Differences in Series,ie.,20, 25, etc. Logic & Erroneous Info

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Yes, I had a turbo'd 2800H 2012 model as my first branson and I didn't notice the turbo too much but it is just a cool factor I suppose. Unless you just want one, if you're not at higher 3k+ altitude, it isn't worth it. But I do know that generally the turbo makes the engine burn cleaner (less PM) when spooled up, so perhaps it might help keep the DPF cleaner for longer? Purely speculation based on experience with 5.9 cummins motors I've tested with VGT turbos that were fully adjustable on the fly as far as boost goes. No boost under load will always Haze PM.

I am a long time Bosch VE rotary injection pump rebuilder, and Cummins Engine enthusiast for pre 1993 Dodge pickup trucks. Being that Branson/Kukje engines are VE pumped aka Mechanical, there is really no other modern diesel that interests me in compact tractors. I have little to no interest in Common rail / CRD engines, and the like.

The 25 series tractors are simple and well built, with a couple quirks like that front axle breather, mine leaked once when I unknowingly parked it on a side hill on the far end of my property. They are my favorite model for that size vs. all the other mainstay brands that I've tested and operated, and I also like the current 00/10 series. Little brutes for their size. A 25 series paired with the new BL200 loader can't really be beat in my opinion.

Pape, After the change to Cummins ownership, are they still as good as they use to be. In this case, I'm asking in the context of powering Branson tractors.
John

 

[PapeCAT]

I don't have any real world reliability data at all. So not sure how I can objectively answer that one. But the good service they've provided in Branson Tractors should speak volumes. The engines are never a point of contention or complaint ridden. I would imagine, however, that when Cummins got their hands on the engines and went re-engineered them, they would have to be up to some standard for them to stamp their name on them. These engines are in a multitude of equipment, badged as both cummins and Kukje.

And FYI, Kukje always made the engines for the Branson Tractors, the Cummins acquisition of Onan came right around the same time Kukje / Branson started importing to the USA. The doc linked previously stated 2004.

I might be reading your question wrong, but are you asking if the Kukje "A" series engines as bullet proof as the pre 2004 Onan engines? (these weren't ever in any branson/kukje equipment)

 

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I guess what I'm trying to ask in a clumsy way, is are they still Cummins. The one known for quality and run forever, or, has the acquisition seen shortcuts taken ? When you buy Branson is it safe to say you're buying a "Cummins" engine ? Or, are you getting a S. Korean look alike that is perhaps Cummins in name only, b/c since the acquistion, things have changed after relocating production ?

John
PS: thanks for your effort on this !!

 

[ptsg]

Here in Portugal there are a bunch of 00 series and 20 series with over 2500 hours on the clock without any problems at all. And the owner are really happy with the tractors.

I have to say that the tractors over here are pushed really hard. We use chains on our brush cutters as it holds way better against rocks and shreads heavy stuff better than blades, however it will eat a lot of HP and the shock of hitting the rocks and heavy stuff is directly transmitted to the tractor. Even though we use PTO shafts with the clutch or with a shear bolt.

The 00 series are mostly used by old people that have been using those big old tractors for the entire life and they still think that a small tractor needs to do a big tractor's job. So they are really hard on them and they seem to hold just fine.

 

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ptsg, that's encouraging to hear. I must admit, after I started the thread in asking Branson Owners what's so great about their tractors, I can now better understand why they chose Branson.

I think what holds them back in market share is the infrastructure of their dealer network, here in the US. America is a big place, and buyers are use to having dealers within 30 minutes of their location. The closest Branson dealer to me is about an hour away. The next closest 2 1/2 hrs. There's only about 5 in the entire state of PA, which is a large state. PA has a large agricultural base, ranging from cows to apples. But still, very little Branson dealership presence.

In contrast, there are 4 Kioti dealers within 25 miles of me. And Kubota has many large dealers close by. JD, same way.

The one thing I've gotten out of all of this is Branson means "Quality". I'm not as confident about "Service". But, understandably, if there are NO issues with your tractor, your need for Dealer services decreases dramatically. If and when I decide to buy a tractor, Branson will be my first choice, putting aside the subject of cost. Which I understand is very reasonable for the Branson units.

 

[PapeCAT]

I guess what I'm trying to ask in a clumsy way, is are they still Cummins. The one known for quality and run forever, or, has the acquisition seen shortcuts taken ? When you buy Branson is it safe to say you're buying a "Cummins" engine ? Or, are you getting a S. Korean look alike that is perhaps Cummins in name only, b/c since the acquistion, things have changed after relocating production ?

John
PS: thanks for your effort on this !!

I think they are bullet proof just based off of a subjective litmus test of what you hear online on this forum alone. And cummins manufactures their engines globally, always have. 30 years ago, The larger cummins "B series" used to have head and block castings from Brazil, but now manufacturing is 100% chinese. I've purchased a brand new Chinese made Cummins 12V head and it is was a wonderful piece. Lesson here is that Cummins as a company has a proven track record of successfully moving manufacturing facilities to ever corner of the world without compromise. I'd say the same applies to these cummins "A series" engines made by Kukje. It may be the case that, the tooling for the castings etc. was shipped to S. Korea, so basically the engines haven't changed. We are really getting into the minutia here, and speculating wildly but the only thing I have more to say is that I personally think that these engines for many reasons are best in the industry. How many other mechanical indirect injection engines can pass tier 4 with just a bolt on stand alone passive DPF? In order to do so these engines need to be efficient and clean burning at the core. SCR, and CRD are technologies best avoided if possible, IMO.

 

[Texasmark]

Ford for one, has a low profile version of some of their tractors The model number would be like 1234 vs a 1234 SU for special use. The 25 Branson could be a 20 series with power and hydraulic capabilities like a 30 series. My Ford 3910 is such a beast. It's built on the old Cat I 3000 frame (upgraded) but is outfitted with power and hydraulics to do Cat II or Cat I tasks.