Diesel pickup or light duty van? Is it cost effective over gas?

[dmccarty]

You might pay more for a diesel up front but you should get the money back when you sell. When I sold my 1995 Chevy diesel it got more from the dealer because of the oil burner. The difference between the diesel truck and a K2500 gasser was close to what I paid new for the oil burner.

So I was out the use of 3K for 7 years but in the meantime I got a roughly 5mpg better milage and a heavy duty truck. Then I got my 3K back when I traded in for the Ford.

Diesel back then was generally cheaper then gas. Diesel for a good 6 months seems to have been more expensive than gas but recently gas has taken the lead at the 89/92 octane levels.

Later,
Dan

 

[Z-Michigan]

Hey Z. What kind of mileage are you getting in your Dodge?

My buddy needed a truck to tow his boat, and while a 1/2 ton probably would have done the job he bought an 06 3/4T Dodge, 4WD, Quad Cab Diesel auto trans. On the highway with only 1000 miles on the clock the trip computer was calling out 21 MPG. Not sure if the computer is 100% accurate but no reason to doubt it.

The diesel option was very clearly called out as right around $5000. Don't know about the 07's. During our really cold snap here in February he had no issues with the ULSD gellling like some places. I had no problem in my Kubota either.

It was a pricey truck to be sure compared to a 1/2T gasser, but 4WD Hemi's get about 13 MPG - maybe 15? Still, he won't see payback for a long time, but it'll light the wheels up no problem!

We have practically the same setup; we got it because a gooseneck horse trailer can't be towed safely with a 1/2 ton, and once you go to HD you might as well get the diesel.

The bad news: we don't get quite what your buddy may be getting. We can see 18-19mpg on the highway at 70-75mph with no trailer or load. Around town we see 14-15mpg. Good news is we still get 13-15mpg when towing our 3h slant, which is 5000lbs empty and sticks 2 feet above the cab, even when on the highway at 70mph. A gasser would be 10mpg or less pulling the same trailer.

We have had no problems at all with ULSD or with fuel gelling here in Michigan, and both our vehicles live outside for now. They do run a bit rough if you start them at -10 though!

 

[George2615]

I'll throw in my two cents.
I have an 05 3/4 ton 4x4 extended cab Diesel. Traded in an 02 1/2 ton 4x4 ext.cab gas.
1) Diesel truck initial cost is more over a gas truck. (about $5500 more).
2) Maintenace cost is more than a gas truck.
3) Mileage is 4-5 MPG better with the diesel.
4) Towing MPG is much better with the diesel. (my gas truck got 15.5 MPG empty and 7 MPG towing, diesel gets 19.5 empty and 14.5 towing the same load).
5) Resale value of a diesel is higher.
6) Longevity of diesel over gas engine is longer.
7) Diesel fuel costs more than gas (at least it does in my area, about 10 cents more per gallon).
8) Diesels have greater towing capacity.

If I were driving 800 mi. per week with my gas truck I would use 51.61 gallons of gas at 15.5 MPG. The diesel at 19.5 MPG would only use 41.02 gallons. That's a little over ten gallons a week saved or roughly 520 gallons a year.

Gas at 2.65 a gal using 51.61 gal. would cost me $136.76. Diesel at 2.75 a gal using 41.02 gal would cost me $112.80 so with my 1 truck senario I'd save just under $24.00 a week. Multiply that by a 3 truck similar senario it would be just under $72.00 a week saved.

There are many pros and cons whether to buy a gas or diesel and many good responses here. You'd probably need a CPA to figure out what would be best for you in the long run.
George

 

[RalphVa]

Coffeman,

George2615 gave you some pretty good information.

I've a small pickup that get 27 mpg and don't plan to get another until they come out with either a good hybrid one or diesel with stick shift, just because I believe in reducing fuel use for the environment and to save some for the next generation. What they ought to come out with for vans is a hybrid system with plug-in capability and solar cells on its roof. Don't hold your breath waiting for it.

Some other things to think about is that they're supposedly going to require biodiesel to be blended in by 2008? Heard this on the Farm Report. This blend (starting at 5%) will likely go up and may bring the price down. Also, they raised the tax on diesel a only a few years ago just to make the truckers pay a bit more for road maintenance. With environmental pressures, this tax just might be removed. So, the price of diesel relative to regular gas could come back to more even par where it was for years. In Europe, diesel is about 1/3 the price of gas because of far less tax relative to gas. They usually hit diesels with a first time purchase price though.

One of my other vehicles is a diesel sedan with 201,000 miles and 24 years on it. Only reason I'm hanging onto it so long is I haven't been able to replace it with a stick shift for these 24 years. There is no question that it is FAR more economical than its gas cousin made back in 1983. There was about a 50% fuel economy difference then between gas and diesel engines. Now, with computerization and fuel injection on gas, that difference is only about 30% on a well-designed gas vs. well-designed diesel engine. If you do the maintenance (oil and fuel filter changes at least) yourself, I'd say the maintenance is less on a diesel. It has no ignition system. The glow plugs lasted until last year on it. The fuel injection has never been touched. Only had to put an additive in the fuel twice in its life to fix a ping at constant speed.

Ralph

 

[jcmseven]

I am going to confess what many of us are unlikely to do. I own a diesel. I like it. I sounds purty. I like the smell. It is tough and has lots of torque to pull over buildings and things like that. It will run 500,000 miles, which is much longer than I will own my truck, and likely much longer than the truck will exist. It takes a lot of oil and fuel filters and air filters and is easy to maintain. I like buying my oil in the gallon containers. It makes me feel tough too. I like telling people who ask why I have a diesel, "Well, you know I have to pull my tractor" (which by the way with trailer only weighes about 7000#--much under the limit of most 1/2 ton pickups). My confession is that I cannot, nor likely ever will, be able to justify my diesel truck purchase based on the numbers, and I doubt our original poster will be either. But, that is not the reason I have a diesel. I have a diesel because I enjoy having one, even though it has paid nothing over the V10 250 I had before. Will I buy another? Absolutely--but for our poster--go gas.

John M

 

[Asymtave]

Ralph,

You could do what I did: Buy a 1981 VW Diesel Pickup. I bought it because I always thought they were cool, plus I wanted a cheap way to get into a diesel to learn on. Of course it has no towing capacity, but it does get 50 MPG at 60 MPH. About 43 MPG at 70 MPH.

It has real leaf springs, though it's unibody, and is rated for 1,500 lb payload capacity. It's good for running around and doing errrands, and hauling just about anything that will fit in the bed.

They're getting much higher prices these days, though. I have one of the very few rust free ones out there.

 

[RalphVa]

Yeah, the ideal is a front wheel drive, stick shift diesel pickup with jump seats in back (NOT 4 doors), tachometer, power door locks, alloy wheels, electric windows and moon roof. About a 2 liter turbo diesel would be great. Think the 1 or 2 series Bimmers (not brought over here) or A series MBs (not brought over here) have this size engine that produces 130 hp. Real rubber burner on the pavement.

My favorite pickup was my 1984 Dodge Rampage. Drove like a sports car, carried the same amount of stuff as my Ranger did (slightly less than the Tacoma) and even could carry 6 grocery sacks behind the seats (unlike the Ranger: NONE would fit, but less than what we can put in the extend cab of the Tacoma). The Dodge's main problems: rust (hole in floor) and sorry cam shaft oil seals and head gasket.

Ralph

 

[cp1969]

It looks like we will soon (2010) be able to buy a diesel pickup without having to buy a 3/4 or 1 ton:

Turbo Diesel

However, the market for diesel pickups could very well be dead by then. The EPA and the oil companies are doing their best to make that happen. There is far more anti-diesel sentiment than there used to be; most of the posters in this thread are recommending buying a gas truck, not a diesel.

 

[KICK]

I'll throw in my two cents.
I have an 05 3/4 ton 4x4 extended cab Diesel. Traded in an 02 1/2 ton 4x4 ext.cab gas.
1) Diesel truck initial cost is more over a gas truck. (about $5500 more).
2) Maintenace cost is more than a gas truck.
3) Mileage is 4-5 MPG better with the diesel.
4) Towing MPG is much better with the diesel. (my gas truck got 15.5 MPG empty and 7 MPG towing, diesel gets 19.5 empty and 14.5 towing the same load).
5) Resale value of a diesel is higher.
6) Longevity of diesel over gas engine is longer.
7) Diesel fuel costs more than gas (at least it does in my area, about 10 cents more per gallon).
8) Diesels have greater towing capacity.

Multiply that by a 3 truck similar senario it would be just under $72.00 a week saved.

there is alot of truth in that statement.

I believe one factor was left out. Repair costs.

was a time when a diesel engine was simple and reliable. not true anymore.

addition of electronics, variable geometry turbo's, Exhaust gas recirculation, aftertreatment, intercoolers have made that type of engine much more expensive to repair if it has a failure and also potentially less reliable.

and it arent that easy finding someone who can work on it or is willing to.

 

[Big_Charlie]

It looks like we will soon (2010) be able to buy a diesel pickup without having to buy a 3/4 or 1 ton:

Turbo Diesel

However, the market for diesel pickups could very well be dead by then. The EPA and the oil companies are doing their best to make that happen. There is far more anti-diesel sentiment than there used to be; most of the posters in this thread are recommending buying a gas truck, not a diesel.

I don't have a link to back it up, but I just heard on TV this weekend that Ford is going to be releasing an F150 with a Land Rover diesel engine in it soon - 4 cylinder I think. And Chevy had a 1500 with a turbo diesel for a while back in the 1990's - you see them on eBay for sale every once in a while. I don't know the physical dimensions, but it seems to me that if they wanted to, GM could shoehorn a Duramax between the frame rails of their 1500 pickups again.

And for the business equation, don't forget the $26,000 tax deduction you can take on a vehicle over 6000lbs GVWR. Your van might get there, but most 1/2 ton pickups aren't heavy enough. You have to go to a full size SUV to pack on enough sheet metal to make it up past 6000lbs in a half ton chassis. My Tahoe is only just a little over 6000lbs. That's another reason I'm looking at a 3/4 ton truck these days, I gotta' use the IRS rules against them as much as I can!