I owned the place, I had a short down the well and had to pull the pump. Like yours, the galvanized pipe was rusted through in several places, so we had to replace several sections. They were replaced with the same thing.

I'm not sure there are any other choices for that deep. hopefully someone else will chime in.

You would think that they could put a sacrificial anode somewhere, so the pipe wouldn't rust. Might we worth checking with a corrosion engineer.

Just a though, why couldn't you use stainless (aircraft?) steel cable as a pull rope and and then poly pipe. You would need to have a way to pull up the pump, other than by hand, because of the depth. In my earlier post I mentioned the well guys had to roll the poly pipe onto a big roll and I think they had a winch for the pull rope. They did have some roller's and/or pulley's on the rig to help it up.

 

[jinman]

My well is 386' deep with the pump sitting around 320'. My driller used schedule 80 PVC pipe in 20' sections with threaded unions. I don't recall seeing any cable except the electrical cable going to the pump. I suppose the electrical cable could have a cord build into the sheathing, but I never noticed. If my well is ever serviced, they will raise the pump and pipe one section at a time and disconnect at the unions in the reverse order that they were installed.

Down about 10' in my well pipe, the driller put a small hole in the pipe so water sprays out all the time when the pump is running. When the pump shuts off a shrader valve allows air into the top of the pipe and the water level draws down to the level of the hole. That way the pump doesn't have to start against the tank's head pressure since the tank has a checkvalve where the pressure regulator attaches to the inlet pipe.

 

[Kays Supply]

Weight isn't the issue when that deep. The pressure the pump builds to get it to the top is the issue. Roughly 1 psi will push water 2.3'. That would be 209psi to get the water to ground level plus the pressure you want in the house. Roughly 300psi at the pump. Threaded Sch 80 with threaded sch 80 couplings is a common practice in my area. I have seen high pressure poly used. It is pretty scary pulling that much PVC pipe up out of a hole.

 

[Jimbrown]

They make a special PVC pipe just for wells. It comes in 25 foot sections and has brass connectors at both ends. AAny half decent drill/well guy should have it or be able to get. I have 125 ft of it in my well.

 

[Kays Supply]

If you have ever heard several hundred feet of pipe and pump go down a well, threaded pipe is the last option for me. I found this product with some search time. HDPE PE 4710 /DR7. It is rated for 333psi. If I were putting a pump down that far, it would be high on the list. Just some food for thought.

Oh! Brass fittings double clamped for sure.

 

[thatguy]

I had mine pulled last year after a backflow valve quick working - the well is 340' and the pump was pretty close to that it seemed.. Mine was on black plastic pipe all the way from the pitless adapter down..

Brian

 

[Carl_NH]

We have a well 410' feet with a 1.5 HP Goulds 10GS15 set at 375' on 1" plastic pipe. From 10' to 410' was drilled thru granite - had to have it hydrofraced to get 10 GPM.

But the point is you can hang a pump at 400' on plastic poly pipe (ours has been in 15 yrs) with no problem other than replacing the pump one time. It is thick wall poly 200 PSI in our well and the static level ranges from 50-300' so the 200 PSI works fine. You can find good prices and specs for pipe, pumps and wire here Poly Well Pipe

You will see the pressure for 300' @ 50PSI as others have mentioned, but this is based on the static water level - if your static level when pumping is 300' or less you would be fine with plastic pipe.

I would put two or three torque arrestors on the pipe above the pump every 60-80' to elimnate chafing the wire but set them loose 5-5.5". I have used the white poly wire protectors before but the pipe pullers don't like these as they jam up the puller jaws and the rubber arrestors pull right thru.

 

[boomer1025]

My well is 630' deep the pump is down around 420' on black plastic poly pipe with no rope. Wouldn't use any kind of rope, if it ever breaks or rots off. Your going to have one very difficult time pulling the pump, if you can pull it. The rope will act as a stopper in the casing.

 

[skipmarcy]

My driller installed a stainless Goulds 1 hp pump down 320' in my well, used sch 120 threaded pvc and nothing else but the 10 ga wires for the pump. His healthy son held all of that up by hand while they swapped over to the casing cap/clamp - mine is not pitless. If it ever needs to come out of there for any reason I believe I will call him to come do it, I'm too old to be messing with all that anymore. I believe too it matters how close to the surface your water level is in the casing as to how easy it is to pump the water up & to the tank, mine comes to about 40' of the surface. I forget how much water per foot there is in a 6" casing but I know I have a decent resevoir with about 286' of water in it.

 

[Carl_NH]

To the original poster - if your well is 480' deep and you only have a 1 HP pump it would be my assessment that your static pumping level should be in the 200-350' range on average as most 1 HP units work in wells static level down to about 400' maximum.

For instance the Goulds 7GS10 (7GPM 1 HP) pumps 3.5 GPM 50PSI at 340' static water level then the 5GS10 (5GPM 1 HP) pumps 4 GPM at 400' - this is due to more pump stages in the 5 GPM vs the 7 GPM.

Bottom line, your pipe selection depends on the static water level in your well. If its 300-350 static level most of the time you are fine with black plastic poly pipe. If your static water level is cosistently between 350-450' then this will exceed the pressure rating for the 200PSI poly pipe so alternates (PVC or other is needed).

Carl

 

[Jimbrown]

If you have ever heard several hundred feet of pipe and pump go down a well, threaded pipe is the last option for me. I found this product with some search time. HDPE PE 4710 /DR7. It is rated for 333psi. If I were putting a pump down that far, it would be high on the list. Just some food for thought.

Oh! Brass fittings double clamped for sure.

Why in the heck would you clamp threaded fittings that are imbedded into the pipe? We are taliking about PVC there are no clamps.

This is not black flexable pipe but pure ridged pvc.

 

[Kays Supply]

I am saying, I would prefer a poly pipe with insert {clamped} fittings over a threaded ridgid pipe that could be dropped while unthreading or break at a thread.

 

[turnkey4099]

Weight isn't the issue when that deep. The pressure the pump builds to get it to the top is the issue. Roughly 1 psi will push water 2.3'. That would be 209psi to get the water to ground level plus the pressure you want in the house. Roughly 300psi at the pump. Threaded Sch 80 with threaded sch 80 couplings is a common practice in my area. I have seen high pressure poly used. It is pretty scary pulling that much PVC pipe up out of a hole.

Isn't the pressure the pump sees measured from the static water level? Plus, of course any additional distance from static to the tank location.

Harry K

 

[turnkey4099]

My well is 386' deep with the pump sitting around 320'. My driller used schedule 80 PVC pipe in 20' sections with threaded unions. I don't recall seeing any cable except the electrical cable going to the pump. I suppose the electrical cable could have a cord build into the sheathing, but I never noticed. If my well is ever serviced, they will raise the pump and pipe one section at a time and disconnect at the unions in the reverse order that they were installed.

Down about 10' in my well pipe, the driller put a small hole in the pipe so water sprays out all the time when the pump is running. When the pump shuts off a shrader valve allows air into the top of the pipe and the water level draws down to the level of the hole. That way the pump doesn't have to start against the tank's head pressure since the tank has a checkvalve where the pressure regulator attaches to the inlet pipe.

??? what happens to that air in the pipe when the pump starts? I must be missing something but it seems it wouild end up in the pressure tank.

Harry K

 

[robbyr]

i dont remember how deep my father in laws well is, probably 180-200 feet. he used threaded pvc. never heard of putting a rope in there. In the summer of 2000 the pump went out. This was the second time in about ten years, so he did away with a pump. Instead, also ran half inch pvc down beside the water pipe, put an el on it and inserted three or four feet inside the well pipe. Works off air from the compressor which pumps into 1000 gallon cement tank (looks like septic tank sitting on top of the ground) with a float switch. Then there is a jet pump between this tank and pressure tank. No more pump problems.