Deere announces layoffs

RoyJackson · Jun 18, 2002

"Yet we buy them with Yanmar engines... Curious... "

I know it sounds contradictory.

But the Japanese do make a quality product. And, as you know, there's a fair amount of Japanese manufacturing in the US (Honda, especially).

The Mexican made product just isn't up to par. It may be in several years...but currently, it's not there.

However, there are other issues as well...

With increases in productivity, the need for semi-skilled employees drops. With the much lower pay rates in other countries, work may be and has been moved out of the country (although some countries subsidize some industries, as the US does with sugar, for example).

However, the people whose jobs are gone are still here. They may not be employed for quite a while, resulting in a dependence on the government (unemployment). Or they're under employed... All of which can, and has resulted in societal problems. Now, those problems are going to have to happen somewhat. There are just more people then good paying jobs (especially for folks with less education). Well, if those problems are going to happen somewhere, we should do our best to ensure it happens elsewhere.

Either way, we end up with more tax burden on fewer people. Now, can the US Government fix this?...of course not...with one caveat: The Federal Government is supposed to be paid for by tariffs, not taxes. I would like to see that happen (as it was before WW II). For the future of this country...

I also think immigrants should e required to have a solid comprehension of English, both written and orally. Canada requires you to have a job prior to immigration (my step daughter lives in Montreal). I think we should adapt that in this country.
We're seeing a resurgence of the Right Wing in Europe. I expect this trend to continue for quite some time.

I hope this doesn't sound racist..it's not meant to be. Being somewhat cynical, I see a "Solyent Green" in this country's future rather then a "Star Trek" one.

This is a very complex problem. I don't think TBN has enough bandwidth for the posts that could explain all the scenarios that could be foreseen as well as potential (maybe probable) problems that result from NAFTA as well as the possible advantages.
So, I'm going to end this post.

Hillbilly · Jun 18, 2002

Richard,
You are going to have to knock some heads together out there.

Gary_in_Indiana · Jun 18, 2002

"The Mexican made product just isn't up to par. It may be in several years...but currently, it's not there"

I know I'm dating myself here, but as a kid in the late fifties and sixties, I remember the phrase "Made in Japan" being clearly and exclusively associated with inferior materials, poor engineering and shoddy workmanship (although I doubt I thought in exactly those terms back then).

Today I think most people agree the opposite is true when a Japanese product is considered. When I look at Honda, Toyota or Nissan in vehicles and Sony, Mitsubishi or Nakamichi electronics I believe I'm looking at a high quality, well designed and well built product.

Is it possible Mexico, China and India are the Japans of the future? Just a thought...

Inspector507 · Jun 18, 2002

Roy,
. I know this will be controversial, but unions didn't help either.

How true that is.

frank_f15 · Jun 18, 2002

ON THIS VERY SITE , i hear guys complaining of having to wait for their tractors, so i don't think it is a matter of not making such a good product and not selling enouh as a matter of lets move our operation to a place where we can get CHEAPER labor make more money and let the customer be dammed, let him wait for his mexican made all american john deere. this is not strictly a deere option, all man. are doing this. but i wonder when they will realize that the unit they are having made by cheap labor(doing away with good paying jobs) will not be in the reach of most people! for sure most mexican, laborer's are not in the market for a shinny new jd 4110. just a sore spot with me.

RoyJackson · Jun 18, 2002

"Is it possible Mexico, China and India are the Japans of the future?"

I'm not sure about India. They are smart people... Assuming India and Pakistan don't nuke each other, they may go a long way.
Mexico? I don't think so...I believe they'll be a source of cheap labor mostly. If the manufacturing processes are tightly controlled, eventually they'll make a better product. But I think Mexico has a very long ways to go...

China is our biggest threat. I think the leadership there is very focused in improving their manufacturing base. I think they'll always have some form of slave labor (prisoners). I also think they'll always be a totalitarian dictatorship. It's a huge potential market in China, however. But I think they'll be very protective of their industries...that is, no free trade (lip service maybe).
This is a true story, but I'm pulling it out of my memory (still got the article though...it was in Quality magazine many years ago):
There were numerous quality issues in a plant that manufactured consumer appliances. The Chinese government gave the company many warnings about improving their product. Finally, a group from the government went to the plant. They took the Plant Manager, Production Manager and Quality Manager outside the plant and shot them all!
Now that, my friends, is good Quality Control!!!!

cowboydoc · Jun 18, 2002

Well said on all accounts Roy.

Hillbilly,
I sure would like to knock their heads together for sure. Really makes me mad these company's don't just stay in the US. Makes me even madder that the [censored] govt. keeps driving business overseas with too high of taxes as well.

wroughtn_harv · Jun 18, 2002

Just as a point of reference I'd have to say I generally disagree with the perspectives on this subject previously expressed.

But I'm hoping to replace my 1997 Chevrolet 3500HD that I've had since new. We've had some great times, won a national contest for truck of the year, and kicked more local and import butt on the highway than we'll admit to.

But she was made in Mexico. Her replacement from GM, the forty five hundred, is made in the states. Funny how that works.

As ya'll complain about the exporting of jobs please consider the example of Harley Davidson versus Honda.

The reason that Harley hasn't left isn't a quality issue. I don't know anyone that will say the Harley is a higher quality bike than the Honda. I think most folks will agree the reason folks buy Harleys with their price is because the market will bear it. They are willing to pay the premium. They have a loyal customer base.

The reason these other companys are leaving is because they don't have the customers with the loyalty to pay the price difference. And so to be competitive they have to cut their cost and labor is a substantial cost.

If you're serious about your complaint vote with your check book. Boycott Walmart, Tractor Supply, Home Depot, and Lowes. They all fill the low price niche with stuff from the cheapest source no matter where in the world that is.

bgott · Jun 19, 2002

I have a friend whom was upgrading his stroker panhead with Evo rods. He told me he was using parts from a Japanese Harley. I told him he was full of it, Harleys are made in the USA. He showed me the castings from the wrecked engine he was pulling the rods out of. Every casting had "Japan" cast into it.

Gary_in_Indiana · Jun 19, 2002

"I don't know anyone that will say the Harley is a higher quality bike than the Honda."

I rode every big bike around when I was first looking for a road bike. The Honda was, by far, the quietest, smoothest riding, most comfortable and most reliable I found. Ever since then I go ride anything new that comes out and I've yet to see a reason to buy anything besides the big Honda (from Marysville, OH, by the way).

Here's something to consider. Have you ever noticed that all of the 'independent' motorcycle shops around specialize in Harleys? There's a good reason for that, according to the owner of the Harley shop across the road from my business. He had come from a multi-line franchised dealership. He told me if he tried to be a Goldwing specialty shop he'd starve even if he had all the repair business in this half of the state. He said Harleys are the ones that need all the attention.